Engine is replaced/blown - F-Type R - Oil STARVATION!
#21
In looking at all of the OPs previous threads, including those on dropping down 2 gears at a high rpm creating the smoke problem and later drag racing it; I am sure they probably had nothing to do with its flurry of issues.
Sounds like those those were some very hard driven miles. It’s no wonder why he has tried selling it here on the forum on 4 different occasions. I feel sorry for the next guy that ends up with that car.
Sounds like those those were some very hard driven miles. It’s no wonder why he has tried selling it here on the forum on 4 different occasions. I feel sorry for the next guy that ends up with that car.
The smoke from the exhaust eventually went away, it seemed like water vapor in the exhaust. I definitely agree that the oil level thing probably barely works.
I only tried selling car because I found a newer GT3 for a steal. Haha. Ended up buying it anyway even without selling it.
#22
#23
#24
The car was perfect for 12,000 miles though.
The smoke from the exhaust eventually went away, it seemed like water vapor in the exhaust. I definitely agree that the oil level thing probably barely works.
I only tried selling car because I found a newer GT3 for a steal. Haha. Ended up buying it anyway even without selling it.
The smoke from the exhaust eventually went away, it seemed like water vapor in the exhaust. I definitely agree that the oil level thing probably barely works.
I only tried selling car because I found a newer GT3 for a steal. Haha. Ended up buying it anyway even without selling it.
These very long change intervals which are recommended by the manufacturers for any number of reasons do not account for engines that burn oil due to being driven very hard.
Last edited by 15FTypeR; 10-31-2017 at 08:20 PM.
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JagRag (10-31-2017)
#25
That graphic stick represents a full quart. That differential represents just 4 oz. I wouldn't find that to be an unexpected variance in readings for a two gallon system.
Last edited by Unhingd; 10-31-2017 at 09:38 PM.
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SinF (11-01-2017)
#26
#27
Ultrasonic oil sensors are not affected by metal shavings in the oil. They only look for the surface, not the contents. Something to keep in mind is your oil level is going to be different (slightly) when the oil is warm, or when the oil is cool. Also will differ before and after running the engine after a several hour soak.
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SinF (11-01-2017)
#28
This morning before I left for work, I checked the oil. It read half way on the bar, then immediately lowered another 1/4 of an inch without doing anything.
#29
Oil burning is not linear. When I was dealing with a Subaru that had bad rings, for the first 1-2K miles you have no burning, then it ramps up. So if you change oil frequently, you might not even know you have marginal oil burning. I didn't for the first two oil changes, as I have done them early on the engine that was being broken-in. Coincidentally, Subaru also lowered oil change interval by 1K and re-programmed level warning sensor - too many people were hitting warnings and asking for new engines.
These change intervals are excessively long for even gentle driving, if you push your car you need to half them.
My F-type doesn't burn oil when pushed very hard, but I change oil every other track day. So I always have fresh oil in it when the car is pushed.
No engine issues so far, but with all these recent posts I am about to do oil analysis.
My F-type doesn't burn oil when pushed very hard, but I change oil every other track day. So I always have fresh oil in it when the car is pushed.
No engine issues so far, but with all these recent posts I am about to do oil analysis.
Last edited by SinF; 11-01-2017 at 08:01 AM.
#30
Lets not go down blaming road with this. Hindsight is 20/20.
a. Checking oil is huge PITA on this car. Much more inconvenient than with a dipstick.
b. Reportedly, there is a serious flaw with low oil warning system. Multiple people posted here that F-type doesn't have low oil warning system that is considered standard equipment on modern cars.
c. OP stated that dipstick was reporting full after service
a. Checking oil is huge PITA on this car. Much more inconvenient than with a dipstick.
b. Reportedly, there is a serious flaw with low oil warning system. Multiple people posted here that F-type doesn't have low oil warning system that is considered standard equipment on modern cars.
c. OP stated that dipstick was reporting full after service
In this case it seems it was not working, so now I want to see about the system on my car.
Lawrence
#31
#32
I know the ultrasonic sensor reads the surface, but those oily metal bits tend to cling to things. If there are bits of metal clinging to the upper part of the probe, the part above the oil level, I'm wondering if they can affect the reading. I'd like to think this scenario was thoroughly accounted for. Obviously, it was not reading the level correctly on that car - I'm looking for the science, whatever it may be.
Last edited by 15FTypeR; 11-01-2017 at 02:01 PM.
#33
I know the ultrasonic sensor reads the surface, but those oily metal bits tend to cling to things. If there are bits of metal clinging to the upper part of the probe, the part above the oil level, I'm wondering if they can affect the reading. I'd like to think this scenario was thoroughly accounted for. Obviously, it was not reading the level correctly on that car - I'm looking for the science, whatever it may be.
#34
So is there still a mystery?
- Was sensor not working, and the software isn't smart enough to detect an implausible situation over time?
- Or was actual oil level not checked (including by the dealer) between the time it was ok and missing 6 quarts?
This car actually does not have the on/off oil pressure 'idiot' switch used by every car since the beginning of time? It's a great notification of sudden loss of oil pressure indicating that it's sucking air.
I guess in the end, so long as they are replacing the engine at JLR's cost, we don't need to know....
- Was sensor not working, and the software isn't smart enough to detect an implausible situation over time?
- Or was actual oil level not checked (including by the dealer) between the time it was ok and missing 6 quarts?
This car actually does not have the on/off oil pressure 'idiot' switch used by every car since the beginning of time? It's a great notification of sudden loss of oil pressure indicating that it's sucking air.
I guess in the end, so long as they are replacing the engine at JLR's cost, we don't need to know....
Last edited by 15FTypeR; 11-01-2017 at 07:42 PM.
#35
So is there still a mystery?
- Was sensor not working, and the software isn't smart enough to detect an implausible situation over time?
- Or was actual oil level not checked (including by the dealer) between the time it was ok and missing 6 quarts?
This car actually does not have the on/off oil pressure 'idiot' switch used by every car since the beginning of time? It's a great notification of sudden loss of oil pressure indicating that it's sucking air.
I guess in the end, so long as they are replacing the engine at JLR's cost, we don't need to know....
- Was sensor not working, and the software isn't smart enough to detect an implausible situation over time?
- Or was actual oil level not checked (including by the dealer) between the time it was ok and missing 6 quarts?
This car actually does not have the on/off oil pressure 'idiot' switch used by every car since the beginning of time? It's a great notification of sudden loss of oil pressure indicating that it's sucking air.
I guess in the end, so long as they are replacing the engine at JLR's cost, we don't need to know....
Seems the engine was burning crazy oil!
Got a small update; 1 week ago they told me that car was supposed to be done by Tomorrow.
Well guess what.. they are having an incredibly tough time finding some crossbolt for the frame (actually chassis bolt of some kind) and it won't be done til the part comes in.. here's the kicker. They don't know when it's coming in but estimated it to be 2-3 weeks out + 3-5 days for installing it. In 3 days, it will have spent 60 days straight getting fixed.... SIXTY DAYS, in addition to the already 20+ days spread out over a few visits, and not including the additional wait I was told today.
I can't even believe this, not to mention Jaguar hasn't even contacted my lemon law attorney and they are now 6 days past 30 day DUE notice for settlement.
Like jeez, how careless can they be? First they are basically now holding my car hostage for what is going to be 100 days.. ONE HUNDRED. On top, they are not speaking to my lawyer even after she called customer relations after the 30 day window was up. No call back....
Last edited by Ghostiest; 11-02-2017 at 07:05 PM.
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SinF (11-03-2017)
#36
#37
I am having the crazy oil consumption problem too. The car is at the dealer right now, for about a week. Tomorrow they are going to check the oil for metal shavings. Seems every ~10K the oil is drastically low. They are also stating that my powertrain warranty is void because I have a tune on my car, so any sort of issues found or repairs needed will come out of my pocket.
On top of the oil they said my struct mounts need replacing and since the car is running in VelocityAP springs that this repair is also not under warranty due to aftermarket parts.
sighhhh... will talk with the dealer tomorrow to see what I can do, and to find out exactly how low my oil had dropped over the past 10K miles.
On top of the oil they said my struct mounts need replacing and since the car is running in VelocityAP springs that this repair is also not under warranty due to aftermarket parts.
sighhhh... will talk with the dealer tomorrow to see what I can do, and to find out exactly how low my oil had dropped over the past 10K miles.
#38
@zmoothg
While it is uphill battle, you are not yet SOL. I suggest you pay an independent shop to determine the root cause of oil consumption. If it can be clearly linked to a flaw in production (e.g. bad oil scraper ring, flaw in cylinder surface) you can get reimbursed for engine replacement.
That is, JLR will always say "no warranty" for tuned engines and will not investigate the cause of engine failure any further. However, there are a lot of cases when the tune in not at fault. There are also a lot of cases where it is unclear, and JLR will successfully blame tune. It is rare, but does happen, when tune gradually destroy the engine. Most of the time bad tunes grenade the engine on the first or second pull at the dyno.
While it is uphill battle, you are not yet SOL. I suggest you pay an independent shop to determine the root cause of oil consumption. If it can be clearly linked to a flaw in production (e.g. bad oil scraper ring, flaw in cylinder surface) you can get reimbursed for engine replacement.
That is, JLR will always say "no warranty" for tuned engines and will not investigate the cause of engine failure any further. However, there are a lot of cases when the tune in not at fault. There are also a lot of cases where it is unclear, and JLR will successfully blame tune. It is rare, but does happen, when tune gradually destroy the engine. Most of the time bad tunes grenade the engine on the first or second pull at the dyno.
Last edited by SinF; 11-14-2017 at 09:07 AM.
#39
I am having the crazy oil consumption problem too. The car is at the dealer right now, for about a week. Tomorrow they are going to check the oil for metal shavings. Seems every ~10K the oil is drastically low. They are also stating that my powertrain warranty is void because I have a tune on my car, so any sort of issues found or repairs needed will come out of my pocket.
On top of the oil they said my struct mounts need replacing and since the car is running in VelocityAP springs that this repair is also not under warranty due to aftermarket parts.
sighhhh... will talk with the dealer tomorrow to see what I can do, and to find out exactly how low my oil had dropped over the past 10K miles.
On top of the oil they said my struct mounts need replacing and since the car is running in VelocityAP springs that this repair is also not under warranty due to aftermarket parts.
sighhhh... will talk with the dealer tomorrow to see what I can do, and to find out exactly how low my oil had dropped over the past 10K miles.
If I'm not mistaken it's called the Magnuson-Moss Warranty Act that states basically, that they have to prove it.
As well as my car.. I still have not seen it. Nor gotten a call. Waiting on some bolts still! In the meantime, I bought a new 2017 NSX for a steal of a deal while waiting for this situation to sort itself out.
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JagRag (11-14-2017)
#40
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NBCat (11-15-2017)