Giulia QV Vs. F-Type R
#21
Hi all,
I'm about ready to part ways with my 2015 BMW M4 and I have it narrowed down to two vehicles that probably don't get cross-shopped often: an Alfa Romeo Giulia QV or an F-Type R. I buy used so I'm looking at 2017 Alfas that are running $60-65k or 2016 Jags that are running $65-70k. I don't really need the rear seats, so practicality doesn't factor into the equation. I've driven them both think they are both amazing in slightly different ways.
Anyone have any thoughts to chime in with? Thanks!
I'm about ready to part ways with my 2015 BMW M4 and I have it narrowed down to two vehicles that probably don't get cross-shopped often: an Alfa Romeo Giulia QV or an F-Type R. I buy used so I'm looking at 2017 Alfas that are running $60-65k or 2016 Jags that are running $65-70k. I don't really need the rear seats, so practicality doesn't factor into the equation. I've driven them both think they are both amazing in slightly different ways.
Anyone have any thoughts to chime in with? Thanks!
#22
#23
#24
OP here. The F82 M4 gets very little love from the automotive press. Prior to my current 2015 M4 I had a W204 Mercedes C63, and before that I had an E90 M3. After driving all of those cars I can say with certainty that my current M4 is my favorite. It might not sound as good as the W204 C63 (or certainly an F Type R), but I think overall it's a very compelling, very livable package. I've kept mine just over 3 years which is longer than I've kept anything in the past so I guess that's saying something.
I will say this though - go for the Competition Pack if you don't mind the harsh ride of the recalibrated suspension and 20s.
Hope that helps...
I will say this though - go for the Competition Pack if you don't mind the harsh ride of the recalibrated suspension and 20s.
Hope that helps...
#25
Did a lot of test drives in the M4 Coupe before the F-Type MT (coupe) was introduced. Just couldn’t bring myself to pull the trigger on the M4 because it just didn’t feel solid to me. (Also a bit tail happy).
#26
We're getting off topic here, but the techs and customers at the shop where my M3 (E90) gets its service are tracking the F82's M4's extensively. Pre competition pack, many complained about the power level being higher than the suspension seemed to be able to handle. But with competition pack, they say most of the problems are solved, and they are now modifying the heck out of them - 600 wheel HP is common. And while many still have love for my E90 version, apparently the torque is so much higher on the F82's they are starting to have as much fun with the F82 now as with the older version cars.
#27
I own both an M4 (2015, Yas Marina Blue) and an XE with the current most recent infotainment system offered by Jag.
I think the iDrive system is better than Jags in terms of use-ability and reliability overall. For instance, when going from D to R, back to D and then R again (a common parking maneuver) the rear camera in the Jag will often fail to engage. That said, the nav on the Jag is actually way ahead of the BMWs and is much easier to use, albeit the Jag's system is two years newer. The Jag's traffic functionality works well too. Where BMW excels is when the system has to be used during driving. It's just so much easier to move the dial around than to use a touch screen.
Sound quality in the Jag (top of the line Meridian 725W system) is way ahead of the BMW (Harman-Kardon).
I can't speak to the Alpha since I've never driven it, but perhaps the comparisons made here will help in your choice OP.
Since rigidity was brought up, I can't help but point this out - the F8x M3/M4 cars are amongst the most rigid cars produced at the consumer level (i.e. non-track cars), except for some of the hypercars out there.
"BMW claims the M3's torsional stiffness is over 40,000 Newton-meters per degree, approaching that of the 2004 BMW M3 GTR race car, which used a steel-tube
roll cage to reach 46,000 Nm/deg. The stiffness comes in part from the same strut-tower brace that also helps steering feel and response." source: https://www.roadandtrack.com/new-car...ons-bmw-m3-m4/
For comparison, the F-type is around 33,000 Nm/deg (coupe) or 18,000 Nm/deg (convertible). source: Car Body Torsional Rigidity ? A Comprehensive List (Updated 05/14/2018) | YouWheel - Your Car Expert
I think the iDrive system is better than Jags in terms of use-ability and reliability overall. For instance, when going from D to R, back to D and then R again (a common parking maneuver) the rear camera in the Jag will often fail to engage. That said, the nav on the Jag is actually way ahead of the BMWs and is much easier to use, albeit the Jag's system is two years newer. The Jag's traffic functionality works well too. Where BMW excels is when the system has to be used during driving. It's just so much easier to move the dial around than to use a touch screen.
Sound quality in the Jag (top of the line Meridian 725W system) is way ahead of the BMW (Harman-Kardon).
I can't speak to the Alpha since I've never driven it, but perhaps the comparisons made here will help in your choice OP.
Since rigidity was brought up, I can't help but point this out - the F8x M3/M4 cars are amongst the most rigid cars produced at the consumer level (i.e. non-track cars), except for some of the hypercars out there.
"BMW claims the M3's torsional stiffness is over 40,000 Newton-meters per degree, approaching that of the 2004 BMW M3 GTR race car, which used a steel-tube
roll cage to reach 46,000 Nm/deg. The stiffness comes in part from the same strut-tower brace that also helps steering feel and response." source: https://www.roadandtrack.com/new-car...ons-bmw-m3-m4/
For comparison, the F-type is around 33,000 Nm/deg (coupe) or 18,000 Nm/deg (convertible). source: Car Body Torsional Rigidity ? A Comprehensive List (Updated 05/14/2018) | YouWheel - Your Car Expert
#28
I own both an M4 (2015, Yas Marina Blue) and an XE with the current most recent infotainment system offered by Jag.
I think the iDrive system is better than Jags in terms of use-ability and reliability overall. For instance, when going from D to R, back to D and then R again (a common parking maneuver) the rear camera in the Jag will often fail to engage. That said, the nav on the Jag is actually way ahead of the BMWs and is much easier to use, albeit the Jag's system is two years newer. The Jag's traffic functionality works well too. Where BMW excels is when the system has to be used during driving. It's just so much easier to move the dial around than to use a touch screen.
Sound quality in the Jag (top of the line Meridian 725W system) is way ahead of the BMW (Harman-Kardon).
I can't speak to the Alpha since I've never driven it, but perhaps the comparisons made here will help in your choice OP.
Since rigidity was brought up, I can't help but point this out - the F8x M3/M4 cars are amongst the most rigid cars produced at the consumer level (i.e. non-track cars), except for some of the hypercars out there.
"BMW claims the M3's torsional stiffness is over 40,000 Newton-meters per degree, approaching that of the 2004 BMW M3 GTR race car, which used a steel-tube
roll cage to reach 46,000 Nm/deg. The stiffness comes in part from the same strut-tower brace that also helps steering feel and response." source: https://www.roadandtrack.com/new-car...ons-bmw-m3-m4/
For comparison, the F-type is around 33,000 Nm/deg (coupe) or 18,000 Nm/deg (convertible). source: Car Body Torsional Rigidity ? A Comprehensive List (Updated 05/14/2018) | YouWheel - Your Car Expert
I think the iDrive system is better than Jags in terms of use-ability and reliability overall. For instance, when going from D to R, back to D and then R again (a common parking maneuver) the rear camera in the Jag will often fail to engage. That said, the nav on the Jag is actually way ahead of the BMWs and is much easier to use, albeit the Jag's system is two years newer. The Jag's traffic functionality works well too. Where BMW excels is when the system has to be used during driving. It's just so much easier to move the dial around than to use a touch screen.
Sound quality in the Jag (top of the line Meridian 725W system) is way ahead of the BMW (Harman-Kardon).
I can't speak to the Alpha since I've never driven it, but perhaps the comparisons made here will help in your choice OP.
Since rigidity was brought up, I can't help but point this out - the F8x M3/M4 cars are amongst the most rigid cars produced at the consumer level (i.e. non-track cars), except for some of the hypercars out there.
"BMW claims the M3's torsional stiffness is over 40,000 Newton-meters per degree, approaching that of the 2004 BMW M3 GTR race car, which used a steel-tube
roll cage to reach 46,000 Nm/deg. The stiffness comes in part from the same strut-tower brace that also helps steering feel and response." source: https://www.roadandtrack.com/new-car...ons-bmw-m3-m4/
For comparison, the F-type is around 33,000 Nm/deg (coupe) or 18,000 Nm/deg (convertible). source: Car Body Torsional Rigidity ? A Comprehensive List (Updated 05/14/2018) | YouWheel - Your Car Expert
Last edited by BOulderGT3; 09-13-2018 at 04:10 PM.
#29
#30
I've not driven an F Type vert. I have had some stinky cars that were flexible fliers. Two that jump off the page were a 308 ferrari and an Acura NSX. Both targas and both flexed so much with the tops they were barely drivable. The acura felt like it was going to fold in half. The best I've had was an SL550. It felt 80% as good with top down but god knows how much the thing weighed.
I have heard the FType is very stiff in the vert version.
I have heard the FType is very stiff in the vert version.
#31
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I've not driven an F Type vert. I have had some stinky cars that were flexible fliers. Two that jump off the page were a 308 ferrari and an Acura NSX. Both targas and both flexed so much with the tops they were barely drivable. The acura felt like it was going to fold in half. The best I've had was an SL550. It felt 80% as good with top down but god knows how much the thing weighed.
I have heard the FType is very stiff in the vert version.
I have heard the FType is very stiff in the vert version.
#32
Thanks for the reply - I'm kind of smitten with both cars - perhaps the F-Type feels a little more special? That said, coming from BMW's iDrive (which I think is the best in the industry), I'm a little put-off by the Jag's seemingly outdated interface. Sound quality from the stereo in the Jag seems far superior to the Alfa though...although most I'm sure will say to turn the stereo off in the F-Type R anyway...
Do you find visibility to be an issue in the Jag? Thanks again...
Do you find visibility to be an issue in the Jag? Thanks again...
The following users liked this post:
scm (09-17-2018)
#33
This is an easy choice for me since I don't purchase a car based on the infotainment or stereo. So, take a look at both. One is the finest looking coupe in the world and the other is a sedan. I understand you may want to assure you live near the Alfa dealer for convenience in dropping it off for warranty work.
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usgpru27 (09-17-2018)
#34
Cheers,
Dave
#35
Different cars to be sure. I found the M4 to be very solid and better balanced. More touch in the steering.
That said, not even remotely as tail happy as my R. I've read the stories about the power the M4 has but they must be much smaller horses than the R type. Also, the M4 has zip for sound. Kind of a tin can rattle at idle and then nothing that really tells you it's high power above that. Very, very different than the R.
I came away from the M4 thinking it's a very good car but a little underwhelmed.
I've owned a tracked a lot of cars. Lambo's, modded turbo PCars, Fcars and so on. There are only two I've had that felt like they made more power than advertised. A C6 Zo6 corvette which would output my 600HP Porsche Turbo and my R Type. I've had the R a year and it feels like it makes more power than when I got it.
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