Hi dear forum,

I am returning to the F-Type owners camp and have decided to purchase a manual F-Type V6 base to use as a track car!

(Please avoid telling me what a worthless track car it is and that I should have bought a Cayman/ M2/ GT86/ whatever instead. I am very well aware that there are much better suited cars out there and see this as an interesting challenge. I chose the F-Type because of originality/ sound/ looks/ cost/ want. And no, there are no reasonably priced manual V6S on the market in Europe.)

My main worry is - of course - the lack of an LSD. However, I've heard that you can retrofit the LSD from the V6S in the manual V6! Is this true? If so, has anyone here done it or can you refer to anyone that I can talk to regarding this?

Other track mods I was thinking of are:
- Eibach Pro lowering springs or a coilover set. Any tips for coilovers suitable for track use?
- OZ Superleggera or other light rims, probably 19". Any tips here as well?
- Bucket seats, eg Sparco/ OMP or the like. Can you install bucket seats without triggering the airbag warning light on the F-Type? The base V6 doesn't come with the Jaguar bucket seats, only the sports seats.

Grateful for all help and guidance I can get! Thanks a lot!

Kind regards,

Jonas

 

I regularly track my F-type V6S MT. It is enjoyable and capable track car that is within skill range of 911 or C7 Grand Sport. However, you will never be fastest car on straights or fastest car through the corners.

Some recommendations:

- you really want to get large brake caliper option; I felt no need to upgrade mine to a custom setup despite it being 'uncool' floating caliper setup. However, Jaguar XKR-S have rare Alcon brake calipers that I think are direct swap.
- you really want that LSD, it comes standard with F-type V6S and is very thought-after part as it is direct swap into a lot of other Jaguars that do not have LSD option. It is also fragile, so I wouldn't suggest paying good money to retrofit it. Without LSD putting power down would become an issue.
- get rid of plastic engine cover, solves nearly all heat soak issues

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Some warnings:

Clutch is an on-going problem with MTs. Budget having to pay for replacement. There is a thread on this - https://www.jaguarforums.com/forum/f...action-158861/
Gearbox oil is not 75W90! This MT uses Porsche PDK fluid called Pentosin FFL-3 that is closer to ATF than gearbox oil. When racing, you have to stay on top of changing the fluid, as gearbox gets quite hot.

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Some opinions:

- I don't think it is worthwhile to upgrade rims. Sure, you can get lighter aftermarket disks, lighter rims and reduce your unsprung weight a great deal. My opinion that it doesn't offer enough benefit to justify the expense - the car is just too heavy, and doing this is just re-arraigning chairs on Titanic. To make a dent you will have to gut the interior down to metal, remove AC and HVAC systems, get rid of glass roof... at that point your car will only be good for the track.
- One mod I recommend is to purchase and install cooling ducts for front calipers. It is (was?) available, but never installed by default. There are opening for these already in place.
- You want to put protective film on a leading edge of rear fenders right behind doors - lots of debris hits there, and it isn't obvious place to protect until you start tracking
- People tuned V6 to 425 HP with VAP tune and pulley and it is fine for the street use. However, you likely will have to improve cooling if you intend to use it on the track. I very occasionally (i.e. 110F days) hit thermal safety with OEM tune, where it pulls power - more boost will just make it worse/happen more frequently.

 

Thanks a lot for great input!

When you say that I should upgrade the front brake calipers, is that because of brake feel or stopping power? Don't you get quite far with just racing pads, eg a set of Pagid RSL29 or the like?

Regarding getting a V6S manual and avoiding the LSD retrofit, they are very rare here in Europe. The only one I've found for sale is more than twice the price of the manual V6 that I'm getting. I won't go that route.

Have you done anything with your suspension setup?

Thanks!

Jonas

 

Stopping power. F-type is a heavy car and I don't feel that standard calipers are adequate for race conditions. Base F-type would come with standard brakes, someone would have to order upgraded (aka painted) calipers as an option. There is also a very expensive Carbon Fiber option - I have no direct experience with it, other than knowing that brake job is almost $15K.

My car is equipped with larger calipers (see my avatar picture) and I just use OEM pads. They dust A LOT but are fully adequate to the task on medium-speed track with lots of turns. Yes, I normally would upgrade at least pads on any car I track, but really felt no need in this case. No fade, no need to warm them up... I feel they offer 90% performance of a track pad without any downsides.


No. I think this is a non-issue, but I am probably a minority in thinking this way. V6S has adjustable shocks, I turn on performance mode that stiffens suspension when tracking. Some people think F-type leans too much. Honestly, I don't know what they are talking about. I lose lateral grip way before rear wheel lifts. However, on the track I frequent there is no fast-in off-camber turns.

(Automatic-transmission equipped F-types and V8 F-types are more nose-heavy, maybe lean is more of an issue there? For V6 F-type with MT it is not. YMMV.)

 

Maybe go "shopping" to US? I heard Unhingd sometimes parks his Eleanor outside :P

 

I used to have an RWD F-Type R that I took to the track a couple of times. I actually did perceive it to be a little soft. Not that the rear wheels lifted, but it felt a little "boaty" which made it harder to feel when traction was about to get lost. To me it felt like it ruined my connection to the road somewhat. This is basically why I want stiffer suspension (and lower center of gravity) for my V6 F-Type. But; I just started track driving in 2018, so I consider myself still a rookie. Maybe I misinterpreted the car's behaviour, and/ or maybe it is less of an issue with the manual V6.

It terms of brake discs; on my F-Type R they deformed in one single really hard breaking from 300 to 100 km/ h on the Autobahn. I had to change them in order to get rid of the consequential "rattling" in the steering wheel. My F-Type R had the performance brakes. Is this a risk on track as well? At least one of the circuits I'll be driving on has a long drag strip straight where I reached ~240 km/ h with the R, followed by a really hard 120 degree bend (i.e. HARD breaking at the end of the straight). I think I remember that it was hard to find good aftermarket performance brake discs...

 

My suggestion would be to find a set of 18" wheels in the right dimensions, then go for a custom brake setup that will fit inside those 18" wheels.

In 18" you have a huge selection of track tyres, in 19" there's not much to choose from, and there's even less in 20" (ask me how I know, I am stuck with 20" on my XKR because of the brakes).

For example the Brembo 4-piston calipers from the 2003-2005 model XJR & STR with 365mm rotors fit inside factory 18" wheels with a finger width to spare.

Not saying you use those particular brakes, just as an example.

The guys in our club running 18" are spending $200 a tyre, whereas i'm looking at $600 a tyre in 20"

 

I had done hard braking from about 250 to 80 km/h hundreds of times without warping disks. I think you just got unlucky there.

 

Yes that is a very good point. I did consider this, but the reason why I am thinking 19" is because I will be competing in the "Club" class in Time Attack, which limits to me to street tires. And street tires usually don't have the same side wall rigidity as more track or semi-track focused tires, and I am afraid it will make a heavy car like the F-Type a bit wobbly. My previous track car was a BMW 130i that I also used for competing in the Club class using Advan AD08R tires and 17" wheels. Even though the 130i is ~200 kg lighter that the F-Type I still experienced some instability in the tires. Maybe 18" will be enough though, hmm. I'll for sure give it some thought.

Thanks a lot for the suggestion!

 

OK, good to hear!

 

Is there a specific treadwear requirement for your class? Some treadwears still have pretty solid sidewalls in which 18's will give you more options to choose from.... There are still slim pickings in 19's and up for performance tires but it's better than it's been a few years ago.

 

Yeah treadwear can't be below 180. But treadwear is very manufacturer specific and not really an absolute measurement. The general rule is that the tire can't be advertised and/ or positioned as a streetable track tire or competition tire, eg Michelin Cup 2's, Federal 595RS-R etc. The Michelin Pilot Sport 4S should be OK though.

Last year most people had the Yokohama Advan AD08R, but it is discontinued now and I hear that the new AD08RS' aren't as good.

 

Michelin Pilot Sport 4S is what I use and they are nothing short of miraculous. MPS4S is comparable to a dedicated track tire. Before MPS4S I had Michelin Pilot Super Sport, they are also good but get sketchy in wet. MPS4S have a much better wet grip than MPSS.

My understanding is that you need 19 inch rims to clear larger front calipers. This is what I have on my car stock, and I had no issues finding tires for 19 inch rims. Yes, they are more expensive than passenger tires for a sedan with smaller rims.

 

IMO, I would take a look at what tire options you would have in 19's vs 18's. I don't think you'll notice an issue with sidewall height for 180 treadwear tire. Most of those are pretty solid. I would go with whatever will give you the most options.

 

Yeah I was running the PS4S on my F-Type R before. I couldn't believe the difference when I switched from the Pirelli P-Zero. Maybe that's what I should go for again then.

 

Understood. Doing it right now.

I'll also check a little bit with the other competitors to see what's "this year's tire" that replaces the AD08R.

 

The 4S is a good tire (probably too good for the tread rating Michelin has labeled it), but there are better dry performing tires at the 180 treadwear rating. For competition, it's much better to have more options.

 

Don’t discount the reduction of unsprung weight by as much as 80lbs with forged wheels and two piece rotors ( see Wortec thread). Turn in is much crisper and the suspension is much more responsive over irregular surfaces at higher speeds.
Also, get the suspension as low as you can. Even a mere 1.5” reduction in ride hide will significantly reduce body roll and float through the turns.
If it’s not possible to retrofit the V6S LSD to the base, you can weld up the pinion gears on the base diff. If it’s not a super tight track, that will work as good as an LSD.
Don't shy away from a lower pulley and tune either. That will get you about 450hp, and based on extended dyno testing, heat soak will only drop you back 30-40hp. That will still leave you with 70more hp than a base V6.

Reducing track weight is only limited by how spartan you are willing to leave the cockpit.

If you find you need a more substantial performance clutch, I have a custom clutch and billet flywheel designed to 475 lb-ft (built by SPEC Clutch) sitting on my shelf waiting to be tested. I haven’t needed it yet.

 

I totally agree regarding suspension height and unsprung mass. I *will* lower the car and I *will* get lightweight wheels. Though I will try to make this build on a budget, so I may not get the most expensive forged wheels and I may stick to the Eibach lowering springs instead of getting competition coilovers. At least for this season.

The reason for this is that I don't want to make my track cars feel *precious* as I want to be able to push my limit (I will COMPETE with it after all) without feeling nervous that I can't afford to damage the car. Pushing my limit WILL make me lose control and slide off track at some point, and I don't want to feel anxious about it. Ergo - it can't be too expensive to fix.

However, I did try to search for the Wortec rotors, but their website is completely useless. How/ where can I get hold of them? And what would be the "budget alternative"? A set of Stoptech Sport slotted?

EDIT: @Unhingd In case it turns out that I need a performance clutch I'll PM you! Thanks for the offer!

 

If you tune for more power, you can and should remap throttle pedal. Stock mapping is not linear, making it harder than necessary to rev match.