Velocity AP power package ?
#21
09-06-2020, 06:52 AM
Veteran Member
Lets call what it is - you don't like VAP tune criticized, so you are looking for any way to throw my words into doubt by taking something I said out of context and discussing unrelated issues. Because racing fuel and carburetors are so relevant to tuning F-types.
VAP tune without intercooler and pump upgrades will make you heat soak unless you only race in cold weather. For most people who tune and never set a foot on a race track this is not a big deal. For street driving you can simply remove engine cover and call it done. I only heard of one heat-related engine failure in street use due to a tune (it wasn't VAP tune) and it was the result of a tuner overriding safety map. Obviously, VAP knows better than to make such rookie mistake.
Want to see that in action? Go to any dyno shop, don't let you car cool down after driving and do 5 pulls in a row. Last few pulls you won't have any tune. You will be able to see it yourself with back to back comparisons.
VAP tune without intercooler and pump upgrades will make you heat soak unless you only race in cold weather. For most people who tune and never set a foot on a race track this is not a big deal. For street driving you can simply remove engine cover and call it done. I only heard of one heat-related engine failure in street use due to a tune (it wasn't VAP tune) and it was the result of a tuner overriding safety map. Obviously, VAP knows better than to make such rookie mistake.
Want to see that in action? Go to any dyno shop, don't let you car cool down after driving and do 5 pulls in a row. Last few pulls you won't have any tune. You will be able to see it yourself with back to back comparisons.
Last edited by SinF; 09-06-2020 at 07:03 AM.
#22
09-06-2020, 09:15 AM
#23
09-06-2020, 09:21 AM
#24
09-06-2020, 01:37 PM
Senior Member
#25
09-06-2020, 02:13 PM
OP I'd consider just reaching out to Stuart and the boys at VAP directly; they sound like they've got this platform pretty dialed in and can give you some professional recommendations.
I'll be all over downpipes and a tune as soon as they've got a sale going on
#26
09-06-2020, 03:31 PM
Veteran Member
Stock tune without engine cover does fine with heat soak up until 100F degrees ambient or so. In most places with winter this doesn't happen that often. Meaning you can race most days and not have to worry about it. Not so much with a tune.
#27
09-07-2020, 10:14 PM
Sponsor
Boost is one way to increase power. However, it's only one piece of the puzzle. For example, the SVR makes more power than the R, but isn't making more boost. It's simply commanding more power through the torque driver demand tables. Basically, on any modern engine that's not in it's *ultimate* OEM configuration (ie, detuned) they are simply not opening the throttle all the way, to give an oversimplified explanation.
__________________
Stuart Dickinson
Managing Director
VelocityAP Industries Ltd.
O: (1)250-485-5126
E: Stuart@VelocityAP.com
www.velocityap.com
Stuart Dickinson
Managing Director
VelocityAP Industries Ltd.
O: (1)250-485-5126
E: Stuart@VelocityAP.com
www.velocityap.com
#28
09-17-2020, 12:09 PM
If you don't race, you can get away without intercooler upgrade. It takes me about 10 minutes driving flat-out (mostly WOT) to heat soak at ~110F degrees ambient with a stock setup, my best guess that with a tune it would be happening around 6-7 minutes range. It never happens at 90F and below.
I recall you mentioned that you race in Mexico, how hot is your typical track day? How long and how fast is you lap?
If all you do is stoplight "race", you don't need it. If you are serious about not spending lots of your precious track time doing cooldown laps or sitting in the pits with hood up, then you need to upgrade.
For me, I usually have 2 hour open track time, I like to split it to 45 min - rest - 45 min. On a very hot day my stock car can start pulling timing if I ride it all-out. This is V6S rear wheel drive, where I have larger oil pan than AWD and the same engine cooling system as V8, so I have more cooling relative to engine displacement than V8 would have. I know V6 stock runs slightly higher boost than V8 stock tune, but I also proportionally have more cooling.
I recall you mentioned that you race in Mexico, how hot is your typical track day? How long and how fast is you lap?
If all you do is stoplight "race", you don't need it. If you are serious about not spending lots of your precious track time doing cooldown laps or sitting in the pits with hood up, then you need to upgrade.
For me, I usually have 2 hour open track time, I like to split it to 45 min - rest - 45 min. On a very hot day my stock car can start pulling timing if I ride it all-out. This is V6S rear wheel drive, where I have larger oil pan than AWD and the same engine cooling system as V8, so I have more cooling relative to engine displacement than V8 would have. I know V6 stock runs slightly higher boost than V8 stock tune, but I also proportionally have more cooling.
#29
09-17-2020, 12:47 PM
both arguments about power increase are possible
1] increasing or at least, optimizing power with just a tune, and no pulley or waste gate control on a boosted car? absolutely possible. Not much, but possible.
2] most, but not all ECU tunes for this car include a pulley. Some don't
I have asked three times, now--have received no answer from the thread starter, and I think the most important question that NO one is compelling Firesandftype923 to answer is this: what the F happened to his motor? How, and why? This should be cause for alarm, I would think. Could effect all of us, at some point.
1] increasing or at least, optimizing power with just a tune, and no pulley or waste gate control on a boosted car? absolutely possible. Not much, but possible.
2] most, but not all ECU tunes for this car include a pulley. Some don't
I have asked three times, now--have received no answer from the thread starter, and I think the most important question that NO one is compelling Firesandftype923 to answer is this: what the F happened to his motor? How, and why? This should be cause for alarm, I would think. Could effect all of us, at some point.
#30
09-17-2020, 01:00 PM
#31
09-17-2020, 02:18 PM
How about this: when and how did it happen?
late afternoon? super hot outside? First lap? was flogging it for hours? etc... any of that is helpful to draw a pattern for future forum users when and if the Indy shops start tearing down broken engines. Thanks!
#32
09-22-2020, 04:51 AM
free motor with no questions asked: OK I can appreciate that. Sorry for being grouchy, but I just got done with a tech career in QA and also, took a few years off to repair cars for a living. I always "had" to know.
How about this: when and how did it happen?
late afternoon? super hot outside? First lap? was flogging it for hours? etc... any of that is helpful to draw a pattern for future forum users when and if the Indy shops start tearing down broken engines. Thanks!
How about this: when and how did it happen?
late afternoon? super hot outside? First lap? was flogging it for hours? etc... any of that is helpful to draw a pattern for future forum users when and if the Indy shops start tearing down broken engines. Thanks!
#33
09-22-2020, 07:35 AM
Ha, this thread has me chuckling. Fireandftype923 was street racing i.e. a few hard WOT pulls, not doing laps on a road course. The term "racing in Mexico" is a euphuism for street racing that was made popular by a YouTube channel called 1320 videos. Yes tuning up the boost and running more power on a road course with sustained loads quickly heat soaks this motor in high ambient temps but a few 30 second pulls of WOT its mostly a none issue. Just different use cases.
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