I had the Velocity sport cats installed yesterday, which combined with my existing x-pipe and Quicksilver rear box = sound of a pissed off Jaguar protecting her young:-) Cold start up sounds like a race car and blows exhaust gas out like a wind tunnel. It was snowy conditions when I picked her up and drove very conservatively for the 5 miles back home. I was able to take her through some of the paces today (on lunch break and after work) on clear roads/highway.
There was an issue during install which was resolved. The diameter of the sport cats was the exact diameter of the x-pipe I had installed last year, which meant the pieces didn't slide together. This was fixed by cutting a piece of the OEM down pipe and using it as a sleeve to attach the two pieces.
My CEL came on today, but not too concerned about that. Weather will be much nicer here in Chicago this weekend, compared to the snow yesterday and upper 20's today, so I hope to break it in more and can give more detailed update.

 

Looking forward to more details after you break it in... and a video of the sound! Any idea what's up with the CEL?

 

I didn't have too much free time today and was not able to plug in the OBDII reader to see which code it is. Not sure if it would turn itself off after I am able to log about 100 or so miles on it to give the ECU some time to adapt.

 

That's awesome and when you get a chance post up a video for us to all hear. I would be concerned about the cel though so let us know what you find out.

 

You'll have codes P0420 and P0430, they won't go away on their own. You need to change the emissions setting in the ECU or have the codes disabled via custom ECU tune.

 

+1. Had to do that on the Chevy LS (e-rod crate) engine when I installed a 200 cell cat on my '76 Land Cruiser. (same codes). The ECU will not adapt to this as the pre and post cat O2 readings don't have enough differential during extended deceleration. (too much unburnt fuel making it past the cat)

 

We apologize for the inconvenience of the pipes not lining up, I've brought this to Stuart's attention.

For the MIL light, like others have posted..unfortunately it will return. It will keep flagging a DTC P0420 and P0430 for catalyst threshold efficiency.

Sometimes with these codes, it will also trigger system too rich or system too lean. The PCM noticed the catalyst not covering the byproduct gases to lesser harmful byproduct gases, pcm triggers to thinking the catalyst might be cold or cooled down rapidly ..thus the PCM tries to heat up the catalyst more, this sends the fueling way lean. When too lean of a trim is discovered for to long, now trim goes rich to correct. But because the system can get caught in this case it can trigger rich lean codes prior to the dtc for catalyst threshold efficiency..aka you'll sometimes have more codes with the catalyst Dtc's depending on exterior ambient temp conditions.

Good news is, we can correct this for you, by doing a custom software calibration. We can either just disable the catalyst monitor OR do a complete tune to help gain the extra power on the table :-)

 

Keep in mind they didn't line up because of an aftermarket x-pipe. Nothing should be adjusted on your part.

 

I would agree with this as well! When the x-pipe was installed, I vaguely remember the dealership saying that they needed find a specific clamp or something to install properly. If I have not changed out to the aftermarket x-pipe there should not have been a fitment issue.

 

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ICNNwYB8q5E&feature=youtu.be

 

If y'all disable the cat monitor, how would the PCM detect a fuel trim operating outside of acceptable limits, e.g., if the long term fuel trim (LTFT) were to exceed, say, 10%?

 

If you're going to "turn off" the rear 02 sensors via ECU remapping, the car won't pass OBD emissions readiness testing, although I'm sure it would do fine for the sniffer.

The cats we're using in our LT/X pipe exhausts for both V6 and V8 F Types don't require us to change anything related to the secondary 02s in the ECU file, 100% no CEL/MILs. They are ~5x as expensive as a high quality 200cpi metallic substrate 3-3.5-3" catalyst but are certainly worth the cost difference for anyone living in an emissions testing state or region.

I look forward to some before and after dyno testing, the cars certainly sound better, which is a hard feat to accomplish.

Thanks

 

We used to have to disable (still do on exhausts we don't make ourselves so far) the secondary 02s in the ECU in order to eliminate CEL/MILs related to aftermarket exhausts and/or high flow cats that come before or in front of where the secondary 02s are located.

The primary 02s do all the A/F work, those remain untouched. The secondarys are there simply for emissions reasons. The CEL/MIL for the secondarys won't reduce power output but certainly is annoying.

Hope that makes sense.

Thanks

 

Well you shouldn't turn off the downstream sensors, they are used for fuel trims too. Simply disabling the two DTC of P0420 & P0430 but leaving the downstream sensors still measuring correctly is a much better approach.

Even better still is to change the emissions setting in the ECU from Euro5 or FED, to Euro2. With Euro2 the cats simply aren't monitored at all. The cars I've put cats on have been done this way.

Whatever you do, do NOT put extenders or minicats on the downstream sensors. It wasn't so bad on the old Denso cars, but there has been a case of a Bosch car where it ended very badly...

 

Is this possible to do in a US spec car and if so, would putting it into Euro 2 both shut off the CEL as well as pass an emissions test (show all systems in the "ready" position)?

 

Yes, yes and yes.

 

This might be stating the obvious but isn't this as simple as welding on a o2 sensor defouler? When I did a cat delete on my s2000 and ran a test pipe, there was a bung/defouler welded on to so the o2 sensor wouldn't trigger a CEL.

 

Car sounds great. Can't wait to hear some more clips. We'll probably run a slightly larger cat cat brick in the production parts to bring emissions back within normal parameters.

For your car we will take care of it with software

As stated by our Tuning team, simply 'switching off' secondary O2 monitoring can be done but it's advisable to take care of it with proper ECU mapping for the temperature monitoring reasons stated.

 

While these methods worked OK on older vehicles, and probably on a number of more modern ones too, it's a very, very bad idea to do this method on an F-Type.

The F-Type has two downstream O2 sensors per bank, in addition to the upstream ones. Both the downstream sensors are used to control fuel trims, as well as monitor the catalysts.

Tricking the sensors leads to lean conditions during & shortly after the transition from closed-loop to open-loop fuelling i.e. from part throttle to full throttle. Lean enough to cause damage.

This problem also occurs on the older Denso-ECU cars, but not as bad.

Believe me, you don't want to do it this way, especially not on a Bosch ECU vehicle.

 

As you can see below I have an 06 S-Type.. I get the 0420 code. I was thinking of trying an extender. Is mine what you consider am "old Denso"car? My fuel trims are all good bouncing around zero +- numbers like 1.34-2.56 above and below zero on short term and similar fixed numbers on long term and the outputs on up and downstream O2 sensors look the same to me from my iCarsoft tool. I have read several time where some have used aftermarket cats that needed extenders..This car runs so good I hate to do anything to it..