All,

I have over the summer had the engine out of my 1960 mk2 for about 10 days. It was to facilitate another job and as such I have not had the gearbox off or performed any other disassembly beyond that listed in the haynes manual for engine removal.

I did remove the starter motor briefly to inspect it whilst the assembly was off the car, as I had had a few occasions where (I think) the starter solenoid wasn't behaving itself and so the motor disengaged and continued spinning after the starter button was released. My thoughts at the time were that it looked fine and simple, and I was reasonably sure there was only one way to refit the motor.

Having reassembled the car, when I now try to crank the engine with the starter button it more often than not takes up the backlash but does not turn the engine over (it sounds like a really dud battery is fitted). Occasionally the engine seems to turn over enough to fire a spark at which point the engine fires and it runs cleanly. Turning the engine off and trying again yields the same original result of the engine not cranking.

I have tried fitting a new battery as I was not sure how old the previous one was but this has not improved things.

The fact that the engine runs fine once under its own power makes me happy there's no engine/gearbox issues. So I must conclude that there is a starter issue.

I have noticed that if you hold the starter button, you get a crank maybe every 10-30s. Occasionally however I have smelt an electrical burning smell, and so I have avoided doing this subsequently.

So a few questions -

1) Has anybody had this issue?
2) Have I missed something when re-fitting the starter motor to the engine? The electrical smell makes me think the motor is energised but it is meeting (mechanical) resistance.
3) Could this be a grounding/electrical issue? I have had most of the wiring in the engine bay disconnected at some point.
4) Could something like a dodgy starter solenoid cause this? I suspect not and some initial testing suggested it was behaving itself but I'm open to ideas.

Thoughts/questions/prayers welcome,

many thanks,
B

 

Sounds like the brushes are shot in the starter and it may also need to be cleaned and lubricated.


Make sure all the connections that involve the starter circuit are clean and tight.
Be sure that the bare ground wire from the engine block is grounded to the chassis and not to the front suspension which is rubber mounted.
Check the battery cable that bolts directly to the fire wall area, that has a tendency to become loose and corroded.


With all connections cleaned and tight, take a big heaver screw driver and jump the back of the solenoid.
This test by-passes the solenoid.


BE SURE THE CAR IS OUT OF GEAR, THE PARK BRAKE IS ON AND THE KEY IS OFF. YOU DON'T WANT THE CAR TO START OR HAVE THE IGNITION COIL ENERGIZED.


If the engine turns over freely and positively then the problem is in the solenoid, if the symptoms persist then the starter is at fault.


Remove the starter and bench test it.
I take a piece of old rug, place the starter on it, hold it down with you foot. Use a pair of jumper cables to activate the starter.
It should kick over with a fair amount of torque and the drive gear should fly out with positive action.

 

Hi Jeff,

thanks for the suggestions - very welcome. The starter worked well before the engine came out of the car so I'd be surprised if it's developed a fault but I'm certainly not ruling anything out at the moment.

I know getting it out is a pain once the engine is in, so I'll try fixing the ground first and see how we get on. I can believe that the ground has been connected to the wrong side of the engine mount as you suggest. I was actually only aware of the gearbox earth strap (that was missing on my car) which would explain why it wasn't put back!

Would you happen to have a photo of where it's connected on the chassis side on your car? I think most likely is the the clip was disconnected on the way out with the engine and discarded due to corrosion, then not replaced.

I'm away from the car for a few weeks but I'll let you know how I get on.

cheers,

Barney

 

The ground in the photo is right below where the generator is mounted.
Looking at it, it would be kind of difficult to mount it wrong _ just as long as one end is connected to the block and the other is bolted to where the engine mount bolts onto the frame of the car.

The other way to test the starter is to simply take a pair of jumper cables, put the ground side to the engine block somewhere and 12 volts to the single terminal on the starter.
That will by-pass any bad connections and tell you if the starter is at fault.
If it turns over, then reverse trouble shoot to find the bad connection or faulty solenoid, assuming that is the problem.

 

I was thinking, there must be a ground somewhere on the block otherwise your ignition wouldn't work.
Maybe the starter is being grounded through the points/coil and that's what the electrical smell was.
The coil was getting hot...

 

That's a great photo - many thanks.

That was my thoughts about the electrical smell - either that or I was using the gearbox switch wires... Or the speedo cable!..