MKI / MKII S type 240 340 & Daimler 1955 - 1967

should i bug my rebuilder yet?

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  #21  
Old 02-27-2024, 08:31 PM
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Originally Posted by JeffR1
It doesn't matter now, but 12 hours from start to finish, seems excessive _ it's not that complicated.

This is a complex manual box from my Bentley, it comes apart and goes together like a Chinese puzzle.
The 4th gear synchro cone was burned out, and not available, so I had to re-cut the grooves on my lathe, so I took the whole things apart and checked it over.
Took about 2 to 3 hours to get it apart first time around.

If I had to do it again, it would not take me 12 hours.

Everything looks like it's coming along for you.

Australian RR Forums: The Infamous MK VI Transmission Thrust Washer
haha yes, "chinese puzzle", a phrase i've often thought an appropriate description when disassembling my several 50-60's era british transmissions i've owned over the years. not many nuts and bolts, but instead many spring loaded detents and secret passageways with trap doors.

to be honest i'm reluctant to complain about anything, like the labor costs, at this time as it's been such a struggle, from the seller's selling me a car with a cracked block, to getting ripped off to the tune of $10,000 by the first "restorer" to the bad experience with the transport from ohio to idaho, to the estimated four-month rebuild process now extending into almost a year, that i feel like what i imagine a parent that's had a child, although i'm not the type to anthropomorphize my cars, abducted...i'm fearful of antagonizing the "kidnappers" with criticism, asking too many questions or making demands after we've agreed on a safe return once the ransom's been paid. ha!
 

Last edited by hueyhoolihan; 02-27-2024 at 09:46 PM.
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  #22  
Old 04-02-2024, 05:27 PM
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been over a month, so i thought i'd update:

contacted the builder about six weeks ago ago and given assurance that the car would be back in the shop within a week to have the engine rebuilt. i waited...and waited...

after about three weeks i contacted them again and found that the car had NOT been in the shop and was still in their warehouse. they claimed (and with some verification on my part found it to be legitimate) that they had been subjected to a record snowfall and were waiting for the snow to clear so as to get their trailer out and fetch the car.

that was three weeks ago, and i'm still waiting to hear from them. it will be a full year come the 11th of this month. i'm about to call again and i hope to god i can keep it together and not lose my temper.
 

Last edited by hueyhoolihan; 04-02-2024 at 05:31 PM.
  #23  
Old 04-02-2024, 05:50 PM
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Place them under pressure or there will always be an excuse. Fortunately a problem I did not face.
 
  #24  
Old 04-02-2024, 06:08 PM
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i may have to invest some more money and travel to idaho and stay there in a motel and visit them on a regular basis until it is finished. ...not sure how i'd go about forewarning them to expect a daily visit though, without offense. as there is still much to do on the car and i want it done without fear of retribution.

maybe i should hire an attorney to write them a well conceived letter written in such as way as to avoid offense and the possibility of retribution... if there IS such a thing!
 
  #25  
Old 04-02-2024, 06:43 PM
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I saw my engine every couple of days to ensure progress & checked all clearances while I was about it.
 
  #26  
Old 04-02-2024, 08:20 PM
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Originally Posted by hueyhoolihan
maybe i should hire an attorney to write them a well conceived letter written in such as way as to avoid offense and the possibility of retribution... if there IS such a thing!
I think a lawyers letter would really get their back up. When you dropped the car off did you say there wasn't a deadline? Can you say that you have a trip/event/occasion etc you want to take the car on and that is at Date X and you need it done by then? That may be more successful than involving lawyers.

What happens if you involve lawyers and they say to take your car elsewhere? Are you up the proverbial creek then?
 
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  #27  
Old 04-02-2024, 08:54 PM
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Originally Posted by Jagboi64
I think a lawyers letter would really get their back up. When you dropped the car off did you say there wasn't a deadline? Can you say that you have a trip/event/occasion etc you want to take the car on and that is at Date X and you need it done by then? That may be more successful than involving lawyers.

What happens if you involve lawyers and they say to take your car elsewhere? Are you up the proverbial creek then?
i thought of doing something along those lines... i'll call them tomorrow as the massive snowstorm that they used as an excuse the last time was on march 4th. plenty of time to get the trailer out, get the car, and install the engine and transmission.

unfortunately, my mind is now free, due to the delay, to dream up scenarios where they actually installed the engine and transmission and found the engine rebuild to be a failure for some reason and they are trying desperately to find another block and rebuild the rebuild. and for some reason are finding it preferable to frustrate me with lame excuses rather than tell me what's really going on.
 

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  #28  
Old 04-03-2024, 03:14 AM
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Originally Posted by Jagboi64
What happens if you involve lawyers and they say to take your car elsewhere? Are you up the proverbial creek then?
Agree!
 
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  #29  
Old 04-03-2024, 04:12 AM
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The art of rompipallismo or how to be a ball breaker.

There's a word in Italian: rompipalle, literally ball-breaker, though it tends to imply the whole philosophy of pushing others into action. Basically, you have find the easiest way for you to be a total PIA with your supplier such that it's more comfortable for him to do his job than have you on his back. You could start by telephoning him every morning to remind him to start on your car/ask him what he's going to do with your car/ ... today. If nothing happens, start calling him towards the end of the day to ask him if he's done it. If that doesn't work, start calling him at lunch time to remind him of what you want done. If he tells you to stop calling, reply that progress discussions are an essential part of good project management. Always remain polite, even if he's reduced to calling you a *****. It can be easier if you have a few useful sentences prepared before your calls.

It's much cheaper and more effective than lawyers.
 
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  #30  
Old 04-03-2024, 04:42 AM
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In this day and age I would set up a ZOOM meeting with him on a video call once a week at a set time and day so he can walk you around the build and point out the work that has been done, what is being done today and what he expects to be completed by the end of the week. Make notes of what he says and keep him to it by reminding him of what he has said.

I don't like the lawyer way. Too much of a threat no matter how the lawyer words the letter but it might be something you have to use later. As a retired Police officer who taught new recruit Police officers how to work on the street in public order situations, I used to tell them to start low, around ankle height as a metaphor. Slowly ramp up the pressure with words of caution, reminders to behave and so on until the last thing you do is arrest them which would be taking off their heads. The lawyers letter to me is up at shoulder height but if you think you are there already then do it.
Me I would set up the video call scheduled once a week to view the progress. The call will only take five minutes at the most and you get to suggest things you want done in a way you want them done with a dead line that is achievable and agreeable to you both.
 
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  #31  
Old 04-03-2024, 06:39 AM
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And make sure he is showing you your engine ~ I don't know how many XK engines he does. My first restorer, that I fired, tried to palm off an old steering box on me when we removed the car from him. I took out a picture and said to him this is my restored steering box from Summit (the steering box rebuilders) ~ miraculously he found my steering box just as photographed.
 
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  #32  
Old 04-03-2024, 07:34 AM
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Zoom meetings can work well, especially if both sides are reasonably well intentioned. Timing is important. Assuming their shop is closed at the weekend, the best time for a zoom is mid-week, say Thursday morning. Even though the meeting is fixed, you send him a link to it and a reminder every Tuesday. That reduces the possibility of him 'forgetting' the meeting, gives him time to do something before the meeting, and some time to act on the meeting before the weekend.

If zoom doesn't work, then it's back to being a ball breaker. At that stage, you have to put him in the situation that when he wakes up in the morning he feels he has two choices in life: hide in bed all day or get working on your car.

A final point, it shouldn't all be stick. Express some praise/pleasure/encouragement when he actually does something.
 
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  #33  
Old 04-03-2024, 07:46 AM
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Why do garages try and pull off things like that. When I bought my S Type it had been stripped by a Jaguar specialist in Herts UK who had done all the welding work. I had photos of the car from the previous owner and from the garage when it was being advertised for sale. When the owner went to see the car at the Jaguar garage before I picked it up the Ammeter was missing from the dash. He reported this to me and said he had been told by the garage that it had not been with the car when he had dropped it off for the welding to be done. I had clear photos of the interior showing the Ammeter in place that had been sent to me by the garage so told the owner to check again with the garage about its location. The garage miraculously found the Ammeter on the floor in the passengers foot well where it had unscrewed itself from the dash, having first disconnected all of its own wiring and then fallen on to the floor.
It was not until I was assembling the dash 15 months later that I discovered the Ammeter they had found on the floor was not only broken but was also for a Mk2 Jaguar not an S Type. (Different fittings on the back that did not match up with the original wiring in the dash.) Obviously my Ammeter had been used on someone else's project.
 
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  #34  
Old 04-03-2024, 09:04 AM
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Many in the trade are nothing but a "thinly disguised bunch of hoods".
 
  #35  
Old 04-03-2024, 10:17 AM
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i've decided to call today, and will arrange for a visit within the week (a two day drive and an overnight stay in a motel at a minimum). i'll claim that i, as a responsible owner, need to see the progress made, the engine and transmission that have been completed and that i want to verify that the rest of the car has survived the last 12 months in good order. they should have no complaints about that.
 
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  #36  
Old 04-03-2024, 10:48 AM
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I'm of two minds on the visit. One one hand a scheduled visit is a good thing, as both sides can be ready and expectations set. On the other, there is nothing like the element of surprise for an unannounced visit. Especially if it's only occasionally and they are left wondering when you might just drop in.
 
  #37  
Old 04-03-2024, 11:19 AM
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Originally Posted by Jagboi64
I'm of two minds on the visit. One one hand a scheduled visit is a good thing, as both sides can be ready and expectations set. On the other, there is nothing like the element of surprise for an unannounced visit. Especially if it's only occasionally and they are left wondering when you might just drop in.
rest assured, there will be no surprise, and the reason for the visit, the first in about a year, will have been clearly stated. everything will be known to all parties in advance, as the shop is about 800 miles away and involves two days and at least one 8000' mountain pass to get there.

 
  #38  
Old 04-03-2024, 12:44 PM
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i called them and got the answering machine. but was concerned. previous answering machine messages were personalized with the voice of the person that i usually spoke to. but this time the message was a generic one that probably came with the answering machine. i was worried...

needn't have been. got a call back and they said the car was in the shop and would likely be done in a week. i said i would call back next week and they said that sounded good.

so either i'm being punked again, or we're making progress. i will re-evaluate next week, i guess.
 
  #39  
Old 04-03-2024, 01:43 PM
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In the UK we really have a strange concept of distance in comparison to the USA or South Africa or Australia as we are such a small island.

From my house in Torquay Devon if I drove 800 miles I could reach France, Spain, Portugal, Andorra, Germany, Monaco, Italy, Luxemburg, Austria, Poland, Switzerland, Czechia, Belgium, The Netherlands, Denmark, Ireland, and Scotland. Even Norway and Sweden are within 800 miles if I took a ferry across the North sea.

That said when I am choosing anyone to do work on my cars they have to be within a half hour drive so around 25 to 30 miles from me or I just think it is not worth the bother. I can't remember the last time I drove out of my county of Devon and the border into Somerset or Cornwall is only 30 miles in either direction.
 
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Old 04-03-2024, 02:20 PM
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Originally Posted by Cass3958
In the UK we really have a strange concept of distance in comparison to the USA or South Africa or Australia as we are such a small island.
Living in a big country I do find it amusing sometimes how Europeans fail to grasp how big it really is when they visit and ask if they can drive between a couple of cities in a few days that are not close at all. As an example Vancouver to Toronto (which is only about 2/3 of the distance coast to coast in Canada) is about the same flying distance as London to Cairo. London to Moscow is 600 miles shorter.

I live in one of the mid sized provinces in Canada (Alberta) and the entirety of the UK is only about 2/3 of the size of just my province. I wouldn't think twice about doing a day trip to a breakers yard in the other major city, which would be a 400 mile round trip.
 


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