2005 S-type R Track Times
#141
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Have no doubt that you know what you are doing, just give my views also as a customer. Not sure what sort of piggyback system you would like to use, but you need to think about the heat that the ECU is compensating (although you mention already some good measures against heat). If it is a simple ECU that can only + and - injection time at certain rpms it might be tricky as when you would set and test this based upon a hot system (so like in 4th on the graph), you could go to lean on a cold system (i.e. 2nd gear in the graph).
If you go the tuning route, and you can’t take the heat (or an extra lambda sensor to check the mixture) into consideration, then a tune on the original ECU might be the better road.
If you go the tuning route, and you can’t take the heat (or an extra lambda sensor to check the mixture) into consideration, then a tune on the original ECU might be the better road.
The word piggy back is a little misleading for this system its really a ECU just being used to only control certain parameters of the motor in conjunction with the stock ecu. Basically were changing values at the ecu and changing feed back coming back into the ecu.
We are to a point + and - changing fuel trims and 02 feed back. We are also using our own map sensor and wide-band 02 sensors at the same time. I can change the fuel trims and 02 feed back to the stock ecu under certain conditions and then under say a lean condition due to IAT rising or for any other reason I can roll back my fuel corrections based on my 02. We could also set it up to make changes up to a certian point and then lets say the 02 goes beyond the chart we set up as safe, at the point the corrections drop out and the ecu goes into it's preset safety mode just as it normally would.
When I was working on the ecotech motor program with Roush racing we were using the pectel ecu. It was left over from there Indy car program and since money is king that is what we were given to use because it was paid for. Problem was the ecu wasn't built for forced induction! We had to use multipliers to accommodate the boost based on a five bar map sensor basically using what was meant to be altitude corrections. I learned with the system you can with enough time trick anything. WE also were running 62psi of boost on a 4bar sensor so you had to hail marry the last line of code multiplier since it was off the graph LOL! Made 1600hp with a 2.0 liter 4 cylinder anything can be done.
All that to say we can kill the heat with a combination of octane, evaporation, freon
![Wink](https://www.jaguarforums.com/forum/images/smilies/wink.gif)
This is a sc430 we did the same thing on. This car is running a stock can bus Lexus ecu for the naturally aspirated motor with a motech ecu running piggy back. It has 1000cc inj, twin 66mm turbos, the stock drive by wire TB and everything works as it should, dash, trans etc... Was making about 650hp here. We latter ditched the stock ecu and went all motech because the guy wanted 800+.
YouTube - ‪Twin Turbo SC430‬‏
#142
#143
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Just thinking out loud; another option might be to take away the possibility for the denso ecu to use its own strategies when it comes to the heat measured via the AIT2 (the temp sensor behind on the left hand intercooler). This way you don’t have to make it complex to counteract the strategy, yet leave everything else right for the stock ECU. Then you need your own sensor on the intercooler, and put the original sensor on a place where it measures ambient temps, and use the possibilities of your ECU to use your own strategies based on the temp sensor in the intercooler. Then the fuel trims will be more linear, and easier to manipulate.
Please don’t do this at home
Please don’t do this at home
![Icon Wink](https://www.jaguarforums.com/forum/images/smilies/icon_wink.gif)
#144
#145
#146
![Default](/forum/images/icons/icon1.gif)
Just thinking out loud; another option might be to take away the possibility for the denso ecu to use its own strategies when it comes to the heat measured via the AIT2 (the temp sensor behind on the left hand intercooler). This way you don’t have to make it complex to counteract the strategy, yet leave everything else right for the stock ECU. Then you need your own sensor on the intercooler, and put the original sensor on a place where it measures ambient temps, and use the possibilities of your ECU to use your own strategies based on the temp sensor in the intercooler. Then the fuel trims will be more linear, and easier to manipulate.
Please don’t do this at home![Icon Wink](https://www.jaguarforums.com/forum/images/smilies/icon_wink.gif)
Please don’t do this at home
![Icon Wink](https://www.jaguarforums.com/forum/images/smilies/icon_wink.gif)
#147
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It has been done so its simple to a point, if its never been done its trying, and my favorite, if it can not be done then its just more expensive
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#148
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Well the word easy is relative LOL. Its not that it's out of the realm of whats been done you just have to consider a lot of variables and know how to work around them.
It has been done so its simple to a point, if its never been done its trying, and my favorite, if it can not be done then its just more expensive![Wink](https://www.jaguarforums.com/forum/images/smilies/wink.gif)
It has been done so its simple to a point, if its never been done its trying, and my favorite, if it can not be done then its just more expensive
![Wink](https://www.jaguarforums.com/forum/images/smilies/wink.gif)
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#150
#151
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LOL - fair comment!!
It's a weird hybrid of terms borrowed from all over the place.
Start with some basics and just keep at it![Smile](https://www.jaguarforums.com/forum/images/smilies/smile.gif)
Such as:
http://www.onboarddiagnostics.com/page02.htm
JTIS is quite good, believe it or not, as are the jag Technical Guides. (No good at teaching OBD, they don't try to do that, but they show how the parts of the car hang together.)
It's a weird hybrid of terms borrowed from all over the place.
Start with some basics and just keep at it
![Smile](https://www.jaguarforums.com/forum/images/smilies/smile.gif)
Such as:
http://www.onboarddiagnostics.com/page02.htm
JTIS is quite good, believe it or not, as are the jag Technical Guides. (No good at teaching OBD, they don't try to do that, but they show how the parts of the car hang together.)
Last edited by JagV8; 06-07-2011 at 08:34 AM.
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bfsgross (06-07-2011)
#152
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LOL it's a lot of trade lingo added in to. My wife went with me to the Atlanta race and commented that after an hour at the trailer she didn't understand one word we said! Keep in mind my wife hears a lot of me on the phone talking someone through something so she probably knows more then a lot of mechanics about how things work.
With real pro race guys it gets real bad. When you live it your jokes, your stories even your analogys all centers around race lingo. The turbo pro mod me and my partner setup that everyone in the industry said would never work set both ends of the world record last weekend in NJ. I am on the phone (quite excited) letting chris know it ran a 5.80 flat and my wife asked so what did it trap
I was so proud!
With real pro race guys it gets real bad. When you live it your jokes, your stories even your analogys all centers around race lingo. The turbo pro mod me and my partner setup that everyone in the industry said would never work set both ends of the world record last weekend in NJ. I am on the phone (quite excited) letting chris know it ran a 5.80 flat and my wife asked so what did it trap
![Smile](https://www.jaguarforums.com/forum/images/smilies/smile.gif)
#154
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