Greetings again... Dash lit up with "Brake Fault" and "ABS not available" also "Cruise Not" ... My trusty iCarsoft just told me it's the "Right Rear Tone Wheel" When i search Right Rear Tone Wheel on ebay I get the
Pickup part that sends the tone to the ABS that I replaced the left about a yr ago. I think that part was called ABS wheel speed sensor so now I'm here for some insight..thanks so much for looking

EDIT: while waiting I learned here it might just be the magnetic ring the sensor picks up from behind the brake disc needs cleaning. I need rear break work soon so this might work out even sooner with this.. I'm still going to wait for replies here.

 

Have you checked your battery voltage without vehicle running?

 

Did you fit a new sensor from a known manufacture?
The reason I ask is that the cheap ones that are on e-bay are known to be less reliable and it could well have failed again in a year.
Yes the inductance rings can go rusty making them expand and start rubbing on the sensor, this will cause the sensor to fail.

Mellow

 

I had 12.22 volts standing and I already knew that's not good and then a quick flash of 10v while cranking so the battery (1yr old Bosch) will be replaced first and I hope on warranty again.
The first Bosch only lasted a year. The Walmart battery in my van was just replaced also but it was 6yrs old.. Johnson Controlls I think.
I suppose I should ask are Bosch batteries good?
Thanks,,I'll be back in a day or two with a report.

 

Thanks for the idea...I bought one of those for the other side "on ebay" for about $40 2yrs ago and that one is fine..
That also lit up the dash when it went bad.
I now know I have a failing 1yr old battery that as you likely know can light up the dash real good when they hit 10 volts cranking.

EDIT: I just read Bosch,Exide,Interstate,Die Hard,Walmart and many other batteries are made by Johnson Controls.

 

My battery was tested good at the seller but charging high they said at 15volts, I didn't know 15v was too high,, so had it tested good again at NAPA just to be sure and is not overcharging by their tester.

Now I have bigger problems.. On my way home I got my first transmission fault on top of all the others then shortly after a hard jerk when it slammed into second gear and stayed there..
Went from a perfect running trans to this like something broke.. Limped to a mechanic I knew that was close where it's even hard to move it around his lot jerking and all..
I didn't have my iCarsoft with me so he hooked up a SnapOn tester that was wireless to his PC and thinks I need a rebuilt transmission.
I called the shop he sends customers to that said it's $4,250 to rebuild when it seems to me it might just be electronic or a valve body or something..
I suppose I should just start a new thread with questions and advice but I'll wait for a reply here.. thanks for looking

 

Deep breath! Go to your happy place.


One crisis at a time...

You had one hard fault (warning messages for cruise, ABS, EPB) of unknown origin. This could be the wheel speed sensor, low battery, maybe a chaffed wire, who knows. Whatever was causing this fault, it was still active. Then suddenly you get a new symptom (transmission fault message and stuck in 2nd). Just strictly guessing, but maybe the transmission controller reacted exactly as programmed due to some missing or erroneous input, quite possibly whatever was causing the other symptoms. Maybe it had to see it happen on several legs before responding, which might explain why it didn't respond earlier. It certainly doesn't seem a stretch that the transmission controller would need to know wheel speed. Fix the known faults first before digging deeper elsewhere.

So in my over-inflated opinion, I'd hold off on the $4K tranmission rebuild. If the car is totally undriveable, spring for a tow home and continue working to resolve the original fault. See if the transmission fault resolves itself. If nothing else, you can use your own scanner and see what it going on.

Back to the mention of 15V charging. Was this recorded with the battery connected and the engine running? I think so, but want to be sure. If so, this is high. Prolonged charging at that level can harm the battery. 2003+ cars have a smart charging system that initially charges around 14.5V for a few minutes, and then tapers off to 13.5V or so. Just another guess, but I wonder if the 15V is a feature when the battery doesn't seem to be taking a charge, and is designed to momentarily shake things up and get the process started. (My battery charger at home has a similar feature) Whatever it is, such a high voltage doesn't sound right. The root cause of everything could be as simple as a failed battery, with any luck.

 

Karl... Thanks for all that.. I am going real slow on that rebuild suggestion but as a backup I already found a 6HP26 out of an 2008 with only 25k for $944 delivered so I have options there if needed. You mentioned " some missing or erroneous input" when the guy at the shop used the SnapOn tester he said he reset some thing and go try it,, It was even worse so that might another clue it's something electronic. Back to the voltage issue it's strange the battery seller tested the battery good but charging hot but right down the road at NAPA battery tested good again as well as the charge current.(head scratching) Deep breath! happy place because I still have my trusty 99 Ford E150

 

Are you able to try the ole trusty F 150 battery in Jag? Definitely hold off on transmission.

 

I'm holding way off on the transmission.. Good idea I'll try that battery it's new but need to check more into that 15v charging . Could a 15v spike from the alternator cause problems like this?
I know last year when I bought the new Bosch battery it was right after the cranking volts dropped below a threshold and all the dash lights lit up, I installed the new battery and didn't even
have to reset anything with my iCarsoft, it started right up with no lights. Pep Boys (battery seller) said this 1yr old Bosch tested good so I drove away with it and 1/2 mile down the road
is where the trans fault came on and it slammed into 2nd gear, good thing I was going slow.. Thanks Rick as always for your help.

 

More thinking out loud:

What is required to clear a wheel speed sensor fault? If the sensor itself was bad, would simply connecting a new one be enough? Or is a test drive required, so the proper signal is generated? Just wondering if you could try a new sensor without completely installing it, or messing with the tone ring.

On a similar vein, if this would work, is it easy enough to swap with the sensor on the other side? Hook up your scanner and see if the fault follows. It would be nice to have confirmation before splurging on a new sensor.

 

I don’t think a brief excursion to 15v would hurt anything. That’s not too far from the normal range.

Totally a guess, my thoughts are the charging system is sensing the battery won’t take a proper charge. Maybe it expects to see the battery accept a certain current and it’s not happening. In response, it’s ramping up the output to compensate. Maybe the high voltage is not a fault per se, but a programmed response to a battery that is leasing the farm with an option to buy. Once again, strictly a guess, as I don’t know how intelligent the smart charging system really is.


Careful, because like most troubleshooting situations, passing a test is not always conclusive. A more accurate statement might be “the battery tested ‘not glaringly bad’ at that moment.”

Is your battery the problem? Hard to say. Make sure to fully charge it before any troubleshooting. I like the idea to try the battery from another vehicle. I’m always hesitant to suggest a new $200 part just for giggles.

 

I've cleared the codes several times. The iCarsoft has been a great Jag Specific OBD2

So The time line from the beginning once again if y'all will be so kind
The first fault I had was the break faults on the dash ABS Cruise etc. ...with my OBD2 got the "Right Rear Tone Wheel" first and only that, it's where this started.
I did suspect the speed sensor but since found that the Tone Ring can get dirty and easy to clean (youtube) so that's on my list first and might not need a speed sensor at all.
Anyway It wasn't until I came here and was awakened that it might be only a failing battery so I went to the dealer who checked it good.
It wasn't until left the Battery seller and drove 1/2 mi down the road when it abruptly down shifted..like the little clunks I get sometimes but harder..
...now next day
I just went to drive it home from my friends garage and disconnected the battery for 5min first wishing things might reset. I started it and got 15.2v charging (ouch)
Nothing reset with the dash or OBD2 codes so I deleted them again and at least it wasn't jerking driving slow in the lot like yesterday
so I drove it 2mi home 40mph 2000rpm stuck in 2nd or 3rd gear and no clunking gears.

OBD2 Codes..
P0720 output speed sensor circuit
U0155 trans lost connection with instrument cluster
P0402 invalid data from transmission control mod.
It seems to me all that could just be electronic but something could be stuck in the valve body
It's just so strange I had that one fault for 2 days then trans failure. ..

 

I hope it's OK I share this I found searching "Jaguar 3.0 charging 15.20 volts" fearing I might be cooking something.

i read on our forum 5 yrs ago these cars are fussy about batteries
and at that time the Bosch was a suggested one, maybe because they deal with 15.3 volts?(see below)

I'd like your thoughts what I found please. the bold part

From Astromag @ Jaguar Enthusiasts Forum Portsmouth, England
The full story of how the generator operates is as follows:
Vehicles With 2.0L, 2.5L or 3.0L Engines
The charging system consists of a 120 amp output generator and regulator assembly which generates current to supply the vehicle electrical system with electricity when the engine is running and maintain the battery in a charged condition.The generator is belt driven by the accessory drive belt.
When the engine is started, the generator begins to generate alternating current (AC) which is converted to direct current (DC) internally. The DC current and voltage is controlled by the voltage regulator, (located inside the generator), and then supplied to the battery through the main battery positive cable.
The generator is solidly mounted to the engine timing cover and is driven at 2.8 times the engine speed.Vehicles fitted with manual transmission have a one way clutch fitted to the drive pulley, which prevents torsional vibrations from the engine being transmitted to the generator.

The engine control module (ECM) can switch the voltage regulator between two voltages to optimize the charging of the battery.The low voltage regulator setting is 13.6 volts and the high voltage regulator setting is 15.3 volts, measured with the generator at 25°C (77°F) and charging at a rate of 5 amps. These values decrease with a rise in temperature or current flow.

The ECM determines the voltage setting of the voltage regulator. The high voltage setting is always selected by the ECM once the vehicle has started. The ECM determines the period of time that the high voltage setting is selected for.There are three different time periods selected by the ECM which is dependent upon the vehicle conditions when the vehicle is started:
The longest time period is selected if the ECM determines that the vehicle has been 'soaking' for sufficient time to allow the engine coolant temperature (ECT) and the intake air temperature (IAT) to fall within 3°C (37°F) of each other.
The intermediate time period is selected when the ECT and the IAT are below 5°C (41°F).
The shortest time period is the default time and is used to provide a short period of boost charge.
At the end of these time periods the voltage is always set to the low voltage setting to prevent the battery from being overcharged.The time periods are variable depending upon the temperature and the battery voltage.
The target voltage of the battery varies between 14 volts and 15 volts depending upon the ambient temperature and the vehicle operating conditions. Once this target voltage has been achieved, providing the vehicle has been operating for at least the shortest time period, the ECM will reduce the voltage regulator to the minimum setting of 13.6 volts.

 

These codes could be as simple as a loss of power to the transmission control module, such as a blown fuse or loose connector. The codes sound scary and expensive, but it's probably what the other modules will report when they can't communicate with the TCM. It would be like calling a friend but there's no answer, although you have no way of knowing exactly why. I suppose you could make the assumption that he's the victim of a mass murderer, but more likely he forgot his phone or the battery died.

The charging voltage? Don't get too sidetracked. Sounds like 15+V is normal, as long as at settles down after a specified time period. I may have been less correct than usual with my theory that the battery was getting cooked. Even if this was the case, the damage wouldn't be instantaneous. You could safely swap this potentially suspect battery with the one from your truck and see what happens.

Seems like you've reached the point of trying stupid and futile gestures versus just thinking of different fault scenarios:

Charge that poor battery. Don't rely on the alternator to have done so.

Check the fuses feeding the TCM.

Swap with another battery. Make sure it is fully charged, too.

Replace the suspect wheel speed sensor.

 

The speed sensor will be here in 4 days and I'm going to clean the tone ring first because that might be the problem right there.It's mysterious though I don't get the tone ring code anymore. The sensor is supposed to have a resistance of 1000-2500ohm and it wouldn't surprise me at this point if the controller knows that is OK because it told my iCarsoft it was the tone ring this time where 2yrs ago it pointed to the the sensor. That is when I learned
one problem part can turn on 5 codes and light op the dash.
Thanks for suggesting a blown fuse, I can go over that today.

Now that it's home I'm going to try swapping it with the new van battery.
I said battery was tested good at the seller and again at NAPA 20 min later but the overcharge was not detected there so the volt regulator is ramping it down after start.

One other thing might be a tip... I reset all the dash codes yesterday again and with parked engine running no codes for 5min. I drove 30ft and all the codes came back
I'll know fri if it's the speed sensor/tone ring is doing that.
Thanks for your help

EDIT: I can't find a fuse for the TCM on any fuse box diagrams.

 

The standing voltage on the Bosch when I pulled it was 12.20v , I installed my new van battery with 12.79v standing and as soon as I opened the car door the alarm went off
and didn't stop until I put the Bosch back in and started the car..
I ran it for a while and the VR did settle down to 13.22v
The 12.20v Bosch starts the car real easy and doesn't light up the dash like last year when I replaced it.

I checked the codes again and got "right rear speed sensor" this time instead of tone ring .
I have a feeling there might be the culprit to my whole problem, but when the left sensor went bad it didn't mess with the Transmission. just cruise and breaks

I got a hast answer on the fuse(s) for the TCM from Karl .kr98664
Looking at figure 04.1, there are two sources of power for the TCM.
"19 II" inside the circle leads you to figure 01.5 and fuse F15 in the primary junction box inside the cabin.
"74" inside the box leads you to figure 01.2 and fuse F33 under the hood.

They both test good...Thank you Karl

 

Yes, this is an interesting clue. I think you can have two types of faults with a sensor reading pulses from a tone ring. The sensor itself is just a single piece of fine wire formed into a coil, sealed inside a housing.

1) If the sensor is bad, such as no continuity or shorted internally, or you have an external wiring fault, the controller is probably programmed to recognize this and report the fault. You'd get this fault whether moving or stationary.

2) The sensor itself could be fine, but it's not reading the pulses from the spinning tone ring for reasons unknown. This could be something like the gap is too great or the tone ring is damaged. The way I'm thinking (Danger! Danger!), the controller would only flag this as a fault when in motion, with one wheel generating pulses to indicate rotation, and nothing from the suspect side.

Based on your latest observation, scenario #2 fits better. It still wouldn't hurt to change the sensor, just to be safe.

 

That's too low. 12.6v seems to be the magic number for prestart voltage or you may get the Christmas tree on the dashboard effect:

https://www.jaguarforums.com/forum/s...attery-193787/



Are you saying the alarm kept sounding even with the battery removed?

Some cars have a secondary alarm system with its own power source, apparently activating a siren instead of the horn. From what I understand, only UK models had this, so I don't think your US model has it. Call me confused:

https://www.jaguarforums.com/forum/s...02-how-189612/


Or maybe I just misunderstood what you said. Either way, were you ever able to try a different battery? That's way up there on the list of likely culprits, so I'd hate to see you have to skip it due to an alarm problem. I don't see any possibility for the alarm system to know which battery is installed, so none of this makes any sense.

 

Just when I had my Walmart van battery connected , maybe because it's only 650cca , it's a mystery to me why but I couldn't open my door with it connected.
As soon as I put the Bosch 850cca back in it was OK there.

Several ?s if you have time..
I think I remember back in the beginnings of electronic engine controls (VW Rabbit) there was a threshold voltage of 10 volts
where the car would crank but had no ignition. Is there a threshold with these too? if I can find that and print it out It'll help me get a new battery under warranty.
This Bosch goes down to 10v cranking and the seller says thats acceptable but I don't think it is with these.

Do you know where I can print proof that 12.19v standing makes these cars go nuts ? I already copied the "majic number" sentance you wrote up top..

That left speed sensor last year gave me all the same codes except it didn't mess with the transmission, have you ever heard of that before?

Then again this time it's dealing with the fault code and low voltage and those suckers wouldn't replace the battery because their tester said it was good.

Thanks Karl