Hello wizards, I come to you once more in dire need.... After having tackled all the quality of life problems, and a pretty expensive gearbox issue, I'm wondering if I'm ever gonna trust this car

Car came back from the workshop for an intervention on the gearbox (replacing a 10€ spring in the hydraulic block), and has ridden something like 100km since without issue. Took the car to get something to eat, and wasn't able to get back...

- Engine wouldn't start and experienced a lot of vibration noise while trying.
- Engine finally started, unwillingly, when jump starting the battery. Engine had a hard time reaching idle speed or maintaining any speed. Accessory belt was going going CRAZY. I mean like crazy, scary vibrations. I shut off the engine because it was really too scary.
- Left the car to rest (several hours). Servicemen came in : tried to jumpstart the car again. Worked for something like 30seconds. Still had accessory belt vibrations but less terrible. Engine shut off by itself. Tried adding "start pilot" directly in the throttle, no result, the engine didn't start again.
- Towed the car to my place (an hour). Tried to start it again (on its battery) : engine ran for something like 30 seconds again and died.

First elements :
- No error codes
- Battery is at 12.3V when car is shut off. And the car did start on it after resting for an hour or so.
- It's got gas (and anyway the "start pilot" had no effet).
- Spark plugs and coils are 100 000km old : I ordered new ones
- First thought it was the alternator that could be stuck, causing the accessory belt to slip and shake, but a friend confirmed it was turning correctly when I'm trying to start the engine.
- Engine is indeed turning when trying to start the car (had a look through the oil filling funnel)

What are your thoughts ? What would you look at ?
Thank you so much guys !

 

Timing Chain issue?

 

Thanks for your help I certainly hope it's not a timing chain issue... When adding "start pilot" in the air intake, we did not notice any reflux (that could indicate a mistimed compression cycle ?), only "clean" one way intake. I have to admit I never personnally heard an engine die this way, but I imagine the noise must be quite loud and metallic, wheareas the noise seemed to come from the accessory belt here ? Pretty hard to judge though

What would you do to make sure the timing chain is OK ? Remove the cylinder head and get in there ?

 

To check the cam timing, remove the cam covers and rotate the engine in a clock direction ONLY when viewed from the front of the engine until the flat areas of the cams are facing up. The flat areas should be in alignment or the cam timing is incorrect.

If a secondary chain jumps three cam sprocket teeth, the exhaust valves are going to be hit by the pistons on that cylinder bank.

 

Hey boys
Finally found time to, at least, remove the coil cover. For the cam covers you mentionned.... It is my understanding that there is A LOT MORE to remove (intake block, accessory belt, which seems stuck and front engine cover potentially), and a few seals to swap, so it'll be for later ^^'. However, 2 findings for tonight :

- unrelated to coils, but the accessory belt tensioner DOES NOT rotate wise as it should to allow me to remove the belt. Maybe I need a lever, but kinda scared to destroy something.
- 5 spark plugs were soaked in engine oil.... One of them is litteraly submerged

So, next step, checking cylinders compression (once I get an adequate spark plug socket). Your thoughts ?

 

In the immortal words of Douglas Adams:

“Don’t panic!”

5 spark plugs and coils soaked in oil? Could be that poor engine is (barely) running on 3 cylinders. That could ’splain a lot of the present symptoms.

Rather than replace the cam cover gaskets just yet (a lot of work), dry out the plug wells with some paper towels, etc. Install some fresh plugs. Careful not to let too much oil flow down into the plug holes, to avoid hydraulic lock. Take some aerosol electronic cleaner and clean the coils. With any luck, the coils will live to run another day.

With everything cleaned up and fresh plugs installed, see how the engine runs now. Unless the oil leakage was a gusher, you’ve got a little time before you’ve got to replace the cam cover gaskets. And in my over-inflated opinion, it would be nice to know how deep you’ve got to investigate when pulling the cam covers. Personally, I think it would be very nice knowing I didn’t have to dig any deeper.

With any luck, the serpentine belt problem was caused by the engine running so poorly.

 

Insert a tool such as a breaker bar into the opening on the accessory belt tensioner and rotate it to release tension on the belt. There is a wear indicator on the belt tensioner that indicates the belt is worn. If the belt shows signs of cracking, it must be replaced.

If you've already removed the coil units and spark plugs, it's not that much more work to remove the cam covers. When removing the cam cover on Bank 2, DO NOT remove the oil dipstick from the tube as it can be very difficult to get the tube back into the sump housing behind the air conditioning compressor.

 

Agreed. But I was thinking more along the lines of the new information about 5 coils soaked with oil. Previously, the conversion was about potential problems with the timing chains. I was afraid the next reply would be something like: “Well I took off the timing cover but didn’t see anything bad so I dropped the crankshaft but I lost track of which piece went where…”

Always trying to live my personal motto to do as little as possible for as long as it takes.

 

Hey guys and thank you for your input
Well I went ahead and removed (at least tried) the cam covers ! Passenger side went line a breeze… And driver side :
- regarding the oil dipstick, I reengineered the piece to be able to access the bolt… Not sure it’s jaguar compliant but at least I know I didn’t damage anything. Other than this little clamp… with my cutters…
- however I still wasnt able to fully remove the cover because of one line. Which should contain fuel, according to my research.

So what do you guys think ? Remove the line or insert the new seal in this position ?

 

Oh and another thing : I stil got the plastic timing chain tensioner. I saw a thread mentioning a DIY price of 1300$ (so I guess in Europe with the parts being more expensive, something like 2k€…). It’s because the whole chain kit must be changed ? Would you go for it ?

 

Use a special tool designed to remove the fuel line quick connection:

https://www.ebay.com/itm/23494656002...3ABFBMuqvW4Nli

Remove the cam cover and clean the area that holds the gasket. Replace the spark plug boss seals to reduce oil leaks into the spark plug wells.

Given the age of the vehicle, the primary and secondary timing chains, guides and tensioners should be replaced together, especially if the primary chain guides have broken off and fallen into the sump.

 

Whilst you're working on the engine, it would be best to replace the thermostat housing with the aluminium version, and the water outlet pipe since they're known failure points.

Here is an example of a listing for the thermostat housing:

https://www.ebay.com/itm/37093367319...3ABFBMlLyu4dli

Here is a listing for the water outlet pipe:

https://www.ebay.com/itm/11574724312...Bk9SR6L1u-HZYg

 

Thanks for the advice How I'd love to have US prices on parts here in EU.... But considering those pieces amount to 200€ instead of 100$, I think I'll let it slide right now.... Car already had check-ups and parts changed on the water circuit.

I don't have any bills regarding the timing chains... But god damn this kit is 600€ :'(

 

@human_gamepad, kindly add your location and vehicle description to your signature. Knowing the location of the vehicle is always helpful when suggesting replacement parts.

 

I did a couple posts ago and it does not display and I've been feeling dumb since ^^'

 

Tool came in, fuel line came off, and ooooh surprise, looks like this secondary timing chain had a rough time... I'll try to borrow a camera to look at the pistons tomorrow and hope like hell that the exhaust valves did not touch.... Otherwise, it might be over for me. I think I'd have to remove the engine entirely to change the valves ? The workshop manual does reference the Cylinder Head RH removal as in-vehicule repair for the 4.0L, but conviniently forgot to mention anything about LH..

 

That is one clean engine! Hope you don't find lethal damage inside.
.
.
.

 

The secondary timing chain can jump a maximum of two teeth before any valve damage occurs. If the exhaust cam has jumped three of more teeth, the pistons have contacted the valves.

The Bank 2 cylinder head cannot be removed with the engine in situ should there be bent or broken valves.

If the secondary tensioners are broken, it's best to replace the primary and secondary chains, guides and tensioners as a set. Use a bore scope to inspect the primary chain guides to see if there are any broken pieces as they drop into the sump and can block the oil pump pickup.

Remove the ignition coil units and spark plugs. Remove the Bank 2 exhaust camshaft from its bearings and carefully rotate the engine using the 24mm crankshaft bolt. Rotate the engine in a clock direction ONLY when viewed from the front of the engine to avoid any damage to the main and rod bearings. Rotate the crankshaft until the flat area of the remaining three cams have their flat areas facing up, then reposition the exhaust cam back onto the cylinder head so both cams have their flat areas facing up in parallel. Use the special tools to lock all four camshafts in their correct positions.

 

The secondary timing chain is broken, and ate part of the broken tensioner… You can actually see parts of both all over the picture.
i’m pretty sure the exhaust valves are bent, cause I tried to start the engine several time.
Its a pretty sad news that the engine has to be removed as I’m not equipped at all for that…
I’m really not sure what to do next, maybe just give up