Hey folks. the title was to obtain your interest. Now that i have your attention, i wish to offer you a question. Im speaking about a 2005 S-type 4.2. There is a very popular inexpensive handling add on seen on many performance vehicles today. That being the Front upper strut tower brace/bar. The reason for its use is to control the inherent chassis flex during cornering. That is a reasonable target area to address. That being said the question is.....Whats your opinion?...Do you feel they work?.... and finally, Are they available for my application? You folks have more contacts then myself. Thank you. John Wisconsin

 

The S-Type platform is pretty stiff so I'm not sure it would have very much effect. But I'd be interested in knowing whether the STR came with one since you'd think that if there was any advantage they would have included one, since they are relatively cheap and I believe that other Euro-performance cars come with them

But mostly, in the case of your car, it would really be for under-hood bling purposes...
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Jaguar - it's not an automobile, it's a Motorcar

 

(Rant follows)

I'm constantly amazed by the resourcefulness of the aftermarket for their ability to invent widgets, convince people that they work and most importantly, you just can't live without them now that you know they exist.

A key element is that the widget must be simple to install- the less bolts and nuts the better, a stick on or clamp on would be even better but a small bottle of elixir poured into the appropriate orifice is best.

In the case of the strut brace, the premise is that

1) the factory did a poor job of bracing the body and frame

2) it's the weakest link in a complex chassis and suspension system

3) we drive hard enough on the street to expose this weakness


It is true that if someone is going for all-out track performance a strut bar (a real one, not the Mickey Mouse aftermarket deals) might add that last .00001%, but that's after doing a very long and expensive list of mods addressing the real weak points. Chassis flex is not one of them.

The last few I looked at could not possibly do anything by virtue of the mounting method. Had their been any flex, the mounting plate would have slid horizontally on the mounting studs offering little restraint. Useless.

 

This, and the fact that any strut tower system worth its salt will be a 3-point system that connects at the firewall and the two towers. I don't see that happening. You can't even slide a pipe of paper between the firewall and the back of the intake on the blower and there's not much more room between the top of the blower and the hood.

If you want a little less body roll and slightly better handling get the mina springs.

 

The factory has something very similiar attached to the strut towers and fire wall already?

Here is an Aston Martin version with the Jaguar based 4.3L V-8. Now this is some bling!!


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I've though about adding strut tower cross bracing on my conversion project, but it is at least a 3rd order effect. First I'd need to drive the car hard for some period of time and figure out how the drive-train and suspension cause the chassis to flex. Body-flex can be a big issue. Perhaps a full roll cage would be in order before adding tower strut braces.

My 04 STR doesn't display any symptoms that indicate the need for tower braces. I would think more seriously about tower braces if I first had stiffened the spring rates, reduced the suspension travel via stiffer sway bars and shocks. With these changes, I might be able to determine if the next weak spot is shock tower flex.

Therefore, I wouldn't waste the time and money unless you have made other serious changes to the suspension first and actually determine that it is needed.

 

Nicely said. You forgot to add that many aftermarket products rely on your inability to quantitatively disprove their claims of performance gains.

 

This is true. Many products also employ the premise that bad things will happen if they are not used. The fact that they wouldn't have happened anyway gets lost in the hype.

Years ago I offered bags of petrified voodoo chickens bones for sale. These were to be waved in front of the car in extreme cold weather to ensure that the engine started. Chanting was optional. If the engine started, this proved that the bones worked. If it didn't, the only possible explanations were that the bones were not waved long enough or hard enough, or in extreme cases, the owner needed to buy a second bag. I had a hard time keeping up but the local KFC sure enjoyed my frequent visits.

On a serious note- perhaps the best example (without starting another debate) is the subject of oil change frequency. Having been a member here for several years, I've noted a consistent pattern across just about every model of resisting the OEMs recommended interval, preferring a far more conservative number promoted by either old habits, what they've read on the interweebs or worst of all, by their local quick oil change shop.

10K mile oil change intervals are nothing new. They've been pretty much standard on many cars going back at least a decade, even longer in some cases. The newest generation of cars have a 15K interval. Despite the complete lack of evidence that this interval is in any way 'adventurous', there's many owners that believe it's the work of the devil and stick with a 3-5K interval instead.

The oil manufacturers and garages do nothing to discourage this of course...............

 

My personal view on oil change frequency is Dependent on how you drive, if you drive hard eg track days etc, my view is it should be changed more frequently.

It's also my personal view that changing the oil after 2-3k miles on a brand new car is good practice.

 

Please Mikey, may I re-introduce myself?

Some years ago, you sold me a perfectly good bag of pertrified voodoo chicken bones to help start my Jaguars. Recently, like me, their effect has been waning. Would your please advise price of similar second bag, air freighted to Alice Springs, Australia.

Will they also help in resurrecting my night exercises if I hang a bag over bed?

Please help urgent,
(signed)
Frustrated.

 

It will be my pleasure. How wonderful to hear from you again and I'm pleased to hear that you've received good service from your original shipment. I presume you've tried waving and shaking the bag of bones as hard, and for as long as you possibly can. I wonder also, although not usually necessary, if the ancient First nations chant of 'Ouwatta twatiam', might help. This has been know to make a big difference, especially if spoken in the presence of friends, family and neighbours.

If all this fails, I'll be glad to ship absolutely free of charge (you just cover shipping and handling of $19.95 USD, CDN or AUD) an additional bag of bones. Please be aware that we presently have only northern hemisphere winter season bones in stock, so there might be a slight delay in your order.

With respect to your other request regarding matters in the boudoir, may I suggest that you consider upgrading to our premium line of petrified voodoo turkey bones. As you may well imagine, these are considerably larger than the chicken variety. Although they may make claims to the contrary, the Sheilas seem to really go for them.

But wait! There's more! For a limited time only, the first 50 customers will not only receive a lifetime* supply of petrified voodoo chicken bones, a double economy** package of boudoir bones (TM) to please even the most demanding partner, but a carefully chosen length of genuine organic Canadian maple wood, culled from a tree that was blocking my view of the lake. This priceless, internationally recognized symbol of the Great White North has been individually selected for you, as a fellow Jaguar owner, as being suitable for carving into a front upper strut tower brace.

This elegant and unique addition to your motor car will attract unlimited attention at local car shows demonstrating once again, that you, as a returning customer, are one of a kind.

Please advise.


* the chicken's life, not yours.
**a huge bag with almost nothing in it. Great for my economy, not yours Bruce.

 

Mikey, Mikey Mikey;

You have certainly started off my new day with an uncontrollable belly laugh!!!
I tried rolling around the floor while laughing but that just made the room spin ...

Time for me to cry "Uncle!" - I never knew what this meant until I met this crazy North American way north of Jasper. He was about 9' tall with huge feet and all covered in long matted hair ...

But, I did notice he was dragging a huge sack of elk bones ...

Cheers,
Ken

 

In another thread-surrection, my coming from a Sube Forester is still taking some adaptation in driving approach from a boxy rally-esque car to an S-type 4.2. The Forester(and most Subes with a hood scoop) is the Chevy small block of the century-few remain stock.

That said, perhaps the 2nd most significant add-on I did, and most Sube owners do, was a straight across strut tower brace. The car tracks far better in a straight line and 'danced' less when turning in. Many guys even brace their rear towers with a removable bar that spans the inside cargo area. How they would affect the front of our S's remains to be seen but I can say that I feel the disjointedness or 'independent' movement of the front end, and my car just turned 11k miles so good as new there, ostensibly.

Bars are added by factories on their uber-performance models, M's, Shelbys, AMG, etc. Again, how our cars would respond to a proper bar remains to be seen. Often more stiffness in one place amplifies weakness elsewhere.

And if bracing the towers is an aftermarket hosing, why wouldn't all the race crews extant should toss their bars to save the weight?

 

See post #6

If bracing were needed then with cars 10-15 years old lots of owners would be using it. They're not.

However, by all means fit something if you want to.

Any S-Type that "dances" sounds to have something wrong and fixing it would be my suggestion.

 

Not so much 'needed' but rather would it improve the handling, tracking much if at all on the S?

Some tight cars out of the factory have just a slight improvement but 'loose' cars ala the Forester it made a trackable car out of a family CUV, that and the tires change and sway bars.

Without me looking and have only owned it for a month, is there a bar in there now along the firewall perhaps? I see used ones on fleabay for 2000 year models.

 

I should update the status on the offer above. Due to popular demand, the stock of genuine organic Canadian Maple offered has been completely depleted. My view of the lake has improved dramatically and for this I am most grateful.

Feedback from the recipients of the maple have confirmed that it made no d*mn difference to the handling of the cars, as expected. On the other hand most adult males enjoy getting wood no matter what the circumstances might be.

 

So beyond the glibness, no one here's actually done one or fabricated one and has no actual experience behind their opinions save for bone dust(which is carcinogenic btw). A tad ludditic, no?

But researching these, I see we have double wishbones up front so a tower bar makes less sense. Here's a well made amateur primer on bars:
The next question-has anyone found aftermarket curb feelers for the S-the ones in gold metalflake?

 

s/needed/wanted/

aka not much point

It's not a case of people being luddites as many posts should show you.

 

Well put now that I see our suspension setups. Buy one if you hit the track.

I can tell you that most Japanese rides 'need' one. My foul for not looking under the car 1st.

 

The relevance of Japanese cars is roughly zero.