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Sorry to drag this old one up- but I've now got the recurring P0442 code. I can cancel it it but it returns within a day or two. No other codes.
I've inspected the device shown in the picture below and see no obvious faults nor do I hear a hiss so there is no evidence that this component is the cause of the code.
In playing with it with the engine running, there is a ticking sound coming from the unit and if the S-shaped soft tube attached to the resonator is squeezed, a distinct pulsing can be felt. Does anyone know if this is normal, or is a sign that there is a fault?
I've also inspected the gas cap and see no faults.
Any ideas?
Originally Posted by nixx
UPDATE: The issue has been solved, I no longer have P0456 "very small evaporative emissions leak".
Firstly, I have to give major thanks to a local jaguarforums.com member mafioso for meeting up with me during a holiday week and helping me diagnose the problem with my car. I spent HUNDREDS of dollars with a local shop and they could not find the leak.. but mafioso was on the right track within minutes of opening my hood. Thank you Luigi.
Alrighty.. here is the issue.. I had a small crack in my Evaporative Emissions canister purge valve resonator.
The canister is poorly constructed and the edges seem to be easily cracked. Even my new canister looks a little shady on the edges. See the picture:
Jaguar does not sell this part by itself, but they do sell it with the evap purge valve along with a metal bracket. The Jag part # is XR830786. It cost me $99 at my local dealer.
This is basically what you receive (the pic is of my old broken one)
To remove and re-install this part is VERY easy. I can't believe the shop wanted to charge me several hours for this.
You simply un-clip the wire to the valve actuator, remove one hard-pipe vac line by pinching the release clips and pulling, and remove another vac line. Then,pull the unit off of the rubber bushings that suspend it in the air.. be careful to detach the last vac line which is a hard plastic clip pipe that is under the resonator. You're done.. now stick in the new one. (reverse the steps)
The 'kit' comes with a new metal mounting bracket.. but tha requires you to remove the bolts that hold your strut in place.. and I just didn't want to jack with that and have to re torque those down.. so I just removed the components and placed them onto my existing bracket. I used the new rubber bushings, though.
After the swap is done, reset your CEL.. go driving and make sure the light doesn't come back on. You can only "test" the evap system when there is between 1/4 and 3/4 of fuel on board.
I went to a flat piece of road.. accelerated briskly to 50 MPH.. held it for 2 min or so.. then let off the gas and let the car coast to a stop. I would idle for 4 minutes. After nearly 1 tank of gas and no CEL.. I knew it was fixed. I also went and got my car inspected today and the evap emissions test showed the car had done it's self check and it was PASS.
It's a solenoid valve isn't it? So you're probably/perhaps feeling it activating. A lot of the valves on the car have a duty cycle and are driven PWM (think square wave).
Would help if someone could confirm what you describe is normal
Not least because I suppose it could be that the valve is simply not behaving right.
Maybe some cautious propane spraying might show whether there's a leak but you might need to monitor with OBD to see anything happen. (I don't know whether you can be sure to hear engine revs change. The real techs know this stuff of course.)
I suppose it doesn't have to leak right at the valve, even if it IS a leak.
Maybe fuel trims would hint whether there's a leak.
I've also inspected the gas cap and see no faults.
Any ideas?
A gas cap that doesn't hold pressure MAY not show any flaws during a visual inspection.
Funny story, my old x type failed inspection due to the gas cap not holding pressure. (They test the cap separately).
I went and got an aftermarket once from advance auto, like $10. Put it on, the car passed inspection. Two days later I had a check engine light. I was like wtf. So I scanned it and it was an evap leak. Swapped the gas cap back to the original jaguar one, cleared the code and it never came back.
Long story short, change the gas cap, it's cheap. Or if you have a buddy swap for a couple days and see if the code comes back.
My local mechanic ran a smoke test on my '07 x-type for small leak on the evap system and found a leak. He had to replace the fuel pump tie down cap that had cracked. The part costs around $23 but the total with labor was $432.00.
Was told that if I had taken the vehicle to the dealer, I would have been charged per hour to diagnose....
so far the code is still off.....
Just thought I'd throw in a comment or two regarding EVAP leak faults and codes. One thing to remember, an EVAP leak code, may not mean there is a leak at all. You also have to take into account HOW the system attempts to determine EVAP system integrity. Cars up to 2006 MY all use the engine and it's manifold vacuum to do the test. That is, the ECM closes off the vent system, then APPLIES manifold vacuum to the tank by opening the CANISTER PURGE VALVE. Then it closes the Purge Valve an sees how long the vacuum takes to trail off. If it looses it quickly, it ASSUMES a big leak; looses it slowly, it ASSUMES small leak. Now, if it NEVER sees the vacuum at all, it ASSUMES what they call a rough leak, and sometimes says "check gas cap". In all cases, the fault is for a leak, but as I said, it may not be a leak at all. I may be a failure of the TESTING MEDIUM, vacuum.
By the same token, a failed vent valve that won't close properly for the test, results in the same thing; a fault for a "leak" because it can't hold vacuum for the test.
Just thought I'd throw that in....... knowledge is power!
Thats doesnt meen thats not your problem. And you either replace them or dont bother. Its a pia to get that caps on correctly and without distorting the seals doing it. And you need a special tool to remove the caps and tighten them. You can lift out the rear seat bottom and uncover the tank below the carpet jute and black covers and inspect for fuel staining, it might have staining or not..... But you can do this at least. You can diy the caps but i dont know people level of ability so its hard to say. Something easy for me is a nightmare for others.
On the recall, some were for tank replacement. Some for seals and checking, again it depends on who did you recall mayb they did/didnt check correctly. Or maybe was fine when done but now is not??????
Hi Brutal,
Do have the part numbers for the tank seals for a 2005 S-Type with a 4.2 V8? How many seals are needed? It looks like there are four opening in the top of the tank.
Thanks,
Jeff
Thats doesnt meen thats not your problem. And you either replace them or dont bother. Its a pia to get that caps on correctly and without distorting the seals doing it. And you need a special tool to remove the caps and tighten them. You can lift out the rear seat bottom and uncover the tank below the carpet jute and black covers and inspect for fuel staining, it might have staining or not..... But you can do this at least. You can diy the caps but i dont know people level of ability so its hard to say. Something easy for me is a nightmare for others.
On the recall, some were for tank replacement. Some for seals and checking, again it depends on who did you recall mayb they did/didnt check correctly. Or maybe was fine when done but now is not??????
Hi Brutal,
Do you have a list of the things to replace for a small evap leak?
I have 2005 S-Type 4.2 that had its tank replaced in 2008. Could the seals be bad now after so long a time?
Thanks,
Jeff
Jeff one thing to note. There is only one recall for the 2005 S Type and that's for the gas tank. Maybe when they fixed your car it was not done correctly?
A recall is a government mandated repair at the manufactures expense. So there is a chance the dealer will cover it. It seems like there is a 10 year window on getting the recall done so I don't know if this will help you or not? . . .
I followed Brutal's suggestion and checked the seals on the gas tank under rear seat. I had to fabricate a tool to turn the hold down clamps from 1" flat steel bar and it worked fine to remove the ring clamps.
When examining the seals they seemed clean and pliable. Coated them with a copper based gasket seal (impervious to gas) and reset the seals and covers. I tightened the rings as tight as I could with the fabbed tool.
Since that time I have gone through two tanks of gas and almost 500 miles without the P0456 error. Or, for that matter, any errors at all. YEA!!
I highly recommend to check the seals.
I have a P0456 code but I was told it came on because I used 87 in my 03 stype when I first bought it. Didn't know it took premium and didn't see the label on the gas door (I know, stupid me but it was extremely code when I bought the car and it was on E). Now a month later, been putting premium in it ever since and the light is still on. I guess it wasn't the gas or is it? Has anyone had this problem before and how the heck do I get the light to reset and see if it goes on again? I have disconnected the battery and left it off for an hour and the light is still on. I have only put about 150 miles on the car since I've been using premium now.
After examining the gas tank seals the P0456 went away for two tankfuls of gas. But, yesterday it came back. Same sequence as before in the DCU: P0456, P0442, P0455. P0456. P1000
Any further recommendations as to what to check? Do you think it could be a load of bad gas?
After examining the gas tank seals the P0456 went away for two tankfuls of gas. But, yesterday it came back. Same sequence as before in the DCU: P0456, P0442, P0455. P0456. P1000
Any further recommendations as to what to check? Do you think it could be a load of bad gas?
Thanks,
Jeff
2005 Jaguar S-Type 4.2 V8
Jeff,
You really need someone to properly diagnose your EVAP system. You are flagging faults for large leak, small leak and very small leak. Those are all faults that are detected by entirely separate on-board tests by the ECM. You don't know whether it really has a leak, or whether the testing system, which is the purge system, has a fault and CAN'T test the tank; all of which is INTERPRETED as [or ASSUMED to be] a leak by the ECM.
This definitely does not have anything to do with the gas.
Thanks for this post guys. My 05 STR had CE light on yesterday with P0456 and P0442 I am going to check this out this this weekend. I just replaced motor mounts and from the way it looks that part could have been damaged when the mount broke and the engine moved upwards.
In my case it turned out to be the valve pictured below. Internal failure.
Originally Posted by nixx
UPDATE: The issue has been solved, I no longer have P0456 "very small evaporative emissions leak".
Firstly, I have to give major thanks to a local jaguarforums.com member mafioso for meeting up with me during a holiday week and helping me diagnose the problem with my car. I spent HUNDREDS of dollars with a local shop and they could not find the leak.. but mafioso was on the right track within minutes of opening my hood. Thank you Luigi.
Alrighty.. here is the issue.. I had a small crack in my Evaporative Emissions canister purge valve resonator.
The canister is poorly constructed and the edges seem to be easily cracked. Even my new canister looks a little shady on the edges. See the picture:
Jaguar does not sell this part by itself, but they do sell it with the evap purge valve along with a metal bracket. The Jag part # is XR830786. It cost me $99 at my local dealer.
This is basically what you receive (the pic is of my old broken one)
To remove and re-install this part is VERY easy. I can't believe the shop wanted to charge me several hours for this.
You simply un-clip the wire to the valve actuator, remove one hard-pipe vac line by pinching the release clips and pulling, and remove another vac line. Then,pull the unit off of the rubber bushings that suspend it in the air.. be careful to detach the last vac line which is a hard plastic clip pipe that is under the resonator. You're done.. now stick in the new one. (reverse the steps)
The 'kit' comes with a new metal mounting bracket.. but tha requires you to remove the bolts that hold your strut in place.. and I just didn't want to jack with that and have to re torque those down.. so I just removed the components and placed them onto my existing bracket. I used the new rubber bushings, though.
After the swap is done, reset your CEL.. go driving and make sure the light doesn't come back on. You can only "test" the evap system when there is between 1/4 and 3/4 of fuel on board.
I went to a flat piece of road.. accelerated briskly to 50 MPH.. held it for 2 min or so.. then let off the gas and let the car coast to a stop. I would idle for 4 minutes. After nearly 1 tank of gas and no CEL.. I knew it was fixed. I also went and got my car inspected today and the evap emissions test showed the car had done it's self check and it was PASS.
From previous posts by Brutal his suggested attack for P0456 Codes is to 1) replace gas cap (not usual for P0456) 2) Replace purge valve and resonator, 3) Replace fuel tank seals 4) Replace Evap Canister Close Valve.
I have done everything, but #4 because I cannot locate the canister close valve on my 2005 S-Type. In the parts breakdown it shows the valve for 2000 - 2003, but for 2004, 2005 it says, "N.A." which I assume means "Not Applicable". Does that mean the 2004/2005 S-Types do not have a close valve? Or, is it contained with the canister?
Done a smoke test several times without finding leak. Here is the image of the IPB for the Evap conister close solenoid:
The part number for the solenoid has N.A. in its place. That is the reason for my question. I am trying to find it or where it may be hiding on my Jag.
08-26-2012, 12:14 PM
