(2005 S-Type 3.0, 75K)

I know you ladies and gentlemen know these things in and out from experience and while I have common sense, I like to know what is going on and especially know that JoycesJag has had much to say in this subject.

First a quick recap. the first post of the matter is here, but summary is that I over washed the engine got #3 wet, had rough idle and misfire. Drove around dried it off and everything seemed to be fine- minus a pending p0420. I could drive at 125mph, go up a hill at 65 and slip into passing gear and no problem. I had reset the battery, cleared the codes and was checking frequently and would see some pending codes about bit left and right no2 sensors and then gone and no misfire or anything of the like, but still a pesky pending p0420.
https://www.jaguarforums.com/forum/s...-i-do-120285/y




yesterday morning after having driven from Dallas to Fort Worth and back without any trouble and averaged about 75 both ways- I was going up a hill and stomped to the passing gear and then at about 5800-6000 rpm went into a minor RP and then it cleared after I took my foot off the pedal.


I immediately stopped and had pending codes p 0300, 0301, 0305 and 1316 (along withe the expected p1000) No other incident and I drove back about 15 miles at about 75-80 mph, but never tried to slip a foot to the floor and passing gear. Came home parked, cleared the pending and drove today and with no indication showed pending p0300, p0302 and p0306 and p1316.



The other one incident I had had today was with AC on high/recirl mode, I all of a sudden had what i would describe as a slight uptick in the blower motor to what I am normally use to when on high.it stayed there and did not go up and/ or down ofter that.


I then remember what has been said on this forum about how sensitive these cars are to batteries. I have a Bosch Prem. Performance battery that with it's 36 month warranty is sitting at at 54 months of service.


My obvious question is whether or not my battery is a potential cause for these misfires or that at higher or even lower rpms am I having trouble with a constant electrical power issue. I know that a bad cat can mimic certain issues and fool the pcm into thinking it is a misfire when it is not. Opinions, suggestion thoughts. I always keep the MAF very clean, new air filter every 2 months, use mostly Shell prem. Jag under extended warranty has replaced a number of manifold gaskets, IMT gaskets, timing cover gaskets, sump gasket, crankshaft seals, intake gaskets/O rings (you get the idea) and I have no oil leaks. Do not have a rough idle, fuel mileage is fine, acceleration is fine.

The freeze frame on the code p0300 is as follows- what seems off and since it has shown 300, 301, 302, 305, 306 is this a false /positive from the cat or is this a battery/electrical problem.


2005 Jaguar S-Type 3.0

View Freeze Data

P0300 (MOD $11)

TROUB CODE P0300
ABSLT TPS(%) 34.1
ENG SPEED(RPM) 2480
CALC LOAD(%) 55.3
MAF(LB/M) 6.29
MAP("HG) 26.3
COOLANT(°F) 208
IAT(°F) 97
IGN ADV(°) 18.0
ST FTRM1(%) -8.6
ST FTRM2(%) 3.9
LT FTRM1(%) -14.1
LT FTRM2(%) 10.2
VEH SPEED(MPH) 67
FUEL PRES(PSI) 57
FUEL SYS 1 CLSD
FUEL SYS 2 CLSD








Do not know if this will help, but
I also got some feedback on the 02 sensors

02 bank 1, sensor 2

max V for cycle

max-0.500 (V)
meas 0.945 (V)
min 0.300 (V)

min V for cycle

max- 0.500 (V)
meas- 0.000 (V)
min - 0.0300 (V)

02 bank 2 sensor 2

Max V for cycle

max- 0.500 (V)
meas-0.930(V)
min- 0.300 (V)

Min V for cycle

max-0.500 (V)
meas- 0.005 (V)
min- 0.300 (V)


If it helps here are the data from idle and 2500 rpm

--------

FRAME: 2 TM: 8.7
MIL STATUS Off
ABSLT TPS(%) 7.8
ENG SPEED(RPM) 766
CALC LOAD(%) 27.1
MAF(LB/M) 0.95
MAP("HG) 14.8
COOLANT(°F) 145
IAT(°F) 118
IGN ADV(°) 8.0
ST FTRM1(%) 2.3
ST FTRM2(%) 0.8
LT FTRM1(%) -4.7
LT FTRM2(%) -1.6
VEH SPEED(MPH) 0
FUEL PRES(PSI) 55
FUEL SYS 1 CLSD
FUEL SYS 2 CLSD
O2S12(V) 0.320
ST FTRM12(%) -0.8
O2S22(V) 0.055
ST FTRM22(%) 0.0
EQ RATIO11 1.030
O2S11(mA) -0.098
EQ RATIO21 1.021
O2S21(mA) 0.148
MIL DIST(mi) 0
OBD2 STAT CA/US
---------------------



FRAME: 9 TM: 39.3
MIL STATUS Off
ABSLT TPS(%) 14.1
ENG SPEED(RPM) 2596
CALC LOAD(%) 21.2
MAF(LB/M) 2.58
MAP("HG) 10.6
COOLANT(°F) 156
IAT(°F) 111
IGN ADV(°) 44.5
ST FTRM1(%) -3.1
ST FTRM2(%) -6.3
LT FTRM1(%) -6.3
LT FTRM2(%) 5.5
VEH SPEED(MPH) 0




Thanks as always


Tom in Dallas
2005 S-Type 3.0 75 K

 

Have the IMT valves had attention as the stickies detail?

Otherwise bad coils would be quite likely but check no oil etc in the plug wells.

 

I would have to go and re look at the repair order.

I suspect that the #3 coil which git hit in my washing nonsense of the engine and went crazy until dried off is the problem child. noticed that when I was in cold, started the car and then drove 100 yards to the light and waited for it to change that i had a slight roughness in the idle. If I did not know the car as well as i do or someone else may or my not have paid attention to it, but clearly was there. I suspect that #3 got some damage or some junk was left on it for the degreaser, bay's engine cleaner, soap and water.

The dealer wants $143 for the coils 9which is way beyond reason.

I believe these are Denso that Rock sells for $46.00

Am I correct in that view?

What sort of attention should the IMT valves have under normal circumstances?

Thanks

Tom in Dallas

 

I think it's still left over from the water on the engine. I would pull all the coils and use compressed air to really blow them out nice and dry. Both the coil and boot and the spark plug well.

Or just replace them since your car is old. I can’t remember if you have already changed coils or not?

If you read a bit the IMT valves had an O-ring update. Very similar to the ZF transmission sleeve problem. So you get seepage with the old O-rings.
.
.
.

 

Yes they have done the o-rings on the imts.

I would like to change my plugs and potentially coil packs, however the learning curve ion removing the manifold to get to the spark plug on #3 and the coil and spark plug on #5 is not in my wheelhouse.

As I look at it and from what I can tell with my hand, I should be able to replace the coil on #3 with a little effort.

What would be a reasonable (obviously not a dealer) price to pay for changing the plugs and the coils on this car? Or do i really need to change the coils if they are not bad. Also (and I know this could spark a major discussion (any idea on the best plugs for the car?) I usually like to put in the best on those things, then there is overkill. Understand NTK has a size problem?? What about top of the line Bosche or what do these cars like?

The Denso plugs are the makers of the Jag coils as I understand. i called park place in Dallas (need a good laugh) to see what they would charge and they said the coils would cost $143 and parts guy confirmed they were made by Denso.

The coil part part is actually
C2S42673

Jagbits sells the the oem coil for $69. That sounds like a good price to me.
However I get the impression you think it may be moisture (or something like that-could have been the cleaner) vs an actual coil failure.

Thanks

Tom in Dallas

 

If you have a 2005 then 1,3,5 are the same bank - so if you can get at #3 you can get at 5.

Plugs due every 70K miles but don't tend to cause misfires in reality, whereas coils do.

Coils are stressed and fail with time. They can be contaminated and might clean but might not. If you're good at DIY and don't mind repeatedly taking stuff apart then cleaning and swapping coils between cylinders is an option, otherwise fitting a new one looks to save extra work. (Trade off between DIY, more than once, and money.)

 

I think my question was a little different. If you remember had a previous post about washing the engine and quite clearly I had an issue with #3.

https://www.jaguarforums.com/forum/s...d-i-do-120285/

That got dried out or whatever with driving. However, I think due to use of degreaser and the bays's own engine cleaner and soap under pressure and rinse water under pressure and with hot Texas temp that I left a residual "something" on the coil #3 (maybe others) and have a potential slight but still picked up by the ecm at higher speeds- voltage drop or inconsistency.

My question only involves the coil. Clearly I cannot get to #5 without 6 hours of work on a first time deal with huge number of plug-in, hoses and other assorted gaskets and junk to remove the manifold. I have not done this and have no one I know that has done this and a first time learning curve could leave me without transportation or income and so that is not something I am willing to do. So that is why i asked the question as to what is a reasonable price to pay for getting the coils and plugs (I will buy the parts) to be replaced.

Short of that, as I have a huge number of clients to attend to and am moving homes this month, is to look at coil #3. As I look at the engine, it would appear, with some effort and finesse that I can get coil #3 (not the plug) out and replaced if necessary or out enough to clean ???? I am just asking if that has been done before or any trick to this? I am the type that once where I need to be wuld just as soon save the time and put in a new part rather than go back and do it again- only to put in a new part.

Thanks again for the help and thoughts. I wish i enjoyed working on cars, but to me a car problem is like going to the dentist for several days of nonstop teeth work- a quite unpleasant and stressful enterprise.

Regardless, I am on the 50-53 months of a 36 month (warranty battery) and as a maintenance issue am going to get a new AGM type.


Tom in Dallas

 

Why can you get at 3 but not 5? Either the manifold has to come off for 3 or it does not and 5 is in the same bank so no extra manifold-related work is needed.

Are you looking at the correct layout of cylinders for your engine???

 

Tom, Bite the bullet. Go see Bob (Motorcarman).. I did.

Change all the coils and plugs at one time. Your car is OLD. no avoiding it.

 

1-3-5 are on the manifold/passenger side. 1 is easy to get to, 3 is slight under the manifold, but still accessible. there is no way to get to 5 to do anything. I just want to look at the coil for right now. I have attached my cylinder layout. This is a 2005 3.0. I assume that what I have attached is correct.


This is what a jag mechanic wrote me elsewhere: "have actually been able to replace that cylinder #3 coil without removing the intake. I use a shallow 8mm socket with a ratchet to break it free. Once you remove the bolt use a long small pick to pop off the connector. Then with some maneuvering the coil can be remove".

Tom in Dallas

 

How soon did he get the work done and what type of charges did you incur. You can pm me if you want. Did you use your own parts or let him get. I refuse to pay Park Place $143 for the exact same item (coil) I can get at Jagbits for $69. That is what I want to do anyway, but until the end of the month - time is of the essence to me.

Tom in Dallas

 

Today is the first day of the month, you will have to endure a crap car for 31 days.

Search his user profile for his info. I don't have time to do it now.

His prices are about half the dealer, little out of the way but worth it.

Use only JAG OEM coils, the others are garbage.

 

I will only use those and the same one with the exact same model code is $75 cheaper at jag bits. Curious as to what happens with the others- do they just fail early or provide something to the ecm that causes a problem. The car is driving fine minus a very very minor roughness at cold idle or if I really go pedal to the floor and even that will vary (sometimes happens and sometimes not). It is why I know there has to be that inconsistency on the spark and the trim levels show that and I have no vacuum leak, having already checked. It is what I did to myself and now have to pay the piper, but I would have changed all of those before the end of the year anyway.

Thanks for the help.

Tom in Dallas