Upper front bushings - no middle ground?
#61
#62
99 XJR Spring Compressor(s)
These are the details for the spring compressors I made for the front springs on my 99 XJR. They were only used to compress the springs enough to unload the spring pan enough to remove the lower/ rear wishbone arm so I could take them to a machine shop to have the old ball joints removed and new ones pressed in. I'm not sure if this design would provide enough travel to remove the springs from the car entirely as I didn't try that.
I borrowed this design from Sean B or Motorcarman (sorry I can't remember which) who'd kindly posted it on an BB for the previous gen XJ's. The only change I made was to eliminate the ball in the middle of 2 sets of spherical bearings as the bearings (in my judgement) are providing the ability to tip slightly. I think I found the other design in a google search for "jaguar xj spring compressor" but don't quote me on that.
I bought the parts thru McMaster-Carr. they have an easy to search website and it was easy to set up an account with them. They ship quickly and also provide drawings of most of their parts so you can check your design dimensions rather than guessing.
Parts list:
I used a vise to press the dowels into the shafts and then a punch to get them to extend evenly from either side.
Then it's just a matter of stacking things, jacking up the front end (15" tall jack stands gave me plenty of clearance.), and walking the nut up the rod until the spring was compressed (partially). I lifted the spring until the lower arm was approx level which may have been a little too far as I had a slight clearance issue removing the lower wishbone arm but with some wiggling it came out of the car (and went back in).
You'll need to remove the 4 steering rack bolts and allow the rack to hang in order to get enough clearance to get the eccentric bolt out of the lower arm pivot.
I also found I needed to pull outwards on the bottom of the threaded rod while I was loading everything up. The first time I loaded everything up I noticed binding and backed everything off. Upon inspection of the compressor I found I was shearing off the high points of some of the threads with the spring pan. Pulling out alleviated that. It should go without saying that everything on the spring compressor needs to be liberally greased, threads and all mating surfaces.
I borrowed this design from Sean B or Motorcarman (sorry I can't remember which) who'd kindly posted it on an BB for the previous gen XJ's. The only change I made was to eliminate the ball in the middle of 2 sets of spherical bearings as the bearings (in my judgement) are providing the ability to tip slightly. I think I found the other design in a google search for "jaguar xj spring compressor" but don't quote me on that.
I bought the parts thru McMaster-Carr. they have an easy to search website and it was easy to set up an account with them. They ship quickly and also provide drawings of most of their parts so you can check your design dimensions rather than guessing.
Parts list:
- 1 meter long grade 10.9 fully threaded rod, M20 x 2.5
- (4) class 12 M20 x 2.5 hex nuts
- 91131A110 black oxide alignment washer male & female set (4)
- grade 8 oversized washer 7/8" ID (pack of 10)
- grade 8 oversized flat washer, ID 3/4" (pack of 10)
- 98381A544 alloy steel dowel, 1/4" dia x 1.25" lg (pack of 25)
I used a vise to press the dowels into the shafts and then a punch to get them to extend evenly from either side.
Then it's just a matter of stacking things, jacking up the front end (15" tall jack stands gave me plenty of clearance.), and walking the nut up the rod until the spring was compressed (partially). I lifted the spring until the lower arm was approx level which may have been a little too far as I had a slight clearance issue removing the lower wishbone arm but with some wiggling it came out of the car (and went back in).
You'll need to remove the 4 steering rack bolts and allow the rack to hang in order to get enough clearance to get the eccentric bolt out of the lower arm pivot.
I also found I needed to pull outwards on the bottom of the threaded rod while I was loading everything up. The first time I loaded everything up I noticed binding and backed everything off. Upon inspection of the compressor I found I was shearing off the high points of some of the threads with the spring pan. Pulling out alleviated that. It should go without saying that everything on the spring compressor needs to be liberally greased, threads and all mating surfaces.
Last edited by dwgates; 07-04-2016 at 07:18 PM. Reason: spelling, list qty error
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harvest14 (07-04-2016)
#63
#64
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Here is my spring compressor set I made about 11 yrs ago. I had to dig them up, hadn't used them in awhile. These will fit under the car with enough clearance while on a set up jack stands that are set about 14" at the cars jack point, if I recall properly.
As you can see, they are quite easy to make, only you now have the dimensions to quickly cut the pieces down to size. I bought everything at an overage place (the all-thread and nuts) or ACE. I don't believe Homer or Lowes carries grade 8 bolts, but you'll have to verify for yourself, but I know ACE has them. I did get the galvanized "spacer" from Homer. Buy yourself a ratcheting box end wrench from Harbor Freight (cheap but effective), you won't regret it. A socket isn't deep enough as you compress.
One of the pics description is kinda fuzzy and not visible (sorry). It says.... 3" long, 1" OD ....(outer diameter)
As you can see, they are quite easy to make, only you now have the dimensions to quickly cut the pieces down to size. I bought everything at an overage place (the all-thread and nuts) or ACE. I don't believe Homer or Lowes carries grade 8 bolts, but you'll have to verify for yourself, but I know ACE has them. I did get the galvanized "spacer" from Homer. Buy yourself a ratcheting box end wrench from Harbor Freight (cheap but effective), you won't regret it. A socket isn't deep enough as you compress.
One of the pics description is kinda fuzzy and not visible (sorry). It says.... 3" long, 1" OD ....(outer diameter)
Last edited by Highhorse; 07-04-2016 at 03:33 PM.
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harvest14 (07-04-2016)
#66
ahah! I used the trick "insert image" button that must be there to keep people busy, but not insert pictures!
The first picture shows both compressors, one disassembled
the second, fuzzy picture shows the cross drilled pin ~5/8" below the end of the rod (3/4" wouldn't fit)
the third shows the 2 washer sizes, big ones go against the bottom of the spring pan and kind of fit the drawn well to locate the compressor (I found it helped to bias the rod out, away from the car, until it was loaded up)
the 4th shows 1 pair of self aligning washers, 2 pairs per compressor, back to back
the last picture shows a flat I filed on the rod so I could center punch for the cross hole. I drilled a 15/64" hole then a 1/4" hole and got a nice tight slip fit.
I used 2 M20 nuts on each compressor as a safety and the second works as a rest for the box wrench while loading things up.
The whole thing was cheap enough I splurged on a 30 mm ratcheting box wrench to add to my tool kit and save a little time.
An error in my shopping list I had 2 pairs of self aligning washers when it was actually 4 (2 per compressor)
The first picture shows both compressors, one disassembled
the second, fuzzy picture shows the cross drilled pin ~5/8" below the end of the rod (3/4" wouldn't fit)
the third shows the 2 washer sizes, big ones go against the bottom of the spring pan and kind of fit the drawn well to locate the compressor (I found it helped to bias the rod out, away from the car, until it was loaded up)
the 4th shows 1 pair of self aligning washers, 2 pairs per compressor, back to back
the last picture shows a flat I filed on the rod so I could center punch for the cross hole. I drilled a 15/64" hole then a 1/4" hole and got a nice tight slip fit.
I used 2 M20 nuts on each compressor as a safety and the second works as a rest for the box wrench while loading things up.
The whole thing was cheap enough I splurged on a 30 mm ratcheting box wrench to add to my tool kit and save a little time.
An error in my shopping list I had 2 pairs of self aligning washers when it was actually 4 (2 per compressor)
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harvest14 (07-23-2016)
#68
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#69
The Ford part numbers for the 4 control arms that fit my 2004 XJ8 are as follows:
6W4Z3085AA (MCSOE-39 on Motorcraft box)
6W4A3084AA (MCSOE-38 on Motorcraft box)
6W4Z5500AA
6W4Z5500AB
They all fit perfectly. I bought the rear arms from delraymotorsparts on ebay for less than $150 each. They are brand new OEM Jaguar parts as best I can tell. They came in a Ford Motorcraft box--it looks to me like Lincoln used Jaguar parts on the Lincoln LS rather than the other way around; they are hard-stamped "Jaguar" on the arm itself. There are some aftermarket parts out there--if you want OEM be careful to read the fine print carefully when you order.
I've done a lot of research and it appears to me that ordering the arm is the only way to get OEM bushings for the rear arms. I haven't found them standalone anywhere.
I replaced all of the wishbones and all bushings that are replaceable, with OEM. I have part numbers and suppliers if you need them.
Good luck with your repair.
6W4Z3085AA (MCSOE-39 on Motorcraft box)
6W4A3084AA (MCSOE-38 on Motorcraft box)
6W4Z5500AA
6W4Z5500AB
They all fit perfectly. I bought the rear arms from delraymotorsparts on ebay for less than $150 each. They are brand new OEM Jaguar parts as best I can tell. They came in a Ford Motorcraft box--it looks to me like Lincoln used Jaguar parts on the Lincoln LS rather than the other way around; they are hard-stamped "Jaguar" on the arm itself. There are some aftermarket parts out there--if you want OEM be careful to read the fine print carefully when you order.
I've done a lot of research and it appears to me that ordering the arm is the only way to get OEM bushings for the rear arms. I haven't found them standalone anywhere.
I replaced all of the wishbones and all bushings that are replaceable, with OEM. I have part numbers and suppliers if you need them.
Good luck with your repair.
Last edited by Dan.B; 07-13-2016 at 10:58 AM.
#70
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King Charles (07-13-2016)
#71
Yes, I am aware. There was no indication in his posting that he has an x308 or an x350--I do not know how you know he has an x308. He was apparently responding to a posting I made in this forum about buying suspension parts in general, for an x308 or an x350 (or for any other Jaguar really).
In my earlier post I clearly stated that my car is an x350. I knew the posting was coming from the x308 forum and I wasn't sure what he has, so I again identified the vehicle that I have as an x350 in the first sentence.
I hope my information was helpful to him if he has an x350. If he has an x308 he will understand that the parts I purchased were for a different car.
In my earlier post I clearly stated that my car is an x350. I knew the posting was coming from the x308 forum and I wasn't sure what he has, so I again identified the vehicle that I have as an x350 in the first sentence.
I hope my information was helpful to him if he has an x350. If he has an x308 he will understand that the parts I purchased were for a different car.
#72
Thanks again for all of the spring compressor information. I am still tentatively planning to perform all of this work during my vacation the first week in August. There are plans being thrown around however about taking the kids to the beach, so...we'll see. I may have to postpone again.
But, I have an additional question I'd like to ask. I try to do the maintenance on the cars of various church members who have a limited budget. One of my pastor friends dropped off his Solara because it was making a "noise" in the front end. My reflex was CV joints, because they are so commonly bad. I've done about a dozen of those. After some investigating however it seems the front drivers side wheel bearing may be the culprit. During this diagnostic process it raised some questions about the wheel bearings on MY car, the 2003 XJR.
I don't think they make any noise when driving, however the cabin of that car is very well insulated so I can't be sure. When I did the brakes I noticed the wheels are not terribly easy to turn. They require a little force and the stop spinning as soon as the tire is released. I was concerned when I discovered that on the LHS front tire, but when I did the RHS and it was exactly the same I figured maybe that was just normal for these bearings.
Is it at ALL possible that the wheel bearings could be contributing to the occasional front end bumpiness? The slight movement in the steering wheel on uneven pavement? Would it be overkill to replace the wheel bearings while I am replacing all of the bushing, ball joints and tie-rod ends? I say overkill because I don't really have evidence that they are bad. If I wiggle the wheel with my hands at 3 and 9, or at 12 and 6 (O'clock) they don't have any play in them. They feel solid.
Thanks
But, I have an additional question I'd like to ask. I try to do the maintenance on the cars of various church members who have a limited budget. One of my pastor friends dropped off his Solara because it was making a "noise" in the front end. My reflex was CV joints, because they are so commonly bad. I've done about a dozen of those. After some investigating however it seems the front drivers side wheel bearing may be the culprit. During this diagnostic process it raised some questions about the wheel bearings on MY car, the 2003 XJR.
I don't think they make any noise when driving, however the cabin of that car is very well insulated so I can't be sure. When I did the brakes I noticed the wheels are not terribly easy to turn. They require a little force and the stop spinning as soon as the tire is released. I was concerned when I discovered that on the LHS front tire, but when I did the RHS and it was exactly the same I figured maybe that was just normal for these bearings.
Is it at ALL possible that the wheel bearings could be contributing to the occasional front end bumpiness? The slight movement in the steering wheel on uneven pavement? Would it be overkill to replace the wheel bearings while I am replacing all of the bushing, ball joints and tie-rod ends? I say overkill because I don't really have evidence that they are bad. If I wiggle the wheel with my hands at 3 and 9, or at 12 and 6 (O'clock) they don't have any play in them. They feel solid.
Thanks
#74
Hi Bcrary3, I saw your ad to rent the tool, but that's a little bit out of my price range. If I could rent it for what it would cost me to build one I would jump at the chance.
I understand the tool was expensive. I am not complaining. I appreciate the offer.
For those of you who've done this job before, does the tool in the following link look like it would work?
http://www.ebay.com/itm/Coil-Spring-...843656&vxp=mtr
I understand the tool was expensive. I am not complaining. I appreciate the offer.
For those of you who've done this job before, does the tool in the following link look like it would work?
http://www.ebay.com/itm/Coil-Spring-...843656&vxp=mtr
Last edited by harvest14; 07-23-2016 at 03:43 PM.
#75
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Hey Harvest, tough decision...beach....work on car...hmmmm?...lol
Btw, I built my spring compressors for about $25, ...the ones pictured.
Anyways, your inspection of the bearing seems to eliminate the bearing as an issue. I had a very bad bearing on mine when I first bought it. It made a rowling noise when I went into a corner it was so bad, but it rode smooth. The other bearing I found doing the process you mentioned. So unless you want to do it just because you have it apart, that would be your choice...other than that I wouldn't be concerned.
....I am leaning toward the beach though...
Btw, I built my spring compressors for about $25, ...the ones pictured.
Anyways, your inspection of the bearing seems to eliminate the bearing as an issue. I had a very bad bearing on mine when I first bought it. It made a rowling noise when I went into a corner it was so bad, but it rode smooth. The other bearing I found doing the process you mentioned. So unless you want to do it just because you have it apart, that would be your choice...other than that I wouldn't be concerned.
....I am leaning toward the beach though...
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harvest14 (07-24-2016)
#76
wheel bearings...
Mr Harvest,
When I had my XJR up in the air for my laundry list of suspension & brake work a month or so ago I was wondering the same thing. Spinning the wheels is a tough way (for me anyway) to tell if the bearings are bad, unless they're really bad. Play in the wheel isn't a good test for bearings either as they have to be really bad to show play. Most of mine start grumbling well ahead of developing play I can feel at the wheel.
I had just such a grumble in my e39 beemer and when I lifted each corner to spin each wheel couldn't find the culprit. I did find I had some pronounced ridges outside the pad areas on my rotors so I ordered those parts.
I removed the first wheel, rotor, pads, & caliper and when I spun the hub couldn't believe how bad the bearing felt. Notchy, noisy, and definitely bad yet I couldn't tell a thing with the tire in place.
Replacing the front wheel bearings is a tough job (IMHO) on our cars and you're right, you'll be part way there when you get everything apart for the ball joints but you may as well take everything off and spin the bare hub to get the best idea about the bearing condition.
When I had mine apart and spun the hubs the bearings felt fine, nice and smooth and quiet. The knocking and other noises were apparently due to the ball joints, shock bushings, and sway bar end links as the old girl rides nice and quiet now. I have about 85k on the odometer for reference.
BTW, I haven't replaced a CV joint in a coon's age and the ones I did had cracked boots. I've replaced lots of front wheel bearings on front drive cars. They're better than they used to be but still seem to be a weak link...
When I had my XJR up in the air for my laundry list of suspension & brake work a month or so ago I was wondering the same thing. Spinning the wheels is a tough way (for me anyway) to tell if the bearings are bad, unless they're really bad. Play in the wheel isn't a good test for bearings either as they have to be really bad to show play. Most of mine start grumbling well ahead of developing play I can feel at the wheel.
I had just such a grumble in my e39 beemer and when I lifted each corner to spin each wheel couldn't find the culprit. I did find I had some pronounced ridges outside the pad areas on my rotors so I ordered those parts.
I removed the first wheel, rotor, pads, & caliper and when I spun the hub couldn't believe how bad the bearing felt. Notchy, noisy, and definitely bad yet I couldn't tell a thing with the tire in place.
Replacing the front wheel bearings is a tough job (IMHO) on our cars and you're right, you'll be part way there when you get everything apart for the ball joints but you may as well take everything off and spin the bare hub to get the best idea about the bearing condition.
When I had mine apart and spun the hubs the bearings felt fine, nice and smooth and quiet. The knocking and other noises were apparently due to the ball joints, shock bushings, and sway bar end links as the old girl rides nice and quiet now. I have about 85k on the odometer for reference.
BTW, I haven't replaced a CV joint in a coon's age and the ones I did had cracked boots. I've replaced lots of front wheel bearings on front drive cars. They're better than they used to be but still seem to be a weak link...
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harvest14 (07-24-2016)
#77
Hi Bcrary3, I saw your ad to rent the tool, but that's a little bit out of my price range. If I could rent it for what it would cost me to build one I would jump at the chance.
I understand the tool was expensive. I am not complaining. I appreciate the offer.
For those of you who've done this job before, does the tool in the following link look like it would work?
Coil Spring Compressor | eBay
I understand the tool was expensive. I am not complaining. I appreciate the offer.
For those of you who've done this job before, does the tool in the following link look like it would work?
Coil Spring Compressor | eBay
#78
ebay link...
Mr Harvest,
Sorry I didn't notice you had an ebay link to a spring compressor. I don't know what that one is for but it's not for one of our cars. It doesn't have the cross pin at the top.
I'd either rent the real tool or make one (or two, they're cheap) of the fake tools.
Personally if I were completely unloading the spring I'd be nervous with my home made version. They might work but these springs seem really long unloaded and need to swing thru quite an arc.
For removing the suspension arms though I think the homemade version works well.
Sorry I didn't notice you had an ebay link to a spring compressor. I don't know what that one is for but it's not for one of our cars. It doesn't have the cross pin at the top.
I'd either rent the real tool or make one (or two, they're cheap) of the fake tools.
Personally if I were completely unloading the spring I'd be nervous with my home made version. They might work but these springs seem really long unloaded and need to swing thru quite an arc.
For removing the suspension arms though I think the homemade version works well.
#79
#80
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