Ok...so is this my "big 3" or what? All within a week my headliner has started to pull away, my rear passenger door lock has stopped working electronically and then today, this one:

So I backed out of my driveway and for the FIRST time since I had the car put it into 2nd (Automatic Transmission) and as soon as I did the powertrain malfunction light came on and my heart just sank. However the car drove just fine. So I pulled over and turned off the car and then turned it back on and the light was gone. So the rest of the day I just drove in Drive and all is still running fine.

Well tonight I really wanted to explore this more so I took her out for a ride. I did the same thing I did this morning and put it in 2nd and on came the light again (Light does not come on in third...only when I go into 2nd at the tip of the J. So once again I pull over, turn off the car and then turn it back on and the light is gone. So then I go for a long ride into the country and I switch over to 4th and back to drive and back to 4th...all is well. Transmission is switching perfect and also in Sport mode it is working fine. When I got down to speed I put it into 3rd and everything ran fine and no warning light. So now get this...I decide to drop it down into 2nd again and now only did the powertrain light come on but the engine light came on this time!!!! What the hell is going on??? So when I get home and in my garage I turn the car off and back on again and once again the powertrain light goes away BUT the engine light is now on all the time now.

Ok....no limp mode....tranny working just as it should (at least I am pretty sure...drove great) so what the heck is going on? I really don't need this as I am starting to get that regret now for buying this car. I can live with replacing a headliner or a door lock....but having this is just unacceptable. I have only had the car a tad over a month and with only 15k on it and a perfect service record (over serviced actually).

Please can someone give me some good news that this is an easy fix or just something being finicky.

BTW...this car had the factory recall on the tranny and was replaced in 2004 just as an FYI.


peace out,
daddylogan

 

daddylogan, first things first. Get the code(s) read from the OBD port to give us an idea of what the car may be seeing. This will help us give you more detailed information and a potential repair path.

Secondly, the lights in the car are programmed differently. The ABS and tranny lights will only light when a problem is seen and as soon as the car is turned off, they go off too. Only if the problem is still there will the light come back on. Where the CEL light is programmed to stay on for 5 drive cycles after the problem has cleared itself (unless manually reset, then may come right back on if the problem is still present). So, hearing that the CEL light is still on is nothing to get worried about.

From the sounds of things, one of the shift solenoid may be having issues. Otherwise, you may be having a problem where some wiring is making contact inside the center console that is only an issue when the J-gate is placed all the way over to "2". This is where the code(s) are going to tell us a lot.

For the moment, try not to place the J-gate into the 2 position as this seems to be the source of your problem.

 

+1

Don't overthink, just read the codes.

 

Thanks Thermo...always appreciate you taking the time to help brother!

Good news this morning. I get ready to go out and buy a cheap OBDII reader (Autozone does not do code reading in California anymore...FYI for all other Cal Jag owners) and I start the car and the engine light is off now. Drove around and did many errands and it drove fine and no warning lights what so ever. Naturally I took your advice and just left my car in D and avoided 2nd position.

So I just ordered the OBDII reader I wanted to buy (The Kiwi 3) and I will have that by Monday and then see what codes are firing off to get that 2nd gear problem resolved.

Stay tuned and thanks!!!

peace out,
daddylogan

 

Thermo - so I installed my new KIWI 3 today and read the codes while the car was idling in my garage. The codes that came back are P1780 and P1000

I took my car on a 300 mile trip this weekend and it ran beautifully and no lights or anything.

So once again as a recap, the Powertrain light only comes on when I put the J gate into 2nd and at no other time. The only way I can get the light to go off is to stop the car and restart and then it is gone. The engine light has not come on since I first posted this thread.

I am hoping this will be just a slight adjustment on a switch or something as everything is running great.

Thanks as always for everyone's time.

peace out,
daddylogan

 

daddylogan, looking up the code, it is saying that there is a problem with the D-4 gear switch inside the J-gate. what I would say to do is to get into the center console and find the 10 wire plug powering the J-gate. If you look at the plug, you should see down near the pins some numbers (1 thru 10). You want to locate Pin #8 (if you look on the plug connected to the car, this will have a black wire attached to it incase you can't read the numbers, should also be the middle pin on the bottom row). When I reference taking a measurement, it will be to this pin.

Now, if you take a multimeter and put it to resistance (the 2K ohm scale), if you check the following points, you should see the multimeter indicate greater than 2K ohm when the gear selector is not in the stated gear and less than 5 ohms when it is in that gear. The following pins relate to the gear in question:

1: Drive
2: Neutral
3: 2
4: 3
7: Reverse
9: Park

Pin 5 is not used and pins 6 and 10 are used for letting the ECM know that the gear selector is in a position to allow the motor to start.

Now, something that I find interesting is that there is no wire for gear 4. So, the Pin 5 may be for this.

What you may find is that according to the information that I have, this problem can also be caused by the shifter cable not being adjusted correctly (which would be hinted at by the location of where the issue happens, ie, 2 slot on the J-gate). This is where playing with the J-gate and a multimeter should indicate where the problem lies.

If you need more info, let me know and we can take things from there.

 

Hi Thermo and thank you for the quick reply.

The thing is I really don't understand most of what you said. I do, but I don't. Please remember I am a new X-Type owner who is just starting to learn a few things about it. I actually could fix a few things under the hood now thanks to this forum. However when you start talking about dismantling the J-Gate and reading measurements on a multi-meter, that might be out of my league, First I have no idea of the dismantling of the J-Gate. if you know of a tutorial somewhere i would be glad to study it. Then I might be able to get to the 10 pin connector...then I need to know how to use the mulit-meter (I do have one...I will post a picture of it in case you need to advise me of the proper setting to have it on). Anyhow I do have some basic questions that might help me if you have time?

1) What is the D-4 gear switch and what is it's overall function?

2) Is there any repercussions to just leaving well enough alone since the car is running fine with no issues?

3) Does this issue effect a smog test at all if they see the code?

4) If I went to an Ammco and asked them to check that switch or the cable would they try to burn me money wise or is it an inexpensive adjustment or replacing of the switch?

5) Why would the light come on if nothing is technically going wrong?

6) I am assuming with my limited knowledge of this car and my lack of mechanical skill at this point that a cable shifter adjustment is out of my league and better left to someone who knows what they are doing?

If you think you can guide me there I am game...I just need instructions...pretty much step by step or I will break something for sure.

Thanks again

peace out,
daddylogan

 

Oh...I was also wondering - do most people just stay in "Drive" or do people actually use 2nd,3rd, and 4th? I went up hills just fine in D the other day and saw no need to downshift to 3rd or 2nd at all.

I was also wondering if most people drive in normal mode or sport mode? Is either mode harder then the other on the tranny at all or no difference. Just curious questions.

peace out,
daddylogan

 

daddylogan, the use of 2-3-4 is merely to give those that want the feel of a manual while using an automatic. With that being said, there is a few other oddities that go with that. They go something like this (don't recall all the details so, take this for what it is worth)

2: The tranny is stuck in 2nd gear. This can be beneficial if you are stuck on ice/snow and this will give you better grip as you are limiting the torque that can be produced.

3: Allows the car to shift through gears 1, 2, and 3, used more for getting a heavy load started and then limiting its speed for say hills and the like.

4: turns of the overdrive to keep the engine RPMs up to allow climbing of hills and whatnot and prevent the tranny from shifting a lot, preventing the tranny from overheating during long, hard pulls.

As for sport mode or normal mode, you can drive around in sport mode all you want. It will have no negative effects on your car (I drove around with it on for 3+ years). The only thing the sport mode does is raise the shift points. What I mean by this is lets say under heavy acceleration that the car would normal shift at say 5500 RPM in normal mode. With sport mode on, it would allow the tranny to shift at say 6000 RPM.

With this being said, it is a weighted rise. So, if you are just putting around town lets say and the car is in normal mode, the tranny may shift at say 3,000 RPM. Under the same conditions in sport mode, it may shift at 3,100 RPM. So, really no major difference. ONly under hard acceleration do you see a significant change.

As for your problem, if you have a wiring issue, it may be that when you move the gear shifter over to 2, that is when contact with the wiring occurs, leading to the ground condition, resulting in the fault. In any other condition, the exposed wiring has nothing near it to cause it to short, leading to the fault.

Leaving the car as is would be fine atleast for the moment. I do not see where this would be detrimental to the car. This fault also has nothing to do with smog checking or the like. As long as when you go to have the car checked and the CEL is off and you have the P1111 code (ie, all systems checked SAT) , that is what most smog places care about.

As for taking the car to a shop to have them fix the issue, this is a loaded question. If you have them start troubleshooting, I can see where they may have to take some time (ie, money) to do some searching and figure out what is going on. If you tell them that you simply want the cable adjusted because of the issue, they are going to probably get your for an hour of time (minimum charge) and get you for say $100. But, this may not fix your problem. This is why I say you should remove the cover from over the J-gate and do a look inside. If there is a bare wire in there, it will be fairly easy to see and be pretty obvious.

 

That no input for pin 5 is by design, Thermo...low (1st) doesn't actually have a option, since that is where the transmission starts; the transmission 'idles' in drive. Neutral floats the drive solenoid to take the car out of gear, D grounds it and engages first.


You can select 2 and 3 manually (on pins 3 and 4), otherwise a signal on both the 2nd gear solenoid and the 3rd gear solenoid enable 4th by default; as long as the engine computer says the conditions are met, the trans will shift into 4 automatically.


5th is the same way; the computers set the logic to engage the overdrive if the conditions are as programmed.


The trans logic is fuzzy, it 'learns' how you drive over a distance of about 350 miles or so, and adapts the curve accordingly


Sport mode simply takes the 'learned' shift points and tweaks them.


The problem is that if the 'learned' points aren't there yet, Sport can't use them...you need to drive normally for about 350 miles before you use the sport mode for it to really work!


Not like the old days of the hydraulic transmission valve body...these things are all electronics and solenoids anymore!

 

Thank you for a very good explanation of things. All good to know for a new X-Type owner! You mention I should have a P1111 code...a tad confused on that. I believe the only other code that was generated was a P1000 code (Besides the P1780) so is that the same thing?

Thanks again

peace out,
daddylogan

 

daddylogan, P1000 is saying that the car is attempting the self checks to make sure that everything is good, but has not been able to get a good reading from all the different parts that are checked. So, you should always get either P1000 (something has not passed yet or there is a failure) or P1111 (everything passes the self check).

I see you have a multimeter. You will want to plug the black lead into the port labeled "COM". You will want to plug the red lead into the port labeled "V" (may have some other things with it). You should see a third port labeled "A". NEVER!!!!! plug your leads into this port unless you need to measure current (in your case, you should never have to do this unless specifically directed to).

Now, with the lead connected to the meter, if you look on the front of the meter in the lower left corner, you can see something that looks like someone wearing a set of headphones. This is the omega symbol which stands for ohm (or resistance). Turn the dial so it points at the "2000" symbol with the diamond symbol. You should see the meter say "OL" (this stands for overload, or you are attempting to measure something in excess of 2,000 ohms). This is normal in this case. If you take the red and black leads and touch them, you should see the meter change to read something like 0.5 (or something very close). This is the resistance of the leads (ie, 0.5 ohms).

Taking a step back to what I mentioned about checking the J-gate, you will want to take the free end of the leads and with the black lead, find pin 8 and hold the lead against that pin so the black lead is only touching the #8 pin. Using your other hand, you can take the red lead and touch the other pins mentioned. If you are touching the pin for the gear selected, you should see a very low reading on the multimeter (less than 5.0). Anything above this and you have an issue with that part of the circuit. If the gear selector is not in the gear you are testing, you should see "OL". If you see a reading on the meter other than "OL", this is a problem.

The final check that you can do is take the black lead and hold it against a metal part of the car. Now, you can take the red lead and touch each of the pins (1 at a time). The meter should always read "OL". If it doesn't, that is a problem. You can repeat this by putting the J-gate into a position, finding the matching pin and touching the red lead to the pin as the black lead is against a metal part of the car. Again, you should always see "OL". If you don't, there is your problem. In your specific case, I would not be surprised if you put the J-gate to "2" and do this above check and you get a reading on the meter (this would indicate that the wiring is damaged).

If I am not making sense to you, do not worry. Just say so and I will explain it a different way.

 

Thanks again for the quick reply. In a sense I am almost more worried about not getting the P1111 code like I should. if I am understanding you correctly, this would be an issue at smog then? I am not understanding what could be getting in the way of returning a failure? (would the P1780 code be the cause of this or does it come from something else?) Sorry...I feel like I am going in circles now because this car just passed all it's checks (Smog) in late August when I bought it.

I do understand the multimeter and the checking now so thank you for that. Now I just need to figure how to get into the J-Gate. I am assuming I pop off the trim and there will be some screws to undo and the connector should be on the left side of the unit (I have seen a S-Type dismantled in a video but it looked way different getting to it then the X-type would).

Anyhow...I want to achieve the P1111 code first so maybe some guidance on that. I would think I have been through enough drive cycles by now that if anything was reset before I bought the car that it should change back to P1111 by now.

Thanks again

peace out,
daddylogan

 

daddylogan, some code readers may not show the P1111 code. so, if you have a code reader, tell it to clear all the codes and then go for say a 20 mile ride. This should be enough time to get things to pass all the checks (just make sure that the fuel tank is between 1/4 and 3/4). If you go to read the codes and nothing comes in at this point, then you have the P1111 code. If the car for some reason has not reached the passing of all checks, then you should get the P1000 code regardless. But then, if you can drive 20 miles and not get the CEL light, then everything should be good for getting the P1111 code.