The blue lady

Hy everybody !

This blue lady make me crazy since a good month now. Each time i'm searching a detail on a portion of the actual problem, downloading pages of DTC/P codes, watching videos, digging forums, studying drives cycles procedures ... i'm losing more and more the North. To complete the personal equation, this is the first car in my (pretty long) list with so much interconnected probes everywhere. Until this one, i was buying simple and old school engines a bit more easier to handle : mostly japanese and german. I think that a good portion of the problem is my faulty logic with this type of car; and that i try to "reverse engineering" the problem with a lack of consideration for cascading failures. Perhaps ... or i forget some factors in the equation or ... please help me if you can with this da vinci code ! ^^

I will try to describe the madness with maximum accuracy and to respect exactly the timeline to help to be helped, but don't hesitate to ask a detail I've missed if any. Sorry by advance, it's gonna be long and full-filled with an average grammar.

The exact model : Xtype of 2002 with the little V6 engine, 2.1l, near to zero options (it was the initial strategy) : think about the most basic you can imagine. Fabric, old school tape radio, manual A/C ...

I ] Cruising like charm

The first ten days was a dream, and enough long for the car to seduce me like crazy. I fell in love, starting to look after a XK8 and a big Stype to replace the twos others etc... We've done hundreds of kilometers with my wife without any problem, and i'm a paranoid type of owner with my used cars. It's why i always have three at a same time. At the first little strange sound or weird behavior, I park the car and i don't let it drive until I've found, isolate and find a solution. Since decades. Sometimes for stupid bad manufactured tire or a toy of my son in the trunk, yup at this point.

And during these days of happiness : strictly nothing happened. At all. Under heavy load (still not a sport car for rallye, don't get me wrong), cruising like a grand pa, long highway travel, short travels in city in plain high traffic ... truly like a charm. And even if the engine is not specifically impressive, i was delighted to drive it on the torque on near all gears ... like a charm.

Actually working on my house (epoxy floor, paints, refurbished furnitures for the curious) and considering the car and its historic, i was planning a sequential revision. Not a big one at a time for financial reason but also because the (nice and clean) previous owner have done most of the procedure before the sale : oil, filters, new tires ...

II] The fuel-pump-day

At 5AM, my wife call me in coming back from a night shift at hospital (nurse). She's on the border of the road and the car can't come back at home. Afterward, what make me crazy at this point it's the violence of the failure. I had this problem a couple of time on twos very old Mercedes 190, and generally you're feeling it coming days before. Not this time. No hole on accel', no weird noise of the pump dying inside the car … strictly nothing.

Face to the car, i took me ten minutes maximum to known what was going on : no fuel. I take the hopeful bet to find a R11 relay (engine bay side) in my local garage (used jags everywhere here), with the hope it was only that. It was not, and the F18 20amp fuse (engine bay) was constantly broken at the second i was turning the ignition ON (motor off). It's when i knew that i will need to put the hands in the tank.

I've call a local garage i know well to ask to get the car with a truck, and to work on it in decent condition (nice guy, comprehensive) due to the process. Initially i was in the strategy to unmount the exhaust pipes, the tank etc ... but i've changed my mind due to a ... snake. Yeah. A damned big snake bite my hand the day before in the garden, i've not noticed on the moment but while i had the hands in the tank lol. It was burning like crazy ^^

And it's what i've discovered, pretty frightening after all :


fuel pump connector melted

The connector of the pump was melted, never saw that. I was initially planning to just change the pump inside but finally i've ordered a new complete set and a new fuel filter. I've changed it by inside like it :

cutting

I've replaced the fuel filter by a brand new also and purged the fuel between the engine and the filter.

At this point i was thinking that the only step to accomplish was to build a cover for the hole and "voilà" ... but it's when the chaos really started.

III] The gauge (idiot inside)

From this point the engine was starting, but with big holes when i was doing gentle revs (it never changed until now). The gauge was indicating false information, tank always empty (instead ~60% full).
After exhaustives searches, I've finally learned some things that the car was doing a set of "drive tests" and a bunch of others things on the I/M procedures.

My body finally digested the venom, my hand was not like the one of mickey mouse .. i was ready to fight again. After a headache, I've discovered that the gauge of the fuel pump I've ordered wasn't compatible with the Xtype tank. So i've adapted the old gauge to the new pump.

My first theory about the weird behavior of the car at this point :

- The car react like it's in the LIMP mode described everywhere on internet, but don't show anything or any message. Not even the MIL light.
- So, (and i was wrong), it's because the gauge is blocking the I/M process in indicating that the tank is empty.

Throw me stones at this point, i desserve it. But yes, i've checked the flow rate and it's good :

IV] Me + million probes chaos = Panic mode

I'm at this step, not affraid by the car itself but totally losted on where to search due to a behavior i don't understand. I've ordered a Icarsoft I800 to help me and to continue to digg the question.

I've doubts on a faulty logic of myself at this point, due to past experiences on simpler/older cars :

1) The feeling : running lean

The car is thirsty, i "feel it" when i drive it. The air flow from the air filter look good and sound good (aspiration) but when i open too much the intake throttle, the engine lost all its RPM, then the power. In playing with torque, i can drive up to the 3th gear (with difficulty) but in being much more than tender with the accelerator pedal. In pushing it like a butterfly lol, pumping in 2nd gear help to get RPM faster also. But it's not a feeling i known on older cars, my brain can't stop to be paranoid and think about an electronic limiting factor (LIMP mode / green mode or something else, even if nothing is displayed anywhere). Parked on dead point (manual), hot engine, the engine behavior is much better on revs and get RPM a lot more easier and over 3K rpm. On road it's near impossible to reach 3K after the 1st gear.

It's when/where i'm thinking about the side of injectors (sic). Extended to the whole experience, maybe the fuel pump have melted because a high pressure.

Problem 1a, they are not independent like old cars that i known and share something like a modern common rail. These things are constantly on measurement, i suppose.
Problem 1b, it can be the common rail pump that don't push enough fuel in the injectors. So lean that the pump melted ... sound crazy, but i'm at this point ^^
Problem 2, when one or a fews injectors fail or is/are dirty ... you're feeling it days before the car is unusable (same with common rail pump). Not the case at all, all this sh*t was so sudden that i lost my mind in term of diagnosis.

2) Probes paranoia

So, with lack of usual symptoms explaining the common rail pump or injectors ... i'm tempted to explain the lack of fuel by an external factor like the 4 probes lambda/o² which send crazy results that reduce the mix (i'm sure i'm saying something dumb right now but ... i prefer to look stupid and to learn).

Problem : no errors at all on this side, no DTC, nothing. But in another hand, i known that these probes can fail suddenly without any hints in symptoms. Explaining why the car was driving so well before the death of the fuel pump.

3) Strange sound resonating in the air filter box

This sound is unknown from me, but this car is my very first atmospheric V6 ... again, better to look stupid and to learn something. I get it after a revs from low RPM since the change of the fuel pump.
The short video :
This sound is pretty loud when i open the air filter box, it's coming from the throttle body.
No explanation or theory on it, i share it in the case that it can be a hint for something. If it's normal for this engine, don't forget to tell me.

4) Speaking with the car (i800 + "trip console")

I/M Readiness



They are the only three cycles i'm able to complete in driving the car : Misfire, Fuel system and O² Sensor heater.
Component monitor
Catalyst monitor
Evap system
Oxygen sensor
... stay incomplete no matter what i try in driving. But it's pretty limited due to the intake throttle behavior, i'm unable to do most of "drive cycles" documented. My "limp mode paranoia" come essentially from there, i don't know if the ECM is limiting the car in this mode at the point to can't do the necessary drives cycles to shut down it. Sound weird i know, but my logic is under panic attack for now.

And the most weird : i don't have any error on the i800 ! Just the P1000. It make me crazy.

For now the most usefull function is the livedata, not very handly when you drive in same time but it permit to see what happend when i have the "holes" when i push the throttle. This is the screens when the car is iddle, parked and from cold engine start.

iddle, cold engine

Most of datas are unstable. I understand what it mean and what they are checking, but my problem is for the valors. I don't have any reference under the hand to can judge them. If any you have a website, a document or the same Xtype ... a share will be a lot appreciated at this point. If you're used to judge these valors and that you're seeing something strongly wrong ... don't hesitate one second also.

5) "Trip mode" DTC obtained by the commodo trick

I can get errors this way, i've read that they are more hints than true indications but who known ... i share it. (thanks thermo for most of them)

DTC 9359 = Ignition switch voltage problem
DTC 9202 = sender DTC
DTC E510 = PATS-ECM mismatch
DTC 900 = Dynamic stability control fault caused by a CAN bus system failure.
DTC E511 = "road speed" (?)
DTC 9318 = Automatic headlight leveling system seeing a voltage outside the 9-16V range.

6) The car audio : yeah, i'm at this point

The "roof" of this car, inside, was in bad state. The fabric was no longer "glued" in roof (pretty common), so I've dismantled everything, cleaned and glued a brand new fabric on the fiber glass part. The result is nice, i'm happy. But since i've done it i've a little problem : the car audio (tape model) is now crazy.


damn ...

It no longer take the code of the card and i get the "please wait".

Crazy theory 1 : When i've redone the roof, i've disconnected twos connectors in front right and front left of the car. White and green if my memory is right. When the old fuel pump stopped to work, the roof was not yet finished and mounted. So the connector was free. We have done ~120 kilometers like that without any problem and with the car audio enabled. But since i've disconnected the battery a first time, no more audio, the system no longer take the code.

Crazy theory 1b : Is there a strange protection that can limit the performance of the car like a "thief mode" or something like that, sound weird with this kind of model of car and this year ... but who know. Maybe i'm fighting against a weird mode i'm not aware of and that is putting the chaos in a car which was driving like a charm just before. The fact that the car no longer take the code of the card annoy me, i known that some brand include calculations of engine in these component sometimes ... and it was the most strange theory of the whole post. Throw the stones from this point, if any.



Maybe i forget some details but the post is maybe enough long for now, don't hesitate to ask additionnal info if any. Not easy to write this in one block. I wish you the best with your jags, see you around!

 

https://www.jaguarforum.com/threads/...ss-code.44665/

Ignore the stalk codes as they are nearly always very old (dealer erase only) & will lead you down a rabbit hole.

Short term and long term both look out of spec to me. I hesitate to comment on the other values shown (can barely read screen shots) as you have a 2.1 versus my 3.0. I'll leave that up to greater minds/members.

Just curious why you bought the icarsoft 800 when the Jag specific ones are 930I or LRII?

 

Hi Meroy,

The sound in your recording after you rev the engine is very odd, but sounds like the air filter cartridge loose and 'fluttering' inside the air cleaner box as vacuum subsides.
Undo the air cleaner lid and take the air filter out temporarily to see if that noise disappears.
It is possible someone has fitted the wrong size filter and it is not being held properly in the air cleaner assembly, or it is very badly contaminated and engine vacuum is somehow distorting and displacing it.
A very restricted air filter cartridge could be causing other engine behaviours too.

Your engine issues only started when you had the fuel pump failure and installed a replacement.
The fuel pumps on our 2.1 V6 petrol models are not managed in the same way as the fuel pumps in the 2.5L and 3.0L.
Our fuel pumps are just powered via Relay 11 which turns them on constantly. There is no fuel pressure measurement sensor incorporated at the fuel rail of our engines either, instead the fuel rail pressure is mechanically set (I assume) by a bypass valve integrated in the fuel pump assembly itself.
The larger displacement V6 engines have a fuel pump managed by a electronic fuel pump control module that is driven from the ECM (ECU) which is receiving feedback on fuel rail pressure to govern the rate at which the pump is being driven.

So, here are my initial thoughts on your issue.
If you received and fitted a 2.5 or 3.0L fuel pump somehow by mistake, you will probably have very high fuel rail pressure as the fuel pump will be getting driven at full supply voltage from the relay not a control module and those fuel pumps likely do not have pressure bypass valve governance.
That could have your injectors over delivering fuel and the engine control module will be likely be struggling to manage the fuel trims and make sense of the airflow versus O2 readings.
I don't know if it is even possible to fit the wrong pump as they are physically quite different, but I am puzzled why the fuel gauge sender was wrong on the one you received and an incorrect pump could be why.
Was it a genuine 2.1 fuel pump?

Dead spot when you try to lift engine RPM.
The options here are varied if it is not a fuel pressure issue, but could be one of the following (but I can't see any of these issues happening as a consequence of your fuel pump incident) :-

1. A very restrictive air filter causing high intake vacuum.
2. Could be a dirty air sensor (MAP or MAF sensor) giving bad feedback to ECM. You can use MAF sensor cleaning aerosol to clean those sensors.
3. Also check your TPS (Throttle Position Sensor) that is mounted on the engine side of the throttle body assembly. It is a simple three terminal variable resistor.
4. A vacuum leak into the intake manifold (damaged pipe or fitting in air circuit to brake servo, bad O-ring one of the Intake Manifold Tuning valves or bad O-rings (upper or lower) between intake manifold and cylinder head),

TPS: With a multi-meter check the resistance and operation of the sensor. You should have a total resistance of about 3.5K ohms and a variation in resistance through throttle movement ranging from about 50 to 100 ohms to nearly 3.5K ohms.
It you decide to remove the sensor from the throttle assembly to measure it, the minimum resistance will be closer to zero as the sensor will be at its mechanical end stop rather than the throttle body holding it partially advanced.
Check that the rise in resistance measurement is smooth, a worn TPS will have erratic resistance measurements at various mechanical positions.
This part is not normally available from Jaguar (only a complete throttle body is) but I if you need to replace this part then you can use a Walker Products TPS which has their part# 200-1060

I have no answer on your stereo code issue. The stereo is stand alone, does not tie into security system as far as I know, nor is it paired to the other car systems that would cause a lock out. If you have the right code, it should unlock.

 

Thank you both very much for your feedbacks, it help to start somewhere with a decent logic. I make some tests this afternoon and i come back to report them.

 

Hy there,

With all i'm reading on these "comodo codes", i share the opinion. It look like engineered by Lewis Carroll himself.

The (A.MEM + PTY) trick don't work on my model, but in extending the searches directly in front of the radio, around this hint, i've finally found something : (>> + PTY) is working like a charm on my model. I can work on it with music now, thanks ;o)
Off course, it doesn't solve anything on the engine or on an eventual "thief mode" = Paranoia-mode definitively closed on this point.

In fact i wasn't aware of this point. After your comment on it, i've done a search in my local Icarsoft reseller (FR) and they are only selling the LRII. But for twice the price of the I800 and with additional function that i wasn't specifically seeking. The initial goal was just to be able to read the codes and to "wipe" them, but the I/M reads and the Livedata included in the I800 are also pretty usefull in fact, afterward.

So, with your comment in mind i've cleared the hypothesis that the i800 isn't compatible with the Xtype : It work pretty well in fact, and I've nothing to complain about. I've made a call to a friend which use this Bluetooth dongle :

i800 and Icar Vgate dongle


I've tryed the both side by side to compare results etc ... I don't regret the I800 one second. It's a lot faster, more handly than a smartphone (for my big fingers) and the live data are more accurate/stable (maybe the bluetooth link idk). No difference on errors management, both work well. For sure it's not a comparison with something builded for professionals like the LRII or even the CR Max but if a rumor is telling that the i800 doesn't work, i'm forced to say that it's wrong.
To test that the reader is reading rightly the codes, the MIL and erase them, i've simply created one with a MAF/MAP test i will explain below and a rough cold start i will show right now.

So, to force a little the things and to get additional informations because the car isn't producing any code since a while (also to verify the I800) ... i've made a barbaric cold start in crossing my fingers to don't break anything. I don't have pushed the revs very high but i was enough brutal. Specially when the "throttle funk" occurred. Instead to light the feet when i was feeling a "hole", i've done the reverse in insisting like crazy and in tempting to get the more RPM i can (but decent because cold engine) ... and i finally got twos codes ! I'm not sure that it's normal to be happy to get codes lol

codes

So :
- the P0171
- the P0174
- always the P1000 (cycles can't be done for the moment)
and in bonus : the MIL !

I've cleared it all (but the P1000), they don't come back under normal conditions and a little drive around the house (max 3th gear due to the "throttle funk"). MIL don't come back too.

My fault, to stay concise and to don't write a too long presentation of the problem i've omited this previous test. To better identify the location of this sound i've opened the filter box and removed the filter (brand new + tested with another brand new). The sound become a lot louder and come from the admission pipe. No real change on the frequency and also on when it occur : in releasing the throttle after an acceleration. But i keep the "vacuum pressure" idea in the head, make sense for further researches.

Thanks a lot for these explanations on the fuel system, it permit to better understand how it work and to get a fundamental logic.

Good point, in both sense in fact : too much flow or not enough.
No, the pump is a cheap aftermarket model given for 3.8 bar and 80 liters / hour (a little more than a basic fishtank pump).

At first glance (an hour just passed), it look like a bit complicated to get the three statistics right now : the 2.1L V6 OEM pump flow/pressure, another source for the cheap ERA 2.1L V6 i bought (80ltrs/h sound pretty low) stats and the 2.5L/3.0L OEM pump flow/pressure. I will do an extensive search later to have solid comparison to consider and also to share.

On the three remaining points, i was forced to choose only one to check this afternoon and maybe i was lucky.


MAF testing

I've chosen to check the Mass Airflow sensor first. With the help of your suggestion, I've found a procedure in a nice website about Xtype : Jaguar X Type Information:- Petrol Engine MAF Sensor
My sensor is out of range, at ~1.4 instead 2.5 but more interesting : the value don't change at all if i breath inside or when i use the MAF cleaner spray i bought this afternoon for that. It stay always at 1.4 no matter what.

So I've decided to directly test the car without, to get a feeling of the engine running without this sensor (parked/dead point). And also to test the I800 capacities. And the feeling was very good, in the sense that it add nothing more or remove anything else in term of sensation but increase drastically the main problem i'm facing with a freaking accuracy. At the point to put a kind of smile in my face, maybe a little light in the darkness finally.

With the i800, I got :
P0102 (MAP low)
P0112 (MAP temp low)
indicating rightly that the twos probes was in vacancy, another doubt in left for the i800 but the most impressive of the operation being the feeling to have drastically increased the main problem.
For now it don't explain the pretty low Fuel trims spotted but i'm planning an exhaustive search on the whole banks of datas of the "live datas" function of the i800 with all i find on expected values. I will make something to share more practical to read in tables.

I will check the TPS tomorrow, I've well understood the logic behind, the procedure and its trap.

The vacuum leak in the intake manifold still a bit esoteric for me, i've to digg the question and to watch the part in detail to best understand the whole suggestion. I'm not used to have this massive and complex part in front of me, most of cars i had was pretty simple 4 cylinder, a couple with carburators (prelude) or inline german 5cyl with intake manifold reduced to near nothing lol I understand the logic behind, not the part. I've to study it to set a valuable procedure to check all the points you have suggested.

I'm familiar only with the linked vaccum circuit with brake system, from an old crazy headache on a Mitsubishi Carisma 1.8L GDI. Near no brake (at the point to be very dangerous), in replacing brake disk, calipers, purging fluid a fews times, mastervac changed etc ... and with the help of twos professional. I've finally found myself in following all parts of the brake system, engine bay side, that the "anti return" part that cost less than ten bucks ... was dead. After a month of expensive nightmare. So i've learned the hard way that the brake system need the vacuum of the intake manifold to create a pressure, to demultiply the force. That's all i known on this part ^^

For now i've twos favorites track to follow, until i test the TPS and check the manifold for leaks.

- the locked MAP creating the chaos, considering the comments of the guy on the bluejag website :
I don't check all the list of symptoms but it's close + the multimeter procedure put a value on it + the incredible feeling when the engine is running without MAP : just worse than usual but identical

Considering the mileage of the car, the price of the part and the feeling ... it's a big temptation to order the part and to see what append next. At worse, it's a good investment for later considering the very dirty state of the actual part.

- a fuel pump not fitted for the car : too much pressure or not enough pressure, i've to do a long search i think to get the exact datas

​​​​​​​To be continued then ...

 

If you still have that fluttering sound with the air filter removed, the only thing I can think of that could possibly make that type of sound within the air induction would be the manifold O-rings letting vacuum physically move them creating a shuddering sound.
There are 12 O-rings, 6 upper and 6 lower as there is a lower manifold that lies between the alloy intake manifold and the cylinder heads, hence o-rings above and below it.
If you are removing the intake manifold, be careful of your vacuum pipes and the plastic T joints. The pipes are very stiff and it is easy to fracture the nylon T joints if flexed.
Our 2.1 engines have a vacuum assist pump for the brake servo that creates an additional branch in the vacuum lines that is different from the 2.5 and 3.0 engines.

The O-rings are just a friction fit into the manifold, they do not use any sealant compound typically.
It is not uncommon for the lower manifold (glass reinforced plastic) to have the brass threaded inserts start to release from the plastic (they can start spinning when you try to undo the bolts).
If this has happened and someone has tried to repair the manifold, the brass inserts might not have been reinserted and glued back into the right position, giving you weaker o-ring crush pressure.
Look for any sign of repair of the lower manifold if you are going to remove the manifold at some time.

 

Well you threw 2 of the most common codes indicating a vacuum leak, p0171 & p0174. Take some starter fluid (ether) on a cold engine, start car and spray the "big 3". A change in r.p.m. indicates where the leak is.

Yours is slightly different being a 2.1 but same basic process.



https://www.jaguarforums.com/forum/x...anifold-71249/

As for your video of sound, it sounds like a Jag to me, lol. Here's a video of a 2.1 Jag engine sound =

https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=ErLN0LShYCo

 

(I was waiting the validation of the second big post to update the thread; in effort to don't make a hole in the conversation.)

Vaccum testing (with brake cleaner)

Obviously i don't have rightly done it, let me draw in colors what i've sprayed (flammable break cleaner). I've done that in waiting that the car become hot for a further test : for the OL/CL/OL Drive statut of fuel system + iddle/2500RPM/3500RPM test for fuel trims stats (codes just cleared).


engine bay - Xtype 2.1 V6

My test was mainly to check the hoses. I was generous with the spray and patient (i've not only sprayed the surface but the whole circumference).

A : Hose tested.
B : Hose tested.
C : Hose tested. I've doubt on the adapters on the twos extremity, it doesn't look like legit. I will order a silicone-based hose (the colored ones used in tunning), then replace them properly.
D : Flexible tested.
E : Not rightly tested for my taste, but i've tryed hard. The bank in front was rightly tested but the bank in rear not, because the "hidden" side covered by the intake manifold, i was just able to rightly test the front of the rear bank.
F : Hose tested but i was more after the twos "anti return vaccum valves". It cost near nothing, i've the big envy to replace them for the peace of mind and also to see if it make the brakes a little more agressive.

Obviously, and in regard of your share Dell Gailey, the engine of the 2.1 V6 is simplified/rustic when compared to 2.5/3.0 engines. I've to do some searches in RTAs and documents to find if i have equivalent parts on the 2.1 for the "oring" and the "breather". The sound of the video you're sharing is more nice than in my engine ^^ Sound more like a "metallic V6 roar" than in mine. When i will change the Mass Airflow sensor, i will do another video without the filter to best illustrate this strange sound. It pretty loud and neat when the airflow is released.

I've to do a vacuum leak test more in accordance with the twos remaining hot spot for leaks, i've just to found the equivalence in parts. One more thing on my check list, thanks.

About the p0171 & p0174 : They never come back if i don't do all i can to get them. The procedure is not so easy, i've failed to get the codes a bunch of times : cold start, revs from iddling to 2500 RPM and 3500 RPM to generate a big hole in the acceleration and when the hole is appearing (if the RPM is dropping at the same time only), i push the accelerator pedal to the floor until the MIL is activated. It take four to five tries to get the MIL + codes. If i don't do that, i never get the codes and the MIL on drive tests + parked revs. But considering what I've learned until now on fuel trims (pretty much interesting in fact, now i understand technically the Diesel-gate of Volkswagen ! lol), i've clearly a problem of mixture that the ECM try to streamline.

Throttle part testing (TPS)

It's a temporary dead end to check the resistance, i've a bunch of electric connectors all around and a bunch of hoses all around also. It's a lot more complicated than i was expecting, i was clearly not expecting this level of complexity for this kind of part (due to my experience with older cars). I've to learn the part itself and to understand why it's so mechanically and electrically connected everywhere (i find it crazy), to find the right procedure. The first step will be electrical, at least to find wich connector is the sender of the tension i've to check (I've over four connectors). Due to the complexity of the part, i will do all i can for now to don't un-mount it.

Fuel trims

I'm actually writing on an excel sheet a comprehensive listing of the live data of the i800, to overcome the actual problem of my engine for sure but also for later to be able to "judge" the values in term of maintenance. The more i'm doing searches on it, the more i'm in love with the livedatas function and the more i want to buy an overkill CR reader to play with it. The more i love my previous 90's old cars also but they was less fascinating in term of technology.

For now the problematic i have with fuel trims (short/long) is their close interaction with the four probes, the ECM, the air mass stats and also the timing advance. A complete interpretation is a bit optimistic for now, it still a big portion of my actual searches.

But i'm finally able to say something a bit more "aware" on the datas i get with the reader :

- short term fuel trims a bit high (in live datas, test drives up to 3th gear) but not specially problematic considering the actual problem of my engine, the range of their fluctuation is not specially impressive
- long term fuel trims are problematic because fixed to the higher limit, around the 20%. I've made all i can and all drive test i can to be sure that it's not only because the ECM have to re-learn the value between twos reset, unfortunately they stay fixed at maximum no matter what. My logic still too fresh, but with your help i'm more and more convinced that the problem is to seek on the airflow side of the 14:1 ratio more than in the fuel side.
- down stream probes don't show anything abnormal
- up stream probes are fluctuating but are not drastically out of range, but one bank more than another
- the CL status of my fuel system is pretty fast, before the engine become hot (~80°c)
- the OL Drive status is rightly activated when i generate an heavy load but the bank 1 have the trend to stay on OL Drive when the bank 2 come back on CL status for a dozen of seconds maximum. If i pump a little the accelerator pedal, it come back quickly on CL status (generating the weird song in my intake that i've shared in the video). The bank of the short persistent OL drive after a high load look like the same of the up stream probe fluctuating more than the other, i've to check that in detail on the engine.

On the fuel pumps statistics it's a damned labyrinth that i don't understand professionally. All brands selling pumps for fish tanks, houses, wells ... near all categories of pumps in fact, are writing black on white their debits and their pressure. But not in the automotive industry and aftermarket parts, it's like the da vinci code secret. Not only for pumps by the way, they mostly rely on OEM code and don't care much about what they are selling it's crazy. At one exception, the high performance parts aftermarket. It appear that to be fully informed on what you're buying for a car that you want to keep stock ... you have to buy expensive high performance parts for rallye that's crazy.

For now all i got, and in concatenating datas from a fews sources that i can't consider as reliable (not manufacturers) : the fuel pump of the 2.5 and 3.0 engine appear to send 20% more fuel that the pump of the 2.1 engine, but with the exact same pressure (around 4bar). To be continued ...

The Mass Airflow sensor

It's ordered finally. After many searches and deliberations, i want to start "fresh" with this part for a ton of reasons (+ the out of range resistance). If a miracle happens and that it fix the problem, i will be very happy.
But if not, i will be able to study the live datas with the insurance that this side is out of concern. I was not aware until my recent searches that this sensor was responsible of so many calculations.

Something useless, but i'm happy


roof

Here, they are charging around 600 euros to over 1K to change the roof fabric. So i've decided to do it myself. It's not specially harder than in others cars on the Xtype, or longer, the time spent was mostly to clean the fiber glass from the old glue and foam. The error I've done was to retire the roof with the rear seat in place, it was pretty tricky to do. Without the rear set, it's a piece of cake to engage by the rear right door. It's not perfect but i'm happy with the result and it look like stock for less than 100 euros (but a few hours not paid).

to be continued ...

 

2.1 litre possible vacuum leak points =

 

Quick update on the fly ... it become more crazy. But at least it become rationnal ^^
I gave the Xtype to a decent Jaguar specialist to test everything i can't : fuel pressure, air etc ... and everything is just fine. But the damned ECU ! A memory bank appear to be fried, i've to get another one and to reprogram it.

 

Damn, one year later. But the update can be useful imho for owners accumulating the exact same symptoms. Specially this weird sound resonating in the air filter box (in my youtube's video).

First, the Jaguar garage i was speaking about is renowned here and known as a very good regional specialist. They maintain all the year high grade vehicule, mostly Jaguar but also Porsche, Range Rover etc, vintage and news models ... they took the car to start a diag at least. They keep it twos months, and they do nothing. Just testing the fuel pressure in the injector's rail, five minutes top. So i get back the car, a little angry, but they charged nothing at least. It was just parking after all.

The sad reality, in being diplomatic with a pissed-off employee : The boss don't want to work on Xtype models, not worth the time spent. Specifically my model. So, they have near zero experience on it and it's why they was unable to identify fast what was wrong with the car. Official story, i don't believe it at all. And no, the ECU is fine. The O² sensors are fine, the cats are fine. In fact the whole engine is in a pretty good shape for its age, but the intake.

So, i come back on the car and decided to take all the time needed to study the parts involved and to understand how it work. And it's pretty simple in fact : the intake manifold was broken (brass nuts broken during a previous operation), and quickly repaired with a cheap thread lock. The upper part wasn't entirely fixed too, nuts missing. So the lack of pressure on the gasket + the vibrations have finished the job and put the car in it's actual state. Making me crazy for near nothing.

I have just to replace this part and its poor gaskets (upper and lower) to fix the problem. All unmounted and removed, the marks on metal make it obvious, but it's where the "brake cleaner" test find its limits. I wasn't able on this engine to detect a vaccum leak with this method, and all probes, MAF included, was becoming too crazy to give a single hint in this madness.

After a lot of part unmounted to work in ease, I think now that Jaguar engineer are psychopaths by the way but it's another subject ^^

 

I didnt read much more than half the first post. I watched the video and think u have an exhaust leak. Did you start to remove the exhaust when you went to replace the fuel pump?

 

Apparently you can also get a fluttering intake sound at the air filter with the idle bypass solenoid that is on top of the throttle body of the 2.1 V6 engine malfunctioning.