Drive Train Vibration?
#21
04-13-2011, 10:53 AM
Now the vibration seems to have diminished. It is still there, but is not as strong as it was. I am thinking that the partial change of the transfer case oil that I did before taking the car to the dealer may be cleaning out some "gunk" that was baked onto some rotating part of the transfer case. I plan to change the TC oil again soon. Maybe I have just extended the life of the TC!
#22
04-14-2011, 04:25 AM
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The guy at the dealership, who said to replace your motor mounts is an idiot. That makes no sense at all. I think you have the key to your problem: something is heating up. You just need to find out what it is.
The accident that you refer to, do you know if the car was hit in the front? If the allignment is to spec then I would look at the caliper again. If the rotor is warped or the caliper not releasing pressure, the rotor is going to get hot. This would explain why the vibration happens after driving for a while. A bearing going bad will heat up as well. Try driving for the car until you feel the vibration and pull the front wheels and see if the rotor on one side is hotter than the other or too hot to touch. Carefull not to burn yourself. In addition to my Jag, I have a Ford F150 and the caliper was causing the rotor to heat up, which in turn warped the rotor, which heated up the grease in the wheel bearing. I replaced two sets of wheel bearings before I finally came the correct conclusion. Bad caliper. This is a part you never think would go bad at 35k, but if your car sat for a few years the pistons can rust up from non-use and then they can stick and partially lock up the brakes.
The accident that you refer to, do you know if the car was hit in the front? If the allignment is to spec then I would look at the caliper again. If the rotor is warped or the caliper not releasing pressure, the rotor is going to get hot. This would explain why the vibration happens after driving for a while. A bearing going bad will heat up as well. Try driving for the car until you feel the vibration and pull the front wheels and see if the rotor on one side is hotter than the other or too hot to touch. Carefull not to burn yourself. In addition to my Jag, I have a Ford F150 and the caliper was causing the rotor to heat up, which in turn warped the rotor, which heated up the grease in the wheel bearing. I replaced two sets of wheel bearings before I finally came the correct conclusion. Bad caliper. This is a part you never think would go bad at 35k, but if your car sat for a few years the pistons can rust up from non-use and then they can stick and partially lock up the brakes.
#23
04-14-2011, 09:47 AM
Thanks for the ideas, Pirate. I'll keep that in mind. The accident was apparently in the front, although I don't have any details. Anyway, I still plan to do another TC oil change as soon as I have time. It really seems like the vibration is reduced recently. Of course, that could also be the brakes. Maybe more driving has loosened up the calipers. I have always thought that a Jaguar needs to be driven regularly to stay in good shape.
Last edited by JaguarKnight; 04-14-2011 at 09:49 AM. Reason: Add info
#24
04-14-2011, 10:23 PM
JagKnight, did your other car that had the bad CV joint also have AWD? Maybe, just maybe the 40/60 split masks some symptoms of a typical CV joint problem as compared to a FWD car. My 2 cents.
#25
04-19-2011, 11:46 AM
KDW - no, the other car I had with bad CV joints was an old Honda Civic. It made loud clacking noises when turning sharply, and the steering wandered on the road.
All - The vibration is definitely less noticeable than it was. It had gone from "annoying" to "a concern", but now is barely noticeable. It is still there, but not to the level of being "annoying." So, since my latest theory is that it was in the transfer case, related to low oil level and overheating, and that it seems to have gotten better since I did the partial TC oil change, I decided to do another partial TC oil change (using the kit that I bought from Wild Bill). This time, instead of nearly black, smelly oil, I got slightly brown, normal-smelling oil out of the case. Note - the oil I am using in it is colorless. So, after two partial changes, the oil is about 89% new oil now. So now the remaining vibration is not much worse than normal road vibration, although "this" vibration is still at a particular speed range, only on acceleration. I hope that the TC won't fail prematurely due to whatever happened to it in the past, but for now, I am just going to drive the car and keep checking the TC oil often enough to make sure that it is not getting too low.
Thanks for all the assistance, everyone!
All - The vibration is definitely less noticeable than it was. It had gone from "annoying" to "a concern", but now is barely noticeable. It is still there, but not to the level of being "annoying." So, since my latest theory is that it was in the transfer case, related to low oil level and overheating, and that it seems to have gotten better since I did the partial TC oil change, I decided to do another partial TC oil change (using the kit that I bought from Wild Bill). This time, instead of nearly black, smelly oil, I got slightly brown, normal-smelling oil out of the case. Note - the oil I am using in it is colorless. So, after two partial changes, the oil is about 89% new oil now. So now the remaining vibration is not much worse than normal road vibration, although "this" vibration is still at a particular speed range, only on acceleration. I hope that the TC won't fail prematurely due to whatever happened to it in the past, but for now, I am just going to drive the car and keep checking the TC oil often enough to make sure that it is not getting too low.
Thanks for all the assistance, everyone!
#26
09-01-2011, 10:04 AM
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Dana - thanks for your comments. I don't know how old the tires are, since I bought the car last August. However, they look in good condition, and I had them road force balanced and rotated front to back. After that, the car rode more smoothly, but the vibration in question was unchanged. I would think that if it were a tire problem, it should be different after rotating the tires. I feel the vibration much more through the steering wheel than in the seat, so I think it is something in the front. The guy who did the alignment said he did not think it was a wheel bearing or CV joint. I am pretty sure it is not a CV joint because I had that once on a Honda, and it made a clicking noise in sharp turns. I have tried full-lock turns in both directions, and there is no noise. Dana, you are right that it may not be possible to diagnose it except by the process of elimination, but $1400 is a lot to spend eliminating something that I don't think is likely to be the cause anyway. The vibration does not happen when I rev up the engine in Park, and it does not change with engine RPM if I downshift into 4th or 3rd gear when it is happening. It is only related to speed not RPM, so I don't think it is the motor mounts. My gut tells me that it could be the transfer case, especially since the oil in the case smelled burnt when I drained and added some. But that is another pretty expensive thing to eliminate unless I can confirm that that is the most likely cause. For now, I am just driving it and trying to figure out what it could be. 
I have a similar vibration on my 2001 S type, have you solved your issue.
thank you,
Martha
#27
09-01-2011, 02:00 PM
My car did this since shortly after purchase. The transfer case lube was changed often. The Drive-shaft was replaced, as were some wheel bearings. It still does it.
Recently, I disassembled my T/C and found some really bad bearings. I know for a fact, they have not been bad since day one. So, I suspect replacement of those bearings won't change the drivetrain shudder this car has.
I hate to say it, but it's kind of normal for these cars. My solution is to go faster.
Also, some days were worse than others. As you noticed, changing T/C oil helps some.
Recently, I disassembled my T/C and found some really bad bearings. I know for a fact, they have not been bad since day one. So, I suspect replacement of those bearings won't change the drivetrain shudder this car has.
I hate to say it, but it's kind of normal for these cars. My solution is to go faster.
Also, some days were worse than others. As you noticed, changing T/C oil helps some.
#28
09-02-2011, 08:25 AM
Martha - no, I have never found the problem. It has been less noticeable since I changed the oil in the transfer case. As cujet mentioned, some days it is worse than others. Anyway, I have learned to live with it. Since it goes away once I stop accelerating, I just accelerate quickly and then use cruise control.
#29
09-02-2011, 09:07 PM
I completed the transfer case, prop-shaft bearing replacement today. The driveline shudder is much reduced. However, it still remains, however much less pronounced. Someone not familiar with the X-Type might not notice.
You might want to jack up the front of your car and roll the tire back and forth while watching the driveshaft. It it hops around like mine did, the T/C's "prop-shaft bearings are worn out.
You might want to jack up the front of your car and roll the tire back and forth while watching the driveshaft. It it hops around like mine did, the T/C's "prop-shaft bearings are worn out.
#30
09-04-2011, 07:24 AM
Weights
Have you looked to see if you have thrown a weight from either half shaft, or the differential. All cars have them as there is no way to get 100% balance on these. If you find or suspect you may have lost one, you can try this old trick, and put a hose clamp around it, and tighten it down and see if that makes a difference.
#31
09-04-2011, 09:44 AM
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#32
09-05-2011, 05:47 PM
Just a quick update, I've repaired my T/C by installing new bearings. The car is much smoother, but as I suspected, the drivetrain vibration is still there.
Interestingly enough, it was not there for the first drive after the repair. The car was perfectly smooth. I suspect driveshaft issues. Maybe the new grease damped the vibes for a short bit.
At this point in my car's life (106,000 miles), I won't chase it and I won't worry too much about it. I'm not going to try and tune it out.
I really do suspect that it's the nature of the car. I've rented X-types from Hertz years ago and they felt exactly the same.
My car becomes quite smooth over 70-75MPH. Maybe the vibes are masked by road noise, or maybe it goes away.
Interestingly enough, it was not there for the first drive after the repair. The car was perfectly smooth. I suspect driveshaft issues. Maybe the new grease damped the vibes for a short bit.
At this point in my car's life (106,000 miles), I won't chase it and I won't worry too much about it. I'm not going to try and tune it out.
I really do suspect that it's the nature of the car. I've rented X-types from Hertz years ago and they felt exactly the same.
My car becomes quite smooth over 70-75MPH. Maybe the vibes are masked by road noise, or maybe it goes away.
#33
09-06-2011, 08:43 AM
Ok, gotta ask, are your wheels still round? Took mine in for tires and 4X alignment/balance last spring and the tire shop told me my wheels (at least some of them) were bent... :-(
and that my rear bushing were worn and the rear couldn't be brought fully into alignment... :-( :-(
As I reported in another string, not only was one of my wheels bent it was cracked, too. It finally couldn't hold air and had to go. My tire place obtained a "reman" wheel (what ever that is) for $200. That was actually cheaper than what I was finding on EBAY so I went with it.
Anyway, it seems like our wheels are particularly vulnerable to potholes so just wondering whether your vibration could be partially due to a bent wheel.
================================================
Jaguar: Grace, Pace, and Space - Sir William Lyons
and that my rear bushing were worn and the rear couldn't be brought fully into alignment... :-( :-(
As I reported in another string, not only was one of my wheels bent it was cracked, too. It finally couldn't hold air and had to go. My tire place obtained a "reman" wheel (what ever that is) for $200. That was actually cheaper than what I was finding on EBAY so I went with it.
Anyway, it seems like our wheels are particularly vulnerable to potholes so just wondering whether your vibration could be partially due to a bent wheel.
================================================
Jaguar: Grace, Pace, and Space - Sir William Lyons
#34
09-19-2011, 10:06 PM
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Hey guys I just recently bought a 2004 jaguar xtype 3.0 and in the 2 weeks of owning it I have replaced the driveshaft the o ring valves on the intake and the power steering fluid! The car is still making this God awful knocking sound that is sooo embarrassing but the weird thing is it comes and goes ... Im suppost to take it in tomorrow to jaguar Richmond and its gonna be hard to diagnose if they can't hear the knock! I'm not sure what to do or what to think! Somebody please help! You can call me if you want ! 1-804-920-3896
#35
09-20-2011, 12:10 PM
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knocking
Not sure where your knocking is coming from, but if it is in the front you should check the tie rod ends. Mine were shot and when I replaced them my problem got much better. The final issue was bad tires. Now my car runs smooth as silk. I had a good 3/32" play in the tie rods. Some speeds there would be little vibration and at others it would get out of whack and really shake the car. It was not a consistant thing.
#36
01-08-2012, 11:07 AM
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This post for a vibration is the same in my 2002 s-type 2wheel drive,I have been a dealership mechanic for 10 years at a for dealer,my vibration is coming from the torque convertor lock-up clutches,will only lock-up after engine is warmed up,and only slips when accelerating! I am new to S-type and this forum,and haven't checked trans further yet, but this sounds like the same problem listed here!
#37
01-09-2012, 07:05 AM
Another quick update. I live in S. Florida. It is generally quite warm here.
Recently, we had a few days of near freezing temps. Wow did my car vibrate as I accelerated up to and reached highway speed (55). It had a "grumble" that lasted all the way to work.
However, during lunch, after the day warmed up, the car was "normally quiet".
Too weird.
I'm still guessing as to what it is. But, I have fresh fluids in everything. I suspect the driveshaft carrier bearing transmits vibes when cold.
What I'm thinking now, is that the rubber isolate mounts on everything get stiff when cold. Transmitting much more vibration. In particular, the driveshaft carrier bearing, which I believe "floats" in a rubber isolator.
This is a common problem on older diesel cars, trucks and equipment, when it is cold out, they shake like crazy. When warm, they are fairly smooth. All due to the properties of rubber mounts when cold.
Recently, we had a few days of near freezing temps. Wow did my car vibrate as I accelerated up to and reached highway speed (55). It had a "grumble" that lasted all the way to work.
However, during lunch, after the day warmed up, the car was "normally quiet".
Too weird.
I'm still guessing as to what it is. But, I have fresh fluids in everything. I suspect the driveshaft carrier bearing transmits vibes when cold.
What I'm thinking now, is that the rubber isolate mounts on everything get stiff when cold. Transmitting much more vibration. In particular, the driveshaft carrier bearing, which I believe "floats" in a rubber isolator.
This is a common problem on older diesel cars, trucks and equipment, when it is cold out, they shake like crazy. When warm, they are fairly smooth. All due to the properties of rubber mounts when cold.
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