Overheating & Coolant Loss
#61
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So I went out to my car and tried the test mode. Its pretty cool... Its a nice monitor for your car and does contain trouble codes. The problem... I cant find anywhere that has an explanation of what they are because they are not tradition "P" codes. I have been searching old forums it seems to be a dead end as others say that its really not connected through to the ecm. Apparently, they just pertain to the cluster as I had feared.
Thermo, I saw that you have played around in the "Test" mode. Can you confirm this?
Thermo, I saw that you have played around in the "Test" mode. Can you confirm this?
Last edited by stshots; 06-06-2011 at 01:03 PM.
#62
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Yes, the codes are able to be read from the instrument cluster, the problem is that they are in hexadecimal format. So, you have to get the code and then translate it from base 16 to base 10 to then read the code. I am pretty sure I have a PDF from Jag on reading the instrument cluster and the proper way to interpret all the data.
#63
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Here is what was displayed for DTC when I put it in ETM mode
A879 - this looks like something with fuel pump?
D900 - CAN bus communications error... maybe causing my OBDII problem (possible PCM error- does x-type have PCM or just ECM)
9359 - The same as related to the Ignition/ACC malfunction
9205 - something related to malfunction with ignition
according to the DTC summaries none of these cause MIL/CEL so that is good news.
A879 - this looks like something with fuel pump?
D900 - CAN bus communications error... maybe causing my OBDII problem (possible PCM error- does x-type have PCM or just ECM)
9359 - The same as related to the Ignition/ACC malfunction
9205 - something related to malfunction with ignition
according to the DTC summaries none of these cause MIL/CEL so that is good news.
Last edited by queensnewbie; 06-07-2011 at 10:58 PM.
#65
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Queens, where did you find the references for those codes? I'd love to have some translation material from the ETM. Something I noticed on mine was that in the ETM, I had 5 DTC's, but when I pugged it into my OBDII scan tool, I only had 1. I'm not sure how to clear them from the ETM because clearing the OBD with my scan tool didn't seem to have any effect on the ETM. In short, we may be chasing ghosts with the ETM, but at least its something to follow.
It seems that what you have found for codes is syncing with the ones that came back from the dealer. I'd bet the "Fuel pump" code is the lean codes and the "ignition" are the misfires.
What was the result of the starter fluid test?
It seems that what you have found for codes is syncing with the ones that came back from the dealer. I'd bet the "Fuel pump" code is the lean codes and the "ignition" are the misfires.
What was the result of the starter fluid test?
Last edited by stshots; 06-08-2011 at 10:27 AM.
#66
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stshots,
I did an indepth search online for dtc codes using engineering test mode regarding Jag and Ford. The numbers provided through the ICM do seem to only be ICM related and are given in HEX format. From what I could gather, codes starting with A in Hex would be translate into B2 for DTC codes. So for my Hex code A879, I looked up B2879 (B is for a Body DTC code). The code with a D would translate to a U1, so my D900 code was U1900. (U is a Network DTC code). My Hex codes starting in 9 translated to a B1 for DTC codes, so they were B1359 and B1205, respectively. I then looked up the corresponding codes here and some other Ford Forums when it wasn't specified in the documents below:
http://jaguar.bttlxe.com/xtype/Body%...IN%20C0034.pdf (Body)
and here
http://jaguar.bttlxe.com/xtype/Netwo...N%20C00344.pdf (Network).
Here are the OBDII DTC Summaries for P codes:
Xtype Power Train DTC Summaries
About the starter fluid, I did the ETM thing at 11 at night and couldn't go any further since it was so dark... it's been a rough couple weeks personally so at 11pm I wasn't working in any type of light to do the test. However, after reading some past posts about clearing CELs with the battery, I now think that the vacuum leak code the dealer pulled may be old. My friend cleared the CEL/limpmode by disconnecting the battery a couple weeks ago after changing the water pump (it obviously came back on since then). But, based on a past post from Sidewalkman, even though a battery disconnect can clear CEL and limp, the codes are still stored. I previously had a CEL with a code when I had my IMT O-rings go out last year that were never cleared from the ECM. So now I am thinking (and hoping) that set of vacuum leak codes (and maybe others) are old and not relevant to this current CEL. What a mess!
I did an indepth search online for dtc codes using engineering test mode regarding Jag and Ford. The numbers provided through the ICM do seem to only be ICM related and are given in HEX format. From what I could gather, codes starting with A in Hex would be translate into B2 for DTC codes. So for my Hex code A879, I looked up B2879 (B is for a Body DTC code). The code with a D would translate to a U1, so my D900 code was U1900. (U is a Network DTC code). My Hex codes starting in 9 translated to a B1 for DTC codes, so they were B1359 and B1205, respectively. I then looked up the corresponding codes here and some other Ford Forums when it wasn't specified in the documents below:
http://jaguar.bttlxe.com/xtype/Body%...IN%20C0034.pdf (Body)
and here
http://jaguar.bttlxe.com/xtype/Netwo...N%20C00344.pdf (Network).
Here are the OBDII DTC Summaries for P codes:
Xtype Power Train DTC Summaries
About the starter fluid, I did the ETM thing at 11 at night and couldn't go any further since it was so dark... it's been a rough couple weeks personally so at 11pm I wasn't working in any type of light to do the test. However, after reading some past posts about clearing CELs with the battery, I now think that the vacuum leak code the dealer pulled may be old. My friend cleared the CEL/limpmode by disconnecting the battery a couple weeks ago after changing the water pump (it obviously came back on since then). But, based on a past post from Sidewalkman, even though a battery disconnect can clear CEL and limp, the codes are still stored. I previously had a CEL with a code when I had my IMT O-rings go out last year that were never cleared from the ECM. So now I am thinking (and hoping) that set of vacuum leak codes (and maybe others) are old and not relevant to this current CEL. What a mess!
#67
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Yes, the codes are able to be read from the instrument cluster, the problem is that they are in hexadecimal format. So, you have to get the code and then translate it from base 16 to base 10 to then read the code. I am pretty sure I have a PDF from Jag on reading the instrument cluster and the proper way to interpret all the data.
#69
#70
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Well the car is back in 1 piece but the limp mode/CEL/rough running issue still exists....... So far the water pump, thermostat, spark plugs, upper and lower plenum gaskets were changed. We are going to replace the 2 coils where the misfires are happening as a last effort. If not Im afraid this x-type will be traded in for a down payment on another in a couple months
lol
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Last edited by queensnewbie; 08-06-2011 at 11:46 PM.
#71
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Queen,before you give up completely on the car, have you tried spraying some contact cleaner into the plugs. It could be based on your other issues that the plugs to the coils have gotten dirty. The cleaner is cheap. The only "issue" is whether it is the front or rear COPs that we are talking about here. Fronts are easy, rears, well, not so much.
#72
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Hey guys, I want to thank you for all the advice and guidance in this thread. After all the repairs and no changes combined with a shot OBDII connector/wiring that we can't figure out, we are going to trade in the car. As a final shot in the dark, we changed the 2 coil which were misfiring but the car still runs the exact same- CEL blinking with intermittent cruise unavailable. It still drives fine, idles a bit rough but doesn't get over 50 with the limp mode on. I am hesitant to drive it even around town, in fear of totally making it immobile. Good news is, we are going to look for another newer year X or S Type! Thanks for all the help, esp stshots and Thermo!
Last edited by queensnewbie; 09-11-2011 at 09:10 PM.
#73
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Queen, sorry to hear of the misfortunes with the car. But, if you are out looking, don't forget to take a look at the XJ8's of the same year X/S-Type. For a little bit more money, you are getting a lot more car. If I knew then what I know now, I would have bought me an XJ8 vice the X-Type.
#75
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thanks guys and good recommendations. This is kind of a joint decisions between me and the wife. We both are not fans of the Jag redesigns as a whole. I agree with Thermo, I love the XJ8 or even XJR (despite their issue) but she doesn't want such a long car and something that handles easy. Our other car is an Aviator so a sporty sedan was great for our second car, hence the X-Type. Despite the issues at the end, we still love the look and feel!
#76
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Thank you queensnewbie and friends for all your posts. I have a similar problem and found a crack in the coolant tank, looked at all the hoses, T fitting, water pump as in your case. A friend told me to take the cap off the coolant tank and see if white smoke was coming from the tail pipe that smelled like anti-freeze. I did and it was white and smelled like anti-freeze. I was advised by my friend and a mech. I called this morning that it sounds like a cracked head or head gasket. What's confusing is that when I called the jag dealer, the mech. said it was common on the 03 x-type to have coolant tank cracks and that they could pressure test it when I install the new tank. It's easy to install but I am worried about the coolant filled twice already, similar to queensnewbie's problem. I duct taped the coolant tank and tried to run it a short distance but it overheated and I still had coolant coming from the coolant tank. I am wondering if I need to panic about the gasket or head issue or if the jag mech. is right.
#77
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pclem,
Part of the reason I documented all the happenings with my car in this thread was to help others with similar issues. The huge disadvantage for me was that my ODB II reader does not work to draw the CEL codes. I was basically grasping as straws trying to figure out what was wrong.
As Thermo and others told me before, is there is white smoke coming from the tailpipe it may likely be a bad head gasket. Fortunately mine did not have that issue. I did have a pressure test done to try and find the leak but they never found one. The frustrating thing with this situation is that it seems like once the coolant leaks enough, a deluge of other issues can arise from it, meaning that you have to not only fix the coolant leak but the consequential issues after it.
As of now my 03 X-Type doesn't seem to be leaking or eating coolant anymore, I had the following replaced first to try and resolve that:
Part of the reason I documented all the happenings with my car in this thread was to help others with similar issues. The huge disadvantage for me was that my ODB II reader does not work to draw the CEL codes. I was basically grasping as straws trying to figure out what was wrong.
As Thermo and others told me before, is there is white smoke coming from the tailpipe it may likely be a bad head gasket. Fortunately mine did not have that issue. I did have a pressure test done to try and find the leak but they never found one. The frustrating thing with this situation is that it seems like once the coolant leaks enough, a deluge of other issues can arise from it, meaning that you have to not only fix the coolant leak but the consequential issues after it.
As of now my 03 X-Type doesn't seem to be leaking or eating coolant anymore, I had the following replaced first to try and resolve that:
- Coolant Tank
- Water Pump
- Thermostat
- Upper & Lower Plenum Gaskets
- Spark Plugs
- 2 Coil Packs on Misfired Cylinders
#78
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Dear Queensnewbie, Thermo, and all,
Thank you for all of your suggestions and e-mails. I just received the coolant tank part this afternoon so I am going to try all your suggestions tomorrow. I was hoping to find someone local to do the pressure test but no one seems to have the equipment and jag charges 189.00. I'll let you know how I make out tomorrow. Thank you so much everyone for the help and the warm welcome!
Sincerely,
Pclem
Thank you for all of your suggestions and e-mails. I just received the coolant tank part this afternoon so I am going to try all your suggestions tomorrow. I was hoping to find someone local to do the pressure test but no one seems to have the equipment and jag charges 189.00. I'll let you know how I make out tomorrow. Thank you so much everyone for the help and the warm welcome!
Sincerely,
Pclem
#79
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Dear Everyone,
As suggested. I think by Thermo, that I remove the bonnet. I did the jaguar cover and the other cover that was behind it. I learned that the air filter was there. I did not see any leaks but did see a black, what looked like a burnt spot on the engine just below the oil cap. It felt soft to the touch. Does that indicate a blown head? I replaced the coolant tank which I guess is also called an expansion tank? The coolant was green but the prior coolant I had put in when I had the cracked one was orange. I left the cap off this time and let it warm up, at least till I saw faint bubbles in the coolant tank. Very little if any, smoke from the tail pipe this time. I was not sure since it was so different from the first time I did it with the cracked tank. I looked under and everywhere all of you mentioned, the water pump, thermostat as much as I could but did not see anything. I can't even find the spark plugs on this nightmare of a design. This is my first jag. The coolant tank antifreeze turned orange and green combined after it warmed up. Im going to take it to the mechanic and have him pressure test and check it anyway. Im not an auto mechanic but tried. I think this is beyond my abilities. He can do the test for $80. versus 189.00 at the jag dealer so it's worth the check. Would I see anti-freeze in the dipstick? It seems difficult to check the gaskets, o-rings, etc. without taking so much apart. What do you guys and gals think?
pcle,
As suggested. I think by Thermo, that I remove the bonnet. I did the jaguar cover and the other cover that was behind it. I learned that the air filter was there. I did not see any leaks but did see a black, what looked like a burnt spot on the engine just below the oil cap. It felt soft to the touch. Does that indicate a blown head? I replaced the coolant tank which I guess is also called an expansion tank? The coolant was green but the prior coolant I had put in when I had the cracked one was orange. I left the cap off this time and let it warm up, at least till I saw faint bubbles in the coolant tank. Very little if any, smoke from the tail pipe this time. I was not sure since it was so different from the first time I did it with the cracked tank. I looked under and everywhere all of you mentioned, the water pump, thermostat as much as I could but did not see anything. I can't even find the spark plugs on this nightmare of a design. This is my first jag. The coolant tank antifreeze turned orange and green combined after it warmed up. Im going to take it to the mechanic and have him pressure test and check it anyway. Im not an auto mechanic but tried. I think this is beyond my abilities. He can do the test for $80. versus 189.00 at the jag dealer so it's worth the check. Would I see anti-freeze in the dipstick? It seems difficult to check the gaskets, o-rings, etc. without taking so much apart. What do you guys and gals think?
pcle,
#80
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pclem, depending on how the head gasket fails, sometimes you will see the oil go from a "black" to a light gray color. The gray color is bad as the oil has gotten water in it. So, do a quick look at the oil. It will be very obvious if you have coolant in the oil.
Another check that you can try is a compression check. That will sometimes show you if the head gasket is still good. What you will see is most of the cylinders up in teh 140-155 psi range and then 1 or 2 cylinders down around 30ish psi. If you have 2 cylinders down at the same PSI and they are side by side, the headgasket has failed between the two cylinders. If you have only a single cylinder that is low, then you have a problem with that cylinder (can't say it is the head gasket beyond a shadow of a doubt). This is where additional testing would be needed. The best check is to put the cylinder in question at top dead center and then usign a modified spark plug, put about 90 psi of air into the cylinder. Then you can listen to the exhaust pipe, intake at the throttlebody, look in the expansion tank, and into the oil fill opening. Where you hear/see air, that is the source of your problem. Ie, if you hear air moving in the exhaust pipe, then your exhaust valves have an issue with them. If you hear it in your oil fill opening, then your rings or valve guides are shot.
If you lived near southern Maryland, I would tell you to come on down near me and we could do this at my place. It isn't that bad really, just a little bit of disassembly.
Another check that you can try is a compression check. That will sometimes show you if the head gasket is still good. What you will see is most of the cylinders up in teh 140-155 psi range and then 1 or 2 cylinders down around 30ish psi. If you have 2 cylinders down at the same PSI and they are side by side, the headgasket has failed between the two cylinders. If you have only a single cylinder that is low, then you have a problem with that cylinder (can't say it is the head gasket beyond a shadow of a doubt). This is where additional testing would be needed. The best check is to put the cylinder in question at top dead center and then usign a modified spark plug, put about 90 psi of air into the cylinder. Then you can listen to the exhaust pipe, intake at the throttlebody, look in the expansion tank, and into the oil fill opening. Where you hear/see air, that is the source of your problem. Ie, if you hear air moving in the exhaust pipe, then your exhaust valves have an issue with them. If you hear it in your oil fill opening, then your rings or valve guides are shot.
If you lived near southern Maryland, I would tell you to come on down near me and we could do this at my place. It isn't that bad really, just a little bit of disassembly.