Hi all, I've been resisting posting about this, hoping against hope that the brand I've been loyal to for 10+ years, through 2 XJ8s and now an XF, would love me back. Alas, it's not to be, and I’m ready to share. I apologize in advance for the length of this post but I really need your help to know what to do next and want to share all the details I have.

I own a business to which I drive 130k daily, from door to door, not including errands and customer visits. Given that I drive due north on a scary-slippery freeway in winter, and that my 2004 XJ SV8 was just giving up with that kind of punishment (engine still perfect! Everything else was failing), I decided it was time for an AWD vehicle, and purchased a new 2013 XF 3.0 Portfolio AWD. Please indulge me a little, to describe her: White, with beige/truffle interior, Premium package, Winter package, upgraded Meridian sound, Convenience package, fold-down split rear seat w/ski bag. Stunning car that I was SO happy with. But. Then, 12 calendar days into ownership, I was tooling along going home and just happened to look down at the dash, to see a huge red message that said, "WARNING, oil level is dangerously low!" No tones, bells, whistles, or alarms. Long, embarrassing, and agonizing story short, I flatbedded her to the dealer, who was very accommodating during the emergency, and gave me an LR2 loaner car, which I am still using, 12 days later. Yes – the car has been sitting on a rack at the dealership just as long as she was in my possession, as of today.

The first meaningful response from the dealer’s service department was that the issue was a “defrost” plug, later revised to be a “frost” plug (see my earlier posting on that issue) which has NOTHING to do with oil, validated by two kind souls on this forum. In any case, the service manager said that they had to order a plug part from the U.K. because they don’t stock such a thing, and it will take 5 – 10 business days to receive. Now, I’m not a mechanic and am certainly no expert on service department materials management, but if a large, recognized Jaguar dealership in Toronto does not stock a part, this must be an unusual case. Especially if it will take 5 – 10 business days to receive it, as it must not be something that is typically needed by a dealer’s service department. My personal, uneducated opinion is that this is a part that would only be touched during engine manufacturing, in a sterile environment, and would not be a dealer-serviceable item.

I had to get some things out of the car to carry on with life and, while doing so, I saw the oil pan on the floor of the service bay. The oil residue was literally muddy. I know that muddy oil means that gasoline has leaked into the oil, which can only be a result of a leak in the engine block. Thoughts on that? Mustn’t it be a cracked block or at least a seal failure?

My husband contacted Jaguar North America (JNA) and notified them of the issue. He expressed my concern about getting a car back that failed in 12 days and < 1200Kms, and the person said that he didn’t blame me for that! And he opened a case. Since then, Hubby and I have left 3 messages for the dealership’s GM who has never responded. JNA is supposedly “investigating” and have ”consulted with the dealership”, but the dealership (the very kind sales manager) says that no one has contacted them.

A very nice but completely ineffectual customer service lady from NYC called tonight after my husband’s latest rant letter and explained that I would likely not ever get to speak with the JNA investigator but that she would pass along the information that I absolutely, positively, will NOT take this car back, under any circumstances, and that if they really want to make me a raving fan, they’ll give me the same car in the 2014 model and apologize sincerely for my trouble.

Since I am not allowed to speak with the JNA investigator, and the dealership seems to be working on the assumption that I will be forced to take this car after it is repaired, I’m at a complete loss as to what to do. Jaguar seems to have set up a structure in which customers are stonewalled. Is history repeating itself – where a Jaguar product is in the shop at least half of the time? In my case, as of today, that’s certainly the case! Does Jaguar really care about their reputation? And what reputation are they trying to project/protect?

What should I do now? Thank you for reading and any and all advice is very greatly welcomed!

Kind regards,
Kristin

 

Gasoline in your oil won't be there for long once the sump is off, it is very volatile and evaporates almost immediately. Also, gasoline won't make oil muddy looking.

Coolant in your oil would likely make it look muddy. However, coolant in the sump sinks to the bottom and the oil floats on top so the oil level sensor would not see that as low oil.

A freeze plug is actually a casting plug. When the block is cast it has holes in it. These are sealed with plugs. Most block heaters are installed by dealers in a freeze plug opening and dealers are certainly able to service freeze plugs. Likely they would not stock this part as Jaguar engines come to Canada with block heaters already installed by Jaguar in the Birmingham assembly plant or more likely the Ford engine plant at Bridgend in Wales. Neither the engine plant in Wales nor the Castle Bromwich vehicle assembly plant is sterile. They are reasonably clean but do not need to be sterile. Any competent dealer mechanic could completely disassemble your Jaguar engine and re-assemble it in their shop and it would be at least as good as new, probably better.

All Jaguar cars sold in Canada come with four year warranties and courtesy replacement vehicle paid or by Jaguar UK.

Rest assured your car is costing Jaguar big time and they will be working as quickly as possible to fix it. You won't ever get a new car out of Jaguar, this is Canada not litigation crazy USA.

You might get a new engine but only if your old one can't be repaired. My guess is they will just repair your engine and you will have an as new XF, yours.

 

OMG are you with Jaguar? You completely missed the point. So disappointed. Raw mad.

 

PS I am American. And I'm beginning to be concerned.

 

Sometimes I think he is. Granted, he is right about it not being gasoline in the oil. Oil and coolant notoriously combine to make the chocolate milkshake you referenced. Who knows what damage was done. A freeze plug should not mix oil and coolant - it would just discharge fluid onto the ground. Oil and coolant mixed somewhere in your engine.

I agree with you 100% about the car and, at the least, would not take it back with that engine. Not sure how much further you will be able to legally push in Canada. That said, if Jaguar truly cared about the customer they would offer to buy the car back.

 

Thanks, and yep, no way I'm taking anything to do with that car back.

 

I can't even sleep over this. Thanks for your support.

 

I can completely understand how you would be upset and perplexed by the responses or lack thereof you have been receiving. Certainly bad luck.

It's possible that JLRNA will decide to just make this better for you, but why would you expect that they give you an equivalent 2014, which is worth several thousand more than you paid? Frankly, any new vehicle has a warranty that stipulates what the remedies are - I think it would be completely unreasonable to expect that a manufacturer not only replace your car, but replace it with a newer model year.

You also have to take into consideration that the manufacturer has to be as consistent as possible on the treatment of these kinds of claims, otherwise there is a very real poossiblitiy that the precedent would be set for anyone else with something similar occuring to their vehicle. I would suggest writing a letter, sending it via registered mail, to both the dealership and to JLRNA, demanding that your vehicle be made right and immediately.

It's just so hard to deal with such a problem when it is basically a brand new car, but it is a very slippery slope for the manufacturer - new car at 1000km? What about at 5000 or 10000 or 15000? Where is the limit? The warranty stipulates the vehicle will be repaired, and I don't think anything you've shared would necessarily indicate a trashed engine. let alone the whole vehicle. Maybe get them to offer you a CPO warranty gratis to assure you?

 

i got a brand new BMW last month and it failed after 80 MILES! transmission was toasted. so i completely understand your concern...it sucks to have a brand new car just fail like that. but as the saying goes "**** happens".

as for the part that needs to be shipped from the UK, dealerships dont carry every single part thats made. other times there are parts on back order. My transmission was one of two that were left in the country....if i wasnt able to get it, i would have had to wait 2 weeks.

the only thing now is to wait and watch JNA make it right by you. demanding a brand new car is out of the question (at this point). they will do their best to fix your engine, even if they give you a brand new one. if it fails again...rest assured you can fight for a new car. for now their priorities are to fix your car

 

There is a point when here in the states you can lemon law a vehicle. It varies state by state so you may want to research what that looks like in your state. It sounds like they are legitimately trying to repair it though so I would give the shop a chance or take it to another dealer for a second opinion.

Sorry that sucks especially on a brand new car. Look at the bright side though, at least you're not slumming it in a Range Rover

 

Firstly, let me say how we sympathise with you and hope that we can help you through this as quickly as possible, both by offering advice and maybe just by listening..

I'd like to say that Jagular IMO was just being honest and realistic, no more, no less.......

Cars fail, used car AND new cars of ALL types, makes & models unfortunately.

It seems that the dealer network is set up differently in Canada / America as to how it is here. Keeping my fingers crossed for a quick resolution that you're happy with.

Hope to hear.......

 

Kristin, sorry to learn about your bad experience...so far. Luckily, we have a gent here that may be of assistance, please contact him, link below.
Good luck

https://www.jaguarforums.com/forum/x...lations-95705/

 

Kristin,

Sorry to hear about your bad experience with the 2013 XF 3.0 AWD and with JLR customer relations. I hope you get the problem resolved quickly.

Your story has me a bit on edge about this particular model as I'm taking delivery of a new 2013 XF 3.0 AWD tomorrow. What puzzles me is that a "frost plug" is an expansion plug located on the engine block that is supposed to protect the block against freeze damage. Here in the northeast we've had pretty balmy weather during the fall. Do you live in an area where the temperature has already dipped below freezing? If not I suspect this problem is from something else.

Mike

 

I would not worry about it. As jagular said, a frost plug is actually a casting plug. All engines have them and the name is a bit of a misnomer. Look at the definition on Wikipedia and that may calm some concerns. This is not anything you should worry about. It is mostly likely a one off, unfortunate situation for the poster.

 

Your post is from Toronto. Better go home and complain there.

 

Wow, that's awful about your BMW. I do understand that "**** happens"; however, as a business owner myself (certainly not on the scale of Jaguar) I recognize the importance of customer loyalty and satisfaction toward my success and do everything I can to make it right and, hopefully, better for my customers. In this case, so far there's been nothing done other than the dealer has received this mysterious "oil plug" from the UK and have had a "specialist" install it. They are doing some sort of testing yesterday and today, and expect to have the car ready sometime this afternoon. I haven't decided exactly what to do when I receive that phone call other than say, "thanks for the call". I haven't heard from JNA since last week and I hope to hear from them today as well. Thanks for your post...cheers.

 

HAHA thats true!

 

Thank you very much. Everyone's support means a lot and does make me feel better. My husband actually came across this gentleman's posts a few days ago and I will contact him. Hopefully, in a future post, I can provide an update with some good news!

 

Hi Mike,

I live in Toronto so, no, it's actually still quite nice here. The apparently sadly misinformed service manager at the dealer initially told me that this was, in his words, a "defrost plug" which I researched and found to be a "frost plug" which obviously has nothing to do with engine oil. He soon changed his terminology to "oil plug", which is still mysterious and I have no idea why it would fail. As a result, my level of confidence in this person is pretty much at absolute zero.

I did lots of research before I decided to buy the XF, and all indications are that, under normal circumstances, it is a great car with a great reputation. As mine was rolled in on the flatbed, one of the managers at the dealer said that they've never had one come back like that.

So...I wouldn't worry. This was clearly a defect that doesn't happen often. I just wish it hadn't happened to me Good luck to you, tho!

 

Don't be too hard on the service manager. Most don't know a ton about cars. It would be nice if they did, but they don't. They aren't the techs working on them. They relay the info to you and occasionally they don't understand the issue and explain it incorrectly. It can be frustrating.

Sorry to hear about your issue. Hopefully it's fixed and you are back on the road ASAP. At least you have a decent loaner vehicle. Some dealers loan out cheap rental cars.