Just emailed Eurotoys to see if they have thought about an intercooler for an XFR. Will update when I get anything.

 

First race of the day was the best time for both of us.

 

Remember Drag racing is a very "final drive"/ traction dependent event. The 3.31 gears are just not suited for launching a 5K lb car. A 3.91 or even a 4.11 with the 6speed auto would REALLY wake things up.

 

Kyanite, I just noticed on your dyno chart that you actually lost about 12 ftlbs and 25 hp in the mid range when you added the pulley...that's weird....it obviously gave you a little bump in both before 3500rpm and after 5250rpm

 

No, it's actual. Pics are attached over on the 1/4 mi page under the Motorsports section.
Track elevation is 562ft IIRC (Ennis, TX @ Texas Motorplex), temps were around 89. I think I posted more weather conds on the orig post.

 

y'all have 3.31's? The XFRS has 2.56 rears. I thought the R had the same so I ran the simulations with 2.56. If I bump it up to 3.31 it's going to make the power levels drop for the R's

 

It's funny because it feels even stronger across the midrange. Still wondering if the exhaust mod changed things as well (less back pressure). The pulley flattened the torque curve across a much broader range though.

I still don't know how much of the variation between the runs was due to heat soak and/or different days, but I've been in touch with Jailbreak and I'm going to get it redyno'd sometime soon. I'm going to get there early and ice it down first just to see what it can really do.

 

The final drive for our cars is 3.31, however, we are all on the older six speed ZF gearbox compared to your newer eight speed unit!

 

Ok, I screwed up. Never thought for a second that the R had the 6spd/3.31

Let me plug back in the 6 spd numbers and re-curve fit based on patrick/kyanite and see what comes out.

 

Allenman, we appreciate the effort, even if you did it wrong...now get back on that program and get us some real numbers!

 

Ok for everyone subscribed to this thread about simulation.
Here's is what I did.
1) Adjusted weight from XFRS to XFR weight per Jaguar.com. Weight in sim includes 200lb driver
2) Adjusted elevation, temp, baro per Patrick's info & Fontana,CA website
3) Took Jaguar XFRS engine power (published) and took off *about* 40HP at peak but only a soft adjustment up to 3800 RPM. This is part of "curve fitting" needed in simulation and published 510HP vs 550HP.

Ran data with 3.31 rear & ZF 6 spd gears. Here are the results:
DIST SEC MPH
60' 2.09 39.26
330' 5.40 71.70
660' 8.16 91.07
1000' 10.64 103.92
1320' 12.65 113.19

This is somewhere an average of Patrick's 2nd & 3rd timeslip but it shows an aggressive 330 ft. Recall that the simulator does not adjust for tirespin.


Next on to Kyanite...

 

Ok Kyanite, Yours was similar but your car was showing significant HP improvement over stock at high RPM. The best curve-fit I could get was by adding a big step of HP in 3rd gear and above. All other data identical to patrick's data. This is what the sim showed:
DIST SEC MPH
60' 2.08 39.49
330' 5.36 72.36
660' 8.07 93.55
1000' 10.49 106.75
1320' 12.44 117.01
Now what did I have to do? I added a boost of 40HP across the board above 5000RPM but only *after* 2nd gear.
The simulated HP curve is still showing SAE corrected HP to be around 565 around 6000 RPM but again, only in upper gears. It would take true black-box data to try to understand what's happening but it appears that the power increase is not smooth across the RPM and it's also not showing up in the 330' times.
It is probably more likely that the ECU/TCU is pulling back to avoid wheelspin. *Best guess*

HTH

 

Allenman, thanks for the info! I'm going to call EuroToys later today. I emailed and asked about the intercooler, and they can do one, but Mike said that he felt water/meth injection was better. I want to find out exactly what needs to be done for that to work.

WRX, since you've had this in the past, want to share any experiences?

 

So I can't offer a ton of wisdom here because I did the research way back when I was thinking about adding Hydramist to the standalone ECU on my STI. I sold the car before I ended up pulling the trigger on the system. I did follow a lot of people who ended up doing it and it's very similar in concept to adding nitrous to your car, in terms of a tank to hold it, safety switches and spraying it into the intake or directly into the cylinders. There are some extra pumps to add, IIRC you could set it to only spray at WOT or to spray on a button, etc. You do have to make sure you keep your tank filled with whatever is being sprayed, usually 50/50 water alcohol.

It cools the intake charge massively and makes it a lot harder for knocking to occur, so you can run more aggressive timing. In that way it's effectively like running race gas all the time . Not only that it basically steam cleans your engine...I remember talking to my engine builder who said he broke down an engine that ran on meth for a while and the components looked shiny brand new. It's one of the safest ways to make a ton of power even on stock boosted engines. You definitely do need to tune for WI / MI or else you will not see any gains at all....so work with your tuner on it. If it is a well known or big one like Jailbreak I am sure they have written tunes before.

A quick search on the interwebs and on forums should be really helpful. I seem to remember Snow Performance, Coolingmist and AEM being big vendors in that space, it couldn't hurt to reach out to them as well.

Would love for someone here to try this! I promised myself I wouldn't heavily modify this car haha

 

Kyanite and I had a phone discussion about water/meth injection the other day, and I dug up this link from our forums that might be relevant. Some guy with the boosted 4.2 ran one for a while, took it off, then put it back on again and seems to have been having good success with it:

https://www.jaguarforums.com/forum/x...on-more-79898/

 

https://www.jaguarforums.com/forum/a...1&d=1432234638

Be wary of the blue tongue when spraying washer fluid!
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Just a quick comment on water/methanol injection as I have had kits installed on previous vehicles.

Although I have never run a water/meth kit in a vehicle utilizing a positive displacement supercharger, I have run the kit in both a centrifugal supercharged and a turbocharged vehicle. Ironically, these kits were both installed on a Honda S2000!

The kit used on the centrifugal supercharged S2000 was an AEM kit that was plugged into the AEM EMS V2 ECU that I had running on the car. Because the ECU and water/meth kit were designed to work with each other, delivery and tuning were quite easy to set up as per comment from my tuner. Making the best use of the progressive controller, the mixture would start at a low CC delivery when the system detected 1lb of boost and would be progressively shooting more water/meth as boost built. By 12lbs of boost (of 16lbs max), the system was at full delivery using the 500cc nozzle. After a brief adjustment, I was able to gain nearly 50whp without going overboard on timing advance. Thankfully, the system also had a low fluid warning setting which would shut down the water/meth system and revert back to a map using only premium grade fuel.

There is no doubt that water/meth is beneficial in making reliable power. In regards to our cars, I believe the gain would come from the water decreasing intake temperatures, temperatures within the supercharger, and by creating higher boost pressure. It is well documented in the Mustang/GT500 community that spraying water/meth into the Eaton blowers creates a side effect of slightly higher boost. This is due to the liquid mixture effectively sealing the rotors and sidewalls a bit better. Not only does this create a bit more boost, it also lowers the air temperature within the supercharger a dramatic amount.

My only worry is that these lowered temperatures might cause condensation on the charge cooler which is right after the supercharger. If this happens, we might get a bit of water inside the engine which could...bend things. I will have to do a bit more research to see if this ever occurs in other vehicles running Roots style blowers but it is definitely something I've kept in mind.

Hopefully Kyanite can trail-blaze a new path just as he did with finding a custom tuner!

 

I was able to acheive 11.736 @ 119.4. Condition of the tires and external temperature play a big roll. Back then I have just installed a new set of Michlin Supersport and it was around 19-21c. You can visit dragtimes which displays 3 timing slips along another thread in this forum outlining the set of modification. It was full weight and running on pump gas of 91.