Hi all,

I am new to the forum but have been reading many threads and thank you for the forum.

I am considering an X351 for the first time, possibly a 2013 long wheel base. Forgive me , but I have always had W140 Mercedes S class, which I find very satisfying as they are almost silent with an impeccable ride (though *only* if in great condition...!), and the difficulty in keeping them in great condition nearly 30 years after they first came out is becoming nigh on impossible. (especially the Einsteinesque suspension). And so, as I get older, I am perhaps waving the white flag... So in looking for an alternatve I am struck by the X351. I have read some concerns about the ride, but have also read by 2013 it was improved by Jaguar (albeit denied by them as need to be). A friend of mine has a 2011 XJ (swb) and he believes / experiences that rides great. When the time comes I will be am deciding between an XJL but also a W221 Mercedes. I know the MB 221 is very quiet, but not as quiet as a W222, but reading this forum and the reviews has left me very tempted by an X351, especially given how inexpensive they are now, and how much space the LWB has. Can anyone give advice on which year / model variant would be the quietest, ride the best, and what "Model Code XJ-LWB-PL" means? I have access to cars overseas and see in Japan, unless I am mistaken, that a non supercharged V6 was available in 2013? I am long past being young, so quiet and elegant is all I need for my remaining time... Also, can 17 inch or 18 inch wheels fit on a 2013 XJL? As I am aware if I can fit a smaller wheel, I can then increase the sidewall height (and presumably improve ride). Any advice on getting the very best ride (is LWB better?) would be very much appreciated, as for medical reasons I can't stand noise. Thank you all.

 

I can't give much advice on the XJ other than they did not come with a non-supercharged V6 in 2013, the petrol V6 they came with was/is the AJ126 which only ever came as supercharged. It is based on the AJ133 5.0 litre V8 which came in both supercharged and non-supercharged (NA) up until mid 2012 when the NA version was dropped and was replaced by the AJ126.

 

Quietness, for what I see you seeking, I think you may be needing to do a bit of modification to get what you are after. I think you may end up spending a grand or two on some stuff called dynamat. It is an insulator/sound deadening board/mat that you put into the car. You would run it up behind the dash as much as practical and then across the floor and then most likely up and over the wheel wells and over the back seat (between the seat and the body). This would block most of the noise that you are after. You can then go further and do the pillars and roof if you need just that little bit more. Keep in mind that when you do this, you are going to essentially rip out the interior of the car and put this stuff over every piece of metal you can find and then put the interior back together.

As for wheels, 17's are no even an option. So, you can drop that idea. I think you may be able to fix 18" rims on the car, but you are going to need to make sure that you get either the NA 5.0L or the supercharged V6. Both of those came with the smaller rotors which will allow for the use of a smaller rim. But I still think it is going to be hit and miss as to what rim may or may not work. So, it may take a little bit of playing to make it all work.

 

If your looking for quietness then it's the V6 I have one very quiet in normal driving about town and even on the highway at speeds of 80mph the engine is very smooth and quiet , if you floor the gas pedal all you can hear is a whine from the super charged unit , a lot prefer the v8 as it has a bit of a grunt from exhaust, performance wise from the v6 to the v8 only a second of different in performance v6 , 5.7 sec , v8 4.7 sec 0-60 stats , then you get various models in v8 guise some have 510 bhp some are 550 and then 575 , the v6 is 340 bhp

 

Hello and welcome.
You've had experience with luxury cars kept long beyond the typical "executive lease" scenario, so you know the perils and pleasures of this risky practice. There's a reason why cars are offered at a particular price. There are precious few "bargains" out there, particularly in the US since the pandemic. As a Mercedes owner, I'm sure you're familiar with the expression, "Anybody can afford to buy a Merc, but few can afford to maintain one." Jaguar ownership, at least in the States, takes this catchphrase to another level. MB sells five or ten big sedans for every XJ sold here, and you'd be fortunate to find one good independent, JLR-experienced shop in every major city. If you don't have one near you, or at least a JLR dealer, forget about owning a big cat.
An unfortunate effect of low-volume production is the long time it takes for problems to appear in such cars. If you search this forum, you'll see examples of poor design or materials that linger for several years that would have been found and fixed on Corollas within months. A typical 2013 XJ has fewer deficiencies than a 2010, but only in the final years of production did JLR finally get things mostly right. Also, the long-wheelbase version only benefits rear seat passengers, so ask yourself how much time the rear seat will be used. I have a SWB, and it very comfortably holds four full-size adults.
If interior noise and a comfortable ride are your most important criteria, buy the Merc. If you are seduced by the styling and exclusivity of the XJ (and have a shop nearby), buy the latest-MY, normally-aspirated V-8 version you can find. If you buy the Jag, fit the quietest OE-size tires and simply enjoy the car.

 

Thank you for all the replies. appreciated. Very good remiinder about the dynamat also - thank you. I too thought they never made a non supercharged V6, but the cars I am looking at are in the far east and the seller claims (probably ignorantly that his is not SC and V6). And I appreciate all the comments about get the best MY year you can and the best model. Having come from the MB W140 model, I know all too well how early model years can be, shall we say, explosively painful. It seems the X351 is much better that many recent MB's (eg W220 - nightmare reliability) and also better right from the get go vs the W140. The "interesting" part is the counrty I am in, in has NO Jaguar dealer. Yes you heard that right. None. Now before you all think I am crazy, the (so called) MB dealer here is worse than useless anyway. When I bought a 25,000 mile MB wagon they refused to work on it at al (much to my shock)l because it was in the 00's. . So if I do get one of the X351 cars I am loooking at I will not do so until I have found a skilled Jagiar independent mechanic locally here. I have heard there is one (or two)... I appreciate the comments that he V6 is quieter. Thank you. As for sticking with the Merc, I still have a V12 W140 in USA, so need to feel young again which given my very advanced years, means I may well be making the switch and defecting to X351. Any advice on what can (or often) go wrong or tends not to, in the 2013 MY suspension would be appreciated. Thanks all...

 

Thanks also for the 18 " and 17" wheel comments and advice, that was particularly appreciated. Thannks...

 

Note that not all 18" wheels will fit to the x351. If the wheel have thick wall on the area where brake caliber are, it will touch. If you use Jaguar OEM 18" wheels for x351 you are good. Most of tire shops have charts or they will do a testfit before you buy. I have 18" on my winter tyres. (not a Jaguar wheels and there are about 1mm space between brake caliber at front)

Note: There are non SC V6, but it is an twin turbo diesel.

The x351 suspension are much sportier than S. You don´t get same gliding feeling even x351 have air suspension on back, it is defently not there for confort. (however, the shocks last like MB:s can only dream) If you can´t find an x351 for a test drive before you buy, try drive a Panamera. If you think thats too hard for you, the x351 are very similar. (or bit harder)
Most quiet car i been in (excluding RR:s) are Citroen C6 with hydropneumatic suspension. Production ended in -12 and never sold volumes. Mostly rolled out from factory with diesels, but there are gasoline versions too. However: Because of rarity and value versus drive quality very low qtys on sale. Citroen C6 have some interesting desings, inside and outside, but owners tell that they fell in love them very fast.
(well, i bet that it is same for everyone who sit in for x351 too)

 

Thank you for that - I just came acorss this and it shows that except at 80 mph + the 2014 Jaguar XJ is quieter than the last MY of the Mercedes S class W221 (2013), but not of course the W222 - which is approaching slient, and if you will, a cheap version of the last MY mercedes S class W140 M120 V12. (I own that V12 and test drove both back to back and the 1999 V12 felt better made than the cheap feeling W222, but the W222 was very quiet).

https://www.auto-decibel-db.com/index_kmh.html

GIven these decibel rankings I am now tempted to not chose the 2013 W221 and instead take the 2013 Jaguar XJL. I will keep seachng for other decibel rankings also, as tire choice can affect.... The 2013 S class has 18 inch rims (vs. 19 on the Jaguar) and can fit 17 inch rims. A significant vote in its favour for quietness... But the Jaguar is definitely quieter at 50 km/h or 31mph, which let's face it, is where we spend most of our time when in city / city traffic. 50.3 db in the Jag vs 53.2 db in the W221 benz... 3 db's quieter in the Jaguar at low speeds.... AND also at 80km/h - 100 km/h and 120 km/h - we have 56.5 - 59.2 and 63.3 db's for the 2014 Jaguar, whereas in the MB W221 we have 57.1 - 60.9 and 64.7 db's. So ceteris paribus, the Jaguar is quieter across the board until you get to 140km/h when the Benz is only 66.3 db vs. the Jaguar at 67.5 db. So there you have it, at least from that decibel source.... NOTE: - the 2010 XJL was a lot louder that siurce says... and the 2014 W222 is the quietest of them all, which I know is true (save a very well maintained (HA!!) MB W140..)

I will keep searching and but some dynamat perhaps. But hopefully not needed (stress etc.) Many thanks.

 

Decibel differences below 3dB are nearly impossible to notice without measurement.
the early model years had a 6 speed transmission, which would result in slightly higher revs at certain speeds. Therefore the later 8 speed autobox would result in less noise measured. 18" rims were standard for the lowest spec XJ. Higher up on the spec chart were 19 and 20" from the factory.
Be aware that many owners complain about a noisy sunroof. It makes noises when travelling over bumpy roads. Nothing really cures that issue. Thesis is, that the Jaguar aluminium body twists too much. The glass panel and window mechanism rattles in its guide because it needs room to allow for the body movements.
Often small items fail, which can be expensive to repair. Door locks for instance must be considered a wear item.

 

My 2014 XJR has never had any roof noises or rattles of any kind. No squeaks or rattles after 55K miles anywhere. It is a problem that can be fixed and the sad thing is it took Jaguar several years and a couple of tries to finally get the noise gone. Note I have seen cars up to the 2016 model still having this noise but the number of complaints dropped significantly after 2013 or so. Jaguar released several TSB's and repair kits. Be sure and read them if you have noises.

It's easy to check for when test driving too. As posted above the problem is the body twisting and the giant glass moon roof does not. So the mounting points of the moon roof MUST allow the flex to occur. The kit is made up of pads and rubber spacers to get the glass/steel roof isolated from the more flexible Aluminum body. So drive the car across a slopping driveway at an angle this will twist the body and you will quickly know if the car makes roof noises or not.

That was one reason I waited a while to get an XJ along with waiting for the prices to come down. But when they finally released the XJR (I was not sure they would either?) I knew what I wanted.
.
.
.

 

That is very helpful thank you. Greatly appreciated. BTW - does yours have the double sunroof / moon roof like the XJL I am looking at?

 

Yes it has the "Pano" roof but I thought all XJ's came with that?
At least all the XJ's I have seen had it?

You bring up a question that I have never seen any data on? Does the LWB suffer from the moon roof noise worse than the SWB models?
I don't know but I have a SWB so no driving experience with the LWB versions.
.
.
.

 

Very good point - perhaps best way to answer is to ask the forum here - are those who have problems mainly SWB or LWB? And I also think the post from the member, just a couepl of posts ago, who said there is a kit to fix the roof is very helpful indeed...

 

Many thanks - this kit is an excellent idea. Do you happen to have a part number for it?

Well. my purchase is coming up soon. I actually sat in the rear of a 2014 XJL today and will go for a drive tonight or tomorrow... Sadly my head touched the roof (I am 6' 4") but I will very rarely be in the back. The leather smelled very nice and much will obviously hinge on how it drives. The only competitor I am seriously looking at now is a Mercedes CL coupe - either a W215 or W216 - both 40,000 miles. The XJL is 30,000 miles (2013). If I am honest, because of quietness I know the W215 will be the quietest, closely followed by the W216 and then the Jag, but because of some of my political / entertaining responsibilities the Jaguar will likely be much better for my needs. Much will hinge on the upcoming test drive.

If any of you have any suggestions on what I should really pay close attention to on the test drive please do advise. Of note the limo company lending me the car for the test drive says that the Jaguar is much more reliable than the 2018 S class they have....

 

Yes here are the TSB's Jaguar released trying to fix the noise.
The blind can also cause noise and was sorta involved in all this too.

Note that they revised the same TSB 2 or 3 times before it all was figured out.
So in the end it not a basic design problem of the car just the pano roof mounting system.
It was a big and embarrassing problem mainly because it took Jaguar WAY too long to find and fix it.

Look at the latest released documents for the repair and part numbers needed but I included the earlier versions to show this had a long road to completion!
.
.
.

 

That is extremely kind of you and very much appreciated - thank you.

 

I have a 2016 XJL AWD (LWB) and haven't heard any noises from the roof units. They are frequently open (when it is not raining). The car is silent except for the engine and sound system. I have the 19 inch factory tires, and road noise is negligible. I do have a rattle (high frequency vibration) in the roof control console, but there is a good repair that has already been posted on the forum. I'm just lazy and haven't fixed it yet. And in my opinion, the CL Coupe is not the same class of car.

 

OK, well I have test driven the 2013 XJL now and am sorely tempted. Living in a very hot country as I do one of the very best things about it is the AC - blows ice cold and is almost silent. Comparing that with my current mercedes was night and day - as in so much better cooling and also quieter. So that is a huge decrease in noise. The ride is firm on the car I drove with 19 inch Prielli run flats, but believe changing those to non run flats would make a significant difference as would changing to 18 inch wheels (but not much chance of that here without major expense). You may not like my opeinin that I feel the CL is better made, but I am comparing or deciding betweem a 2001/ 2002 W / C215 vs a 2013 Jag XJL. And the Jag is cheaper and better build quality / reliability. So given how vastly impressive teh Ac was and how much that maters here I am very tempoted just to buy teh XJL and change the tires and see if it is good enough for me, or then just sell it and buy a newer cL (2005 - 2010).

One question on the stock 19 inch wheels - how much can I increase the profile before too large to fit... 50 or 55?? vs stock 45??

 

QP
Just changing from run-flats to "normal" tires will make a massive difference. The hate-full POS BMW that my wife had, ran on Bridgestone run-flats, utterly useless and droned on even the best surfaces. Steer clear of all run-flats.

wombat