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Did you successfully complete the repair? I am planning to try the zip tie method next summer and I am closely following your case.
Not yet waiting for the crank timing tool from China that applies to the 2013 flywheel and 3.0l engines, that seems to be the issue why things don’t line up I was trying with earlier car tool, the new style tool was not included in the big kit posed. I hope you have better luck on the zip tie method. Don’t spin the engine backwards and make sure you don’t replace the black guides as things will loosen up too much, and tie the cams with as many zip ties as you can, get some brake cleaner and clean a few links that your will be able apply some kind of marker or paint, whiteout. It’s doable but I made some mistakes and now having to do things the long procedure way.
Boiling hot water for a few seconds then cone punch to stretch, don’t over stretch, use the hose and clamp to shrink, rotate hose and reclamp to prevent pinching. Beats the $50 dollar tool. Also the injector seal set from eBay I posted a few posts back was a great deal. The seller did send black Teflon at first but fixed the order after pointing that out, white seals were then shipped. Ensure you communicate that when placing the order. I also leaned the Lower intake and Valve cover gaskets from Partsgeek.com are a great alternative to the expensive Jaguar genuine parts. There are ways to save on these repairs, and as the car ages, avoiding buying expensive tools and OE parts are definitely a more sensible way of keeping the car running. In the amount of time this repair has taken me getting parts and tools from China etc, the car probably depreciated faster than the repair cost Exaggeration, but time is money, luckily the shutdown makes it bearable and I have other cars in my fleet to compensate.
Not yet waiting for the crank timing tool from China that applies to the 2013 flywheel and 3.0l engines, that seems to be the issue why things don’t line up I was trying with earlier car tool, the new style tool was not included in the big kit posed. I hope you have better luck on the zip tie method. Don’t spin the engine backwards and make sure you don’t replace the black guides as things will loosen up too much, and tie the cams with as many zip ties as you can, get some brake cleaner and clean a few links that your will be able apply some kind of marker or paint, whiteout. It’s doable but I made some mistakes and now having to do things the long procedure way.
Thanks for your tips Ricardo.
The locking tool you´re waiting from China is reference 303-1303 for v6 engines, are you sure it will fit your V8?
I sure hope so because I could only find two options from all my searches and the older V8 tool was not it, and is having me spinning. Illlet you know this week when it comes in.
V8 is the same idea. The difference is in the flywheel. TDC Lines up differently where the unique hole for the tool is. The early tool goes straight center on the flywheel the later flywheels you can see the tool is off center. Trying to use the early tool as I did on a later flywheel will land you on my predicament. I didn’t understand even after the recommendation. I had the same confusion that the V6 tool was only for the V6 this is what led me to attempt doing it with the wrong tool as it will fit and appear to work but it won’t be TDC and you will be off a tooth.
In hope this is the correct crank tool for my car otherwise I’ll be at a loss.
Also grabbed some bolts to ensure the outer cams are tightened properly. The larger winged bolt did not allow for the exhaust cam to be tightened due to the wing being too close to the plastic lower insulation bulkhead.
Thank you all for listening and helping along the way. Time to put this thread on closed status . I believe I have made a successful service/repair on the car. Doing this twice you learn some shortcuts along the way. Fist time had P00017 codes as expected. I didn’t know the difference in the crank tool ,since all the vendor sources had 3.0l as the engine it fit, Shame I did to not understand this fully even thought it was pointed out along the way.
100 miles on the new parts and all is still good. At first, I had a fuel leak at the connection of the crossover connecting tube, But I managed to tighten it a tad bit and seems to have sealed. Never just bolt on these one use use lines and send it. You need to verify a good seal, the joints are under plastic and insulation so you might forget to go back and check. Reusing is fine but I thought it was tight the first time and apparently not enough when under pressure. Big fire hazard.
Coolant residue and oils drips seems to have evaporated and burned off. I don’t find smells or smoke and steam. It took a few miles for that to go away.
Of you need tips on doing this the frugal way hit me up although I already mention a few areas to save on specialty tools etc.
This thread has me worn the f out. I'm incredibly thankful to everyone who contributed (especially ricardoa1 and Jagman92), but it just got kind of scary. I bought the blades, guides, and tensioners (I was just going to do the zip-tie method), but now I'm kind of nervous to tackle any of it. Plus, I only have 52K on my car, always changed the oil around 5-6K at the latest (and always yearly, if under mileage), always used the best oil, and never heard any timing chain noises. But, like ricardoa1, I did have play in my SC coupler and decided to do a lot of other stuff after the water pump blew. However, I'm now seriously rethinking tackling the tensioners/guides. It was already a lot more than I really have time to deal with, especially after everything else I've already done to the car to refresh it, and it if gets sideways, I'm afraid that I might just flip out and set it on fire to put me out of my misery.
Hi guys
X351 3.0 diesel
Crank pulley and related stuffquestions
I noticed that the crank pulley has a barely visible wobble to it. About maximum 1500 km ago I changed the belts and tensioners on accessories and distribution.
Full kit on distribution and one iddle pulley and one tensioner for auxiliary belt. With new belts. And oil pump. That was October, about there. Two weeks ago…. Changed the iddle bearing on the alternator because it had only half of the bearing ***** left-hand terrible noise. At the same time, I changed the power steering pump with a sh one because I had some problems with the handleing of the car. No noise on the old pu
P but problem was fixed.
So….. I still have a rocky start and stop. Not 100% of the time…. About 50 %is almost normal, no shaking and no rockyness. The rockyness is about 1… maybe 2 seconds. Iddle after is normal…. A bit noisy on what seems to me the top of the motor
New belts and tensioner and pulleys could have accelerated the alternator pump bearing? Could have generated crank pulley slight wobble? Or is it the other way around? From October when I did the oil pump and belts, one iddle pulley brand new, on the air compressor side, oposide the alternator, in 5 months, developed a wobble. Not being a china iddler.
I intend to change hydraulic tappers on both banks, pulley now, chain distribution.
Iddle is just a bit noisy on top on the engine…. Runs ok. No oil consumption. Pulls ok on acceleration. No related errors, just scaned.. . If I increase the rpm in park….. No extraordinary noises….. NO tapping….nothing, and even the tip of the engine tapping noise is gone.
Crank pulley problem for the rockyness? Or part of the problem? It's barely visible…. . When I change these parts…. Should be aware of other different stuff? On Jag 3.0 diesel... Did someone had same issues? Rockyness and or pulley wobble? Advice? More is better. I really don't trust shop employees….. So…..pleasehelp with ideas and thing to watch about
Thanks
Had to read your post few times to catch up.
Most likely the auxilary belt have nothing to do for rough idle 1-2sek from start. Few things come in my mind:
- Oil filter drain valve slipped from its holder letting oil filter drain empty when engine is stopped? Then again when started, an air bubble from filter are bursted thru oil channels drying momentary the hydraylic valve tapers. Valve timing is then off for a monent and engine is noisy and shaking. Check this from Diesel variants section; https://www.jaguarforums.com/forum/d...-valve-275907/ Low oil pressure make tapers noisy?
- Fuel pressure regulator or high pressure fuel pump valve leaks letting part of fuel pressure escape resulting poor fuel atomizating during injection? (however: Fuel pressure sensor should catch it, but not sure if there are delayed measurement during start up to prevent false flags after long standing period?
- Active engine mount vacuum pressure lines lose or leaking? (or leak in vacuum system somewhere else) Check the transmission mount as well.
Hardly ever seen dampened crank pulley what are complete smooth. Hard ones for sure. Dampered ones have vulcanised (soft) layer on them to damp rapid crank angle movements by high compression. If your belt tensioner is not jumping around on idlle you are good. Yes, any fault on any roller on belt can cause another part(s) on same belt to be stressed. Worst is very common fault of alternator pulley one way bearing on diesels. One way bearing is protecting alternator from fast crack angle movements. When this bearing seize an expensive alternator is soon gone. Misfiring diesel put also high stress for auxilary belt and all of its components.
Had to read your post few times to catch up.
Most likely the auxilary belt have nothing to do for rough idle 1-2sek from start. Few things come in my mind:
- Oil filter drain valve slipped from its holder letting oil filter drain empty when engine is stopped? Then again when started, an air bubble from filter are bursted thru oil channels drying momentary the hydraylic valve tapers. Valve timing is then off for a monent and engine is noisy and shaking. Check this from Diesel variants section; https://www.jaguarforums.com/forum/d...-valve-275907/ Low oil pressure make tapers noisy?
- Fuel pressure regulator or high pressure fuel pump valve leaks letting part of fuel pressure escape resulting poor fuel atomizating during injection? (however: Fuel pressure sensor should catch it, but not sure if there are delayed measurement during start up to prevent false flags after long standing period?
- Active engine mount vacuum pressure lines lose or leaking? (or leak in vacuum system somewhere else) Check the transmission mount as well.
Hardly ever seen dampened crank pulley what are complete smooth. Hard ones for sure. Dampered ones have vulcanised (soft) layer on them to damp rapid crank angle movements by high compression. If your belt tensioner is not jumping around on idlle you are good. Yes, any fault on any roller on belt can cause another part(s) on same belt to be stressed. Worst is very common fault of alternator pulley one way bearing on diesels. One way bearing is protecting alternator from fast crack angle movements. When this bearing seize an expensive alternator is soon gone. Misfiring diesel put also high stress for auxilary belt and all of its components.
The pulley look Ok to me based the video you sent.
I made a start.…. Stop and revs with my eyes on the belts and crank pulley. With help. Yeah……the pulley movement doesn't change. There is a movement on the whole engine when it's starts…. Probably from rubber mounts.
But….. My guess is that this car sat for 1-2 years maybe more. So….. Tappets not working correctly, wear and tear between tappers and tappet arm on all or most…. And maybe even bend arm from intense revving.
A nothing thing I noticed, from 2 to 3rd….. On normal acceleration…. A bit more vibration perceived from the engine bay… more like a rattle, especially in 2 to 3 Rd... That I can feel thru the pedals. And maybe a little bit of over revving…. Until the gear box fully engages. That's in normal acceleration and on normal driving mode. After it engages.…. Vibrations are gone…., normal acceleration for the length of the gear is with no other rattling and vibrating. Not extraordinary vibrations an rattleing, but. Can feel them. I was with radio off. But the i am a ultra very sensible with cars and they're noices and vibrations and response. I was asked by shop personal if I am a musician with super hearing… and advised to turn on the radio because the car was fine with other cars. My point…. Because of the wear and tear on the gear box, tappers…… on engaging from 2-3 they get noisy. And rattled.… tappers and tapper arms. It's not extraordinary... Not extra loud…. But I wanted to let you know to eliminate every rattle and vibration bad for the motor.
Now…. If you guys agree with my ideas…. Or please add and advise with other ideas….., any opinion is appreciated.I am sorry if I misspeld some words… or maybe if I am too picky with the car….. And still if you have ideas.… please share.
In Romania, every bad shop doesn't know what to do and only want normal money, and the good shops say engine change on everything with ultra expensive parts and labor. And when I say ultra expensive I mean 300% more on parts that in uk for example…. And more on labor that In dealership. So I have to Navigate thru that....That's why ideas from experience are important.
danu99 Can you do anything yourself? Familar with tools? Under very nice looking chassis there are a standard basic vehicle like any other car. The engine are made by Ford/PSA and used at least Citroen C5/C6 and Peugeot 407/607 in high volumes. Transmission are made by ZF. Brakes are made by ATE. Most of the service parts, even as OEM are available thru many EU online parts distributors like Mister-Auto, Autodoc, Skruvat, Alvadi...
The engine mounts, both sides of the engine, are active type controlled with vacuum by ECU. If you have vacuum leak, mount have been failed or the limiter band around the mount have been broken you might get these symthons. For smooth gear change the ECM and transmission controller works together and many things happen during gearchange. Slight reduction on injection exsample, propably one side engine mount adjust aswell to cope chancing of torque vector?
The transmission mount is standard "passive rubber" type. You could hear and feel failed/failing mount ratlle? Can you get your car lifted and get underside (safely!) to have a peek for the mounts? If you know somebody from your friends / work / neiberhood who have skils with cars, ask if he is willing to help you to check out?
And don´t over rew the engine. There is no juice after 4k rpm anyway so its no worth. Power curve drop dramatically after 4k. If i remember right there is more power at 2500rpm than 4300rpm, so its worth to hit higher gear at 4k. (on factory tune)
06-07-2020 | 08:59 AM
