Found a cheaper answer to transmission fluid
#1
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Found a cheaper answer to transmission fluid
So I guess there is a cheaper answer to transmission fluid. I don't see anywhere that shows the clutch packs and seals and what not are different for each manufacturer. I would assume that ZF builds the transmission completely and all the manufacturers do is install the unit. So all the internals should be the same. Therefore use any fluid qualified for "6HP26" right???
Ford Trucks/Lincoln Navigator
[align=center]ALL except:
2007-2008 F250 HD, F350, F450, F550;
1997-2008 models with 5R110W, 6R60, 6R75 or ZF 6HP26
transmissions;
Models requiring ATF Type F
[/align]
[align=center]1977-2008[/align]
[align=center]MERCONĀ®
MERCONĀ®V [/align]
[align=center]ATF Type F (XT-1-QF)
MERCONĀ® SP (XT-6-QSP)[/align]
BMW with 6hp26 listed Dexron 3. I was reading something about a BMW mechanic expressing to his customers to use Amsoil ATF; which I have used for the past few years and is great stuff.
Ford Trucks/Lincoln Navigator
[align=center]ALL except:
2007-2008 F250 HD, F350, F450, F550;
1997-2008 models with 5R110W, 6R60, 6R75 or ZF 6HP26
transmissions;
Models requiring ATF Type F
[/align]
[align=center]1977-2008[/align]
[align=center]MERCONĀ®
MERCONĀ®V [/align]
[align=center]ATF Type F (XT-1-QF)
MERCONĀ® SP (XT-6-QSP)[/align]
BMW with 6hp26 listed Dexron 3. I was reading something about a BMW mechanic expressing to his customers to use Amsoil ATF; which I have used for the past few years and is great stuff.
#2
RE: Found a cheaper answer to transmission fluid
ORIGINAL: fitzydog
BMW with 6hp26 listed Dexron 3. I was reading something about a BMW mechanic expressing to his customers to use Amsoil ATF; which I have used for the past few years and is great stuff.
BMW with 6hp26 listed Dexron 3. I was reading something about a BMW mechanic expressing to his customers to use Amsoil ATF; which I have used for the past few years and is great stuff.
#3
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RE: Found a cheaper answer to transmission fluid
No sir I haven't. I am looking at an 04 and 05 as we speak so I haven't purchased one but soon I will have a beauty. I have used Amsoil in Dodge and ford diesels, ford company vans, my current dodge diesel truck. I use the amsoil power steering fluid, trans fluid, gear oil, motor oil, all of it. It is a little more expensive but why not get what you pay for. Anyways, the trans fluid from Amsoil is universal just like Mobil Trans fluid is. I am gonna call Ford and see if the ZF6 is made internally the same for all vehicles and just installed by the manufacturers. I mean the new Navigators, F150s, xj8's, bmw, audis, all have the ZF 6HP26 so basically the manufacturers just specify which fluid they are getting kick backs from really it seems. I will answer back when I hear from Ford.
#4
RE: Found a cheaper answer to transmission fluid
If you look up 2004 XJ8 on the Amsoil page it says:
Automatic Transmission,6HP26.....SLF[1]
No AMSOIL Product Recommendation
I think the Mercon SP is the same as the ZF fluid. I think several companies have licenses to produce the fluid and market it with different names.
Automatic Transmission,6HP26.....SLF[1]
No AMSOIL Product Recommendation
I think the Mercon SP is the same as the ZF fluid. I think several companies have licenses to produce the fluid and market it with different names.
#5
RE: Found a cheaper answer to transmission fluid
The man from ZF did not endorse the fluid from Ford. This is his replay:
Venelin,
I can not advise the use of the Ford fluid in your Jag. I am not clear as to the outcome of its use. ZF currently has several fluids used for various 6HPapplications. A good example is Audi who recommends fluids by vehicle model not transmission model. This may be due to the demands of the specific vehicle such as smooth shifting VS performance orientated driving requiring faster shifts and better heat control. The friction coefficient of the fluid is programmed into the transmission controller. Changing fluid type will affect the calculation and ultimately drivability. This in a worst case scenario could lead to transmission failure. The correct ZF or Jag fluid is a small price to pay in comparison.
Venelin,
I can not advise the use of the Ford fluid in your Jag. I am not clear as to the outcome of its use. ZF currently has several fluids used for various 6HPapplications. A good example is Audi who recommends fluids by vehicle model not transmission model. This may be due to the demands of the specific vehicle such as smooth shifting VS performance orientated driving requiring faster shifts and better heat control. The friction coefficient of the fluid is programmed into the transmission controller. Changing fluid type will affect the calculation and ultimately drivability. This in a worst case scenario could lead to transmission failure. The correct ZF or Jag fluid is a small price to pay in comparison.
#6
RE: Found a cheaper answer to transmission fluid
I would not recommend using anything but the Jaguar fluid in the XJ8.Use of any other is just speculation and deduction, not a good basis for the decision. There are other manufacturers that say that their fluid will work. BAP/Geon, a quality parts supplier, recommends a German fluid for use in the car, but I would hesitate even at this, the risk is too great. I know that the Jag fluid will cost $500 for a change, but it could cost far more if the transmission fails from the wrong fluid. I did see 10 quarts of this fluid on EBay recently for $99 so there are deals out there.
#7
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RE: Found a cheaper answer to transmission fluid
I see what ya'll are saying about the amsoil from their own website.And alos the Mercon SP crossed my mind as well. I will continue to research, but I will not spend 500 for the fluid. I found a used trans with 10k miles for $900 bucks from a wrecked 05 model. So, not much of a risk to me cause the car I am looking at has 60k miles anyway.
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#8
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UPDATE: RE: Found a cheaper answer to transmission fluid
I typed in ESSO LT71141 and guess what happened. ESSO is Exxon/Mobil in Europe where the fluid comes from well here is the factory fill!
Mobil Multi-Vehicle ATF is also suitable for use in vehicles that specify the following requirements:
[ul][*]Audi G 052 025-A2, G 052 162-A1[*]BMW LA2634[*]Esso LT 71141[*]ETL-7045E, ETL-8072B, N402[*]Ford* MERCON*, MERCON LV[*]All 2005 and earlier GM vehicles**[*]Honda ATF-Z1*[*]Hyundai SP-II, SP-III[*]Idemitsu K17[*]JWS 3309[*]Kia SP-II, SP-III[*]MAN 339F, V1, V2, Z1, Z2, Z3[*]Mazda ATF-III, ATF-MV[*]Mercedes-Benz 236.1, 236.2, 236.5, 236.6, 236.7, 236.9[*]Mitsubishi Diamond SP-II, SP-III[*]Nissan Matic-D, Matic-J, Matic-K[*]Subaru ATF[*]Toyota T-III, T-IV[*]Voith 55.6335.XX (G607, G1363)[*]Volvo 97340[*]ZF TE-ML 03D, 04D, 09, 14A, 14B, 16L, 17C[/ul]
Mobil Multi-Vehicle ATF is also suitable for use in vehicles that specify the following requirements:
[ul][*]Audi G 052 025-A2, G 052 162-A1[*]BMW LA2634[*]Esso LT 71141[*]ETL-7045E, ETL-8072B, N402[*]Ford* MERCON*, MERCON LV[*]All 2005 and earlier GM vehicles**[*]Honda ATF-Z1*[*]Hyundai SP-II, SP-III[*]Idemitsu K17[*]JWS 3309[*]Kia SP-II, SP-III[*]MAN 339F, V1, V2, Z1, Z2, Z3[*]Mazda ATF-III, ATF-MV[*]Mercedes-Benz 236.1, 236.2, 236.5, 236.6, 236.7, 236.9[*]Mitsubishi Diamond SP-II, SP-III[*]Nissan Matic-D, Matic-J, Matic-K[*]Subaru ATF[*]Toyota T-III, T-IV[*]Voith 55.6335.XX (G607, G1363)[*]Volvo 97340[*]ZF TE-ML 03D, 04D, 09, 14A, 14B, 16L, 17C[/ul]
#9
RE: UPDATE: RE: Found a cheaper answer to transmission fluid
Why do you believe ESSO LT71141 is suitable for th 6HP26 fitted in the Jags? As far as I can find it is suitable for some 4 and 5 speed ZF gearboxes.
On a few places you I saw Shell M1375.4, listed as the appropiate fluid for the Jag 6HP26. But that is also hard to find cheap.
On a few places you I saw Shell M1375.4, listed as the appropiate fluid for the Jag 6HP26. But that is also hard to find cheap.
#10
I used the castrol import multi-vehicle ATF, which meets the shell m1375.4 spec. Put it in my 2003 s-type v8 (zf 6hp26). I did it because my trans pan gasket started to leak. The computer hasn't yelled at me yet (driven it 2 days), and my lurch issue (common in my year), has gotten noticeably better.
Can be had at autozone for ~$4.50 p/qt. It took 5.5 qts to fill.
Alternatively, a shop in my town wanted $900.00 to change fluid, gasket, and filter. Using oem jaguar parts. I just changed gasket and fluid with castrol and it cost me ~$70.00 (jaguarparts.com for the gasket). Although I am brave, as I've rebuilt many transmissions in the past, so I am not intimidated by having to rebuild my unit, since it is already at 80k miles. So without any concrete evidence I still gambled, but it is working. Heard storied of others putting mercon V in, and not getting out of the garage, so the right fluid is important.
Justin
Can be had at autozone for ~$4.50 p/qt. It took 5.5 qts to fill.
Alternatively, a shop in my town wanted $900.00 to change fluid, gasket, and filter. Using oem jaguar parts. I just changed gasket and fluid with castrol and it cost me ~$70.00 (jaguarparts.com for the gasket). Although I am brave, as I've rebuilt many transmissions in the past, so I am not intimidated by having to rebuild my unit, since it is already at 80k miles. So without any concrete evidence I still gambled, but it is working. Heard storied of others putting mercon V in, and not getting out of the garage, so the right fluid is important.
Justin
Last edited by justinb67; 02-16-2009 at 10:41 AM.
#13
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Correct Oil Cheap?
I replaced the gearbox oil in my XJ83.2 at 65000 miles - it is imperitive you use the correct Esso oil for the box - there is NO equivelent.
Don't buy it from Jaguar, when I enquired the wanted over £20 per litre and would only sell as a 25 litre drum - its crazy.
I rang my local BMW specialist - quoted £10 per litre and he said bring my own containers and he would dispence whatever quantity I wanted -
Note: this gearbox was also fitted to the 540 and 740 BMW and BMW recommend an 'Optional Oil Change' at 60000 mile intervals. Hope this helps.
Don't buy it from Jaguar, when I enquired the wanted over £20 per litre and would only sell as a 25 litre drum - its crazy.
I rang my local BMW specialist - quoted £10 per litre and he said bring my own containers and he would dispence whatever quantity I wanted -
Note: this gearbox was also fitted to the 540 and 740 BMW and BMW recommend an 'Optional Oil Change' at 60000 mile intervals. Hope this helps.
#14
Got this from Castrol cust service
Thank you for contacting Castrol North America,
This vehicle calls for a Shell M1375.4 ATF which is a lower viscosity fluid than Castrol Import Multi-Vehicle ATF. Castrol Import Multi-Vehicle ATF may be used in your vehicle but the fuel economy will be slightly decreased versus the lower viscosity fluid.
Castrol Consumer Relations
This vehicle calls for a Shell M1375.4 ATF which is a lower viscosity fluid than Castrol Import Multi-Vehicle ATF. Castrol Import Multi-Vehicle ATF may be used in your vehicle but the fuel economy will be slightly decreased versus the lower viscosity fluid.
Castrol Consumer Relations
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rcannon (03-16-2015)
#15
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Pentosin ATF1 is $16 per liter
a quality parts supplier, recommends a German fluid for use in the car, but I would hesitate even at this, the risk is too great. I know that the Jag fluid will cost $500 for a change, but it could cost far more if the transmission fails from the wrong fluid. I did see 10 quarts of this fluid on EBay recently for $99 so there are deals out there.
Pentosin ATF1 is a higher performance synthetic fluid than the Jag mineral oil, and so long as the viscocity and friction co-efficient are equivalent to M 1375.4 the transmission will benefit from the performance of a synthetic fluid.
You can purchase the 6HP26 pan with integrated filter from RM European for $140 which compares favorably to the dealer price, and the Pentosin ATF1 is $16 per liter from them. This fluid looks like the Jag fluid, and by eyeball the viscosity appears noticeably similar. Evidently when ZF rebuilds a transmission which uses the Jaguar computer, this is the fluid they use.
I was reluctant to combine/mix the old Jaguar mineral oil "cough syrup" with the Pentosin ATF1, and found the best answer to this was simply to allow the 6HP26 to drain for two days. After two days about seven liters of the old degraded mineral oil were recovered, leaving at least one liter (plus) in the torque unit. I believed the ratio of 7+:1 old-to-new will do no harm, and used the seven liters drained as a guide to fluid level for the refill.
Refill is not trivial. When drained with the engine off, the 6HP26 pan only holds about 3 liters. This is enough to get you going but the other issue is the proximity of an internal switch to the fill hole (not to mention the exhaust pipe near the fill hole!) so that a small diameter fill tube must be used, unless you have the ZF factory fill plug. ZF definitely did not want shade tree mechanics filling the 6HP26 and to date that is my biggest complaint about "German engineering".
Anyway I have been driving the S-3 R for quite a few miles now and feel that the performance and responsiveness of the transmission is definitely improved over the Jaguar mineral oil. That is my opinion and observation so far! regards, Steve
#16
I don't know why you have the impression the fluid Jaguar uses is mineral oil. It is in fact synthetic. The fluid is formulated and manufacture by ZF and sold under the name LifeGuardFluid6 or something similar. ZF licenses the formulation to other companies, but any way you slice it it does not come cheap.
#17
Searching for "Pentisol ATF1", I found this document by ZF, which leads me to believe this fluid is manufactured by the same company: http://www.zf.com/sso/content/media/...POWERFLUID.pdf
Looking at the part numbers in the document: S671 090 172 (and 171) and searching by part number. It looks like this fluid is LifeguardFluid5 (http://www.tsgparts.net/index.php?p=...parent=68&pg=1). This fluid is for 5HPxx series of transmission units. These are used in the old X308 Jags.
Looking at the part numbers in the document: S671 090 172 (and 171) and searching by part number. It looks like this fluid is LifeguardFluid5 (http://www.tsgparts.net/index.php?p=...parent=68&pg=1). This fluid is for 5HPxx series of transmission units. These are used in the old X308 Jags.
#18
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Jaguar stock ATF labeled "mineral oil"
The bottle the parts clerk showed me was clearly labeled "mineral oil" - no doubt about it. If you like I can make a trip down there again and take a picture of the label on the bottle. Better yet, Google "jaguar ATF mineral oil" and you will get many interesting and factual results.
In my personal experience, replacing the stock fluid in my S type R with the Pentosin ATF1, really transformed the driveability of the car.
Last edited by montoya66; 06-20-2009 at 01:49 AM.
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Xeno (07-30-2023)
#19
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Equivalent to Shell M-1375.4
Searching for "Pentisol ATF1", I found this document by ZF, which leads me to believe this fluid is manufactured by the same company: http://www.zf.com/sso/content/media/...POWERFLUID.pdf
Looking at the part numbers in the document: S671 090 172 (and 171) and searching by part number. It looks like this fluid is LifeguardFluid5 (http://www.tsgparts.net/index.php?p=...parent=68&pg=1). This fluid is for 5HPxx series of transmission units. These are used in the old X308 Jags.
Looking at the part numbers in the document: S671 090 172 (and 171) and searching by part number. It looks like this fluid is LifeguardFluid5 (http://www.tsgparts.net/index.php?p=...parent=68&pg=1). This fluid is for 5HPxx series of transmission units. These are used in the old X308 Jags.
It is equivalent to Shell M-1375.4 with the same viscosity and coefficient of friction, but is indeed a higher performing fluid. I have had it in my S type R now for some thousands of miles; shifts are crisper/ smoother (than with the old Jag oil) and the tranny overall is much smoother and more predictable in performance with consistent shift points.
In my experience, replacing the stock fluid transformed the driveability of the car.
#20
I bought my car for 700 bucks its a good 1988 xj6 the car has been a bit neglected. But not bad and has very low miles 124k. I changed the engine oil the other day to Pennzoil 5w 30 the oil filter had burnt carbon in it to tell how long it might have been. That said i need to change the transmission fluid,but I refuse to pay 500 for fluid on a 700 dollar car. That said I Love the car and want to restore it but feel there is another fluid you can use. I am going to try amsoil or mobile one synthetic I will post what happens. Oh and how do you drain the tork converter without removing the transmission. Do you do the pan dump way or of filling and draining the pan 4 times and on the last drain dump the pan and change the filter. That works well but not perfect it doesn't get every drop out but gets about 97% out and I dont think it would hurt the transmission. There is also the cooler hose way but you need about 15 quarts of fluid and have to drop the pan and change the filter after you finish. So what do you guys think i should do and dont say drive it until it breaks and buy a new one because thats not my way.
Last edited by 1988xj6navy; 06-21-2009 at 09:16 PM.