x350 botched re-design??
#21
I would give the x351 another try imho but you perfectly describe a customer who would want variable magnetic shocks. Cadillac & Lincoln use them among domestics. Obviously flagship sedans from foreign car companies offer them as an option as well. They react faster than air suspension and mostly trouble free as well. Lastly, stay away from cars with big wheels.
But still, remember that the dampers are there to "control" the spring movement and are tuned to the corner weight and the spring rate of the vehicle. A much smaller variation in stiffness is possible through variable valving or viscosity, but the spring does nearly all the work. Thirty plus years ago, luxury sedan spring rates were typically in the low 100s of pounds per inch which gave us the "floating on a cloud" ride. Today they're often in the high 300's which would have been an aftermarket upgrade to a Mustang back then.
#22
My old '86 XJ6 SIII wafted like a plush carpet so I think it's the spring rates rather than air or magnetic shocks that affect the ride quality. My X350 has some of that plushness depending on road surface and most Lexus cars/SUVs definitely have that. I don't need to be 'connected to the road', just want a serene comfortable driving experience.
#23
Nothing makes driving my X350 feel more special than driving something else on a regular basis.
I’d been using the Jag as my daily driver until about 6 months ago, when my wife upgraded from her old R170 Mercedes SLK (1998) to an R172 SLK (2014). Rather than sell the R170 for next to nothing, and wearing the Jag out by using it as a daily driver, I’ve been driving the old SLK to work 4 days a week. Now that I’m using the Jag as my drive-to-work work car only once a week, it feels like it’s had a suspension and performance upgrade every time I drive it .
Even though I’ve had the Jag for nearly 5 years, every time I park it I still turn around and look at it as I walk away. Not bad for a “Botched re-design”.
I’d been using the Jag as my daily driver until about 6 months ago, when my wife upgraded from her old R170 Mercedes SLK (1998) to an R172 SLK (2014). Rather than sell the R170 for next to nothing, and wearing the Jag out by using it as a daily driver, I’ve been driving the old SLK to work 4 days a week. Now that I’m using the Jag as my drive-to-work work car only once a week, it feels like it’s had a suspension and performance upgrade every time I drive it .
Even though I’ve had the Jag for nearly 5 years, every time I park it I still turn around and look at it as I walk away. Not bad for a “Botched re-design”.
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Victor Marquez (01-30-2018)
#24
Nothing makes driving my X350 feel more special than driving something else on a regular basis.
I’d been using the Jag as my daily driver until about 6 months ago, when my wife upgraded from her old R170 Mercedes SLK (1998) to an R172 SLK (2014). Rather than sell the R170 for next to nothing, and wearing the Jag out by using it as a daily driver, I’ve been driving the old SLK to work 4 days a week. Now that I’m using the Jag as my drive-to-work work car only once a week, it feels like it’s had a suspension and performance upgrade every time I drive it .
Even though I’ve had the Jag for nearly 5 years, every time I park it I still turn around and look at it as I walk away. Not bad for a “Botched re-design”.
I’d been using the Jag as my daily driver until about 6 months ago, when my wife upgraded from her old R170 Mercedes SLK (1998) to an R172 SLK (2014). Rather than sell the R170 for next to nothing, and wearing the Jag out by using it as a daily driver, I’ve been driving the old SLK to work 4 days a week. Now that I’m using the Jag as my drive-to-work work car only once a week, it feels like it’s had a suspension and performance upgrade every time I drive it .
Even though I’ve had the Jag for nearly 5 years, every time I park it I still turn around and look at it as I walk away. Not bad for a “Botched re-design”.
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Davidrnz (01-28-2018)
#25
In spite of my previous comments, there was one aspect of the X350 design Jaguar did botch. Thank goodness for Ebay, I was able to “un-botch” it quite easily.
If I’d done more research at the time, and realised the genuine Jaguar mesh was a little bit more widely spaced than the aftermarket mesh I’d bought, I might have de-botched it even more...
If I’d done more research at the time, and realised the genuine Jaguar mesh was a little bit more widely spaced than the aftermarket mesh I’d bought, I might have de-botched it even more...
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Wolfy (01-28-2018)
#29
#30
#33
Ahaa....Thank you pkoko, now I sort of get it!
And presumably, if you let the eggs hatch you could enclose the resultant chickens with the 'Chicken Wire' from the second grille?
All that the new grille and the 'faux' air vents on the sides need to really look up-to-date and classy is a nice spoiler on the back? Perhaps some flared arches and a body kit?
I realise the originator of this post is simply encouraging debate; anyway, here is my two-pennyworth!
It seems to me that in order to please some Jaguar lovers, all Jaguar needed to do was change the grille to avoid a 'botched redesign'! Given this, one can only wonder why they bothered with all that ground-breaking aircraft technology to greatly improve the power-to-weight ratio over all previous models?
And presumably, if you let the eggs hatch you could enclose the resultant chickens with the 'Chicken Wire' from the second grille?
All that the new grille and the 'faux' air vents on the sides need to really look up-to-date and classy is a nice spoiler on the back? Perhaps some flared arches and a body kit?
I realise the originator of this post is simply encouraging debate; anyway, here is my two-pennyworth!
It seems to me that in order to please some Jaguar lovers, all Jaguar needed to do was change the grille to avoid a 'botched redesign'! Given this, one can only wonder why they bothered with all that ground-breaking aircraft technology to greatly improve the power-to-weight ratio over all previous models?
Last edited by EsRay; 01-31-2018 at 02:24 AM.
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pkoko (01-31-2018)
#35
#36
I personally think the X350 styling has aged somewhat better than its contemporaries. 7 Series Beemers and S Class Mercs may have looked more modern in 2003, but those same cars look dated these days. By being less up-to-the-minute fashionable when it was released, I think the X350 now manages to look “classic” rather than “old”.
A 2003 X350 says “car enthusiast” while a 2003 7 Series or S Class says “can’t afford a new one”.
A 2003 X350 says “car enthusiast” while a 2003 7 Series or S Class says “can’t afford a new one”.
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chemosabe (10-25-2023)
#37
When I was looking for a Jaguar, I knew I wanted an XJ. At first I started looking for X308, but after a small test drive, I figured out that those cars are not designed for taller drivers. I am 192 and could not fit there comfortably. When the headliner is touching your hair, that is not a nice experience at all. Older cars that I was able to locate were XJ40s, where I had similar problem.
X350 is a very good evolution from older generation cars. First of all, it is a very comfortable car where I can fit in. Rear leg room is also nice in short wheelbase model that I prefer to LWBs. At the same time, silhouette of the car is there, it is instantly recognized as a Jaguar. X358s also look good, but those bumpers give more of a "sport" look than elegant look I was looking for.
I think disadvantages that might have impacted the sales were not the looks and styling of the car, but the infotainment system that was already old in 2003 and never got a real update.
When BMW changed 7 series in 2003, many though to switch to Jaguar XJ rather on the newer 7 series, but the infotainment system and the toys that BMW could offer to its clients were not present here. There is not manual adjustment to the suspension, Sport mode does nearly nothing, there is green, pixelated odometer instead of modern display...
Even when Jaguar updated X350 to X358, not much changed inside the car. I firmly believe, that the flagship car that had to struggle due to its design back in 2003 was not an XJ but Audi's A8. It had same concept of aluminium body and conservative design, but they went for the best toys on market
X350 is a very good evolution from older generation cars. First of all, it is a very comfortable car where I can fit in. Rear leg room is also nice in short wheelbase model that I prefer to LWBs. At the same time, silhouette of the car is there, it is instantly recognized as a Jaguar. X358s also look good, but those bumpers give more of a "sport" look than elegant look I was looking for.
I think disadvantages that might have impacted the sales were not the looks and styling of the car, but the infotainment system that was already old in 2003 and never got a real update.
When BMW changed 7 series in 2003, many though to switch to Jaguar XJ rather on the newer 7 series, but the infotainment system and the toys that BMW could offer to its clients were not present here. There is not manual adjustment to the suspension, Sport mode does nearly nothing, there is green, pixelated odometer instead of modern display...
Even when Jaguar updated X350 to X358, not much changed inside the car. I firmly believe, that the flagship car that had to struggle due to its design back in 2003 was not an XJ but Audi's A8. It had same concept of aluminium body and conservative design, but they went for the best toys on market
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meirion1 (02-19-2018)
#38
I read an interesting article last year sometime talking about infotainment systems. Most cars even today, the infotainment systems are about five years behind where consumer tablet technology is. Especially ten to fifteen years ago, the article said that infotainment was sort of an afterthought by car manufacturers who were for the most part just buying the technology rather than developing it themselves (tho that is changing). Their primary decision point was reliability rather than being the latest and greatest. I.e. they all bought technology that had a proven track record even though it was already several years old. They still keep sort of old technology around and keep it locked down because they're not comfortable with the idea of the dealership service center having to do "tech support" like Tesla does.
#39
I've never understood the x350 haters. They act like this was the most atrocious car design since the Nissian Cube. It may be a little taller and wider than the x308, but it wasn't a huge departure. To the laymay, if an x300, x308, and x350 drove by in succession they'd never notice a difference.
Of course I'm in the camp that loves the classic Jag design and wanted one of the last of the old body styles.
The author's claim that the x350 was a total debacle and all the design costs were lost are a bit extreme... now that (all?) Jag's cars are aluminum bodied I think they have made use of the design costs of the x350. Also, I'd love to know what sales figures were for x300 and x351. Comparing 125k units of the x308 to 75k of the x350 isn't definitive proof of anything. I'm sure all car manufs took a hit in the 2000s with the economic bubble that burst.
Side note--I had a brand new XF as a loaner a few months ago, had 18" rims and I was surprised it rode nearly as nice as my x350 on 18" rims. I had no complaints about a harsh ride.
Of course I'm in the camp that loves the classic Jag design and wanted one of the last of the old body styles.
The author's claim that the x350 was a total debacle and all the design costs were lost are a bit extreme... now that (all?) Jag's cars are aluminum bodied I think they have made use of the design costs of the x350. Also, I'd love to know what sales figures were for x300 and x351. Comparing 125k units of the x308 to 75k of the x350 isn't definitive proof of anything. I'm sure all car manufs took a hit in the 2000s with the economic bubble that burst.
Side note--I had a brand new XF as a loaner a few months ago, had 18" rims and I was surprised it rode nearly as nice as my x350 on 18" rims. I had no complaints about a harsh ride.
Last edited by EsRay; 08-02-2018 at 04:54 AM.
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jackra_1 (08-02-2018)
#40
Some here complain that the suspension isn't as soft or smooth as on older Jags ... may I suggest that it was then (older models), not now, that Jag 'lost the plot' with its larger saloons (sedans) by drifting away from what a saloon Jaguar originally was ... a sports-saloon.
If people think the X350's ride compares badly with a 'Jeeves-Kamikazi' saloon then why didn't they go buy one of those in the first place ?
If people think the X350's ride compares badly with a 'Jeeves-Kamikazi' saloon then why didn't they go buy one of those in the first place ?
Last edited by Partick the Cat; 08-02-2018 at 07:34 AM.