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When checking voltages not running everything is in the normal 12-13V range, once running it gets down in the 10.7V area. I guess it's time to pull the alternator and have it checked, although if it isn't charging full voltage, I'm guessing a bad diode inside, since the batteries I have are all new or fully charged. I'm also guessing weak charge, couple with old coils could be further complicating the situation.
Sound like I'm on the right path to you guys?
As always thanks to all!
10.7V while running is a definite problem. Most any O'Reilly, Autozone, Advance etc. will do a basic analysis of the charging system for free with the alternator in situ, if the car can be driven to one of those places. There certainly could be a problem with the rectifier/regulator in the alternator.
Hopefully Ross or some of our other experts will chime in.
no check and clean the bulkhead fitting(battery cable connector) at the firewall behind glove box on side trans tunnel. Mine was bad just last week, no start, poor charging etc.. took apart, cleaned and all is good. Even charges at a higher rate than before...
no check and clean the bulkhead fitting(battery cable connector) at the firewall behind glove box on side trans tunnel. Mine was bad just last week, no start, poor charging etc.. took apart, cleaned and all is good. Even charges at a higher rate than before...
Ray,
To help you visualize what Brutal is referring to, below are links to photos of the battery power connections and grounds on our XJ40. Corrosion on all of those connections can cause poor battery charging, reduced system voltage and many difficult-to-diagnose electrical gremlins. Your X300 will be different from our XJ40, but the photos should give you a clear idea of what is involved in cleaning and protecting these vital connections.
I'll start running those down as soon as I can. I come from an Italian car background, so I know all about bad connections! You know, English cars get a lot of flack about the "Prince of Darkness", but I have to admit that most of the wiring on our Jags, even the MK VII and 420 are far superior to the stuff I'm used to seeing in Fiat's. I'll get to wire brushing and sanding connections and applying lots of dielectric grease. I also plan on pulling the alternator and having it checked. The local stores have machines that will spin them and being a Nippondenso, they should be able to test with ease. This alternator looks an awful lot like the Isuzu Nippondenso I adapted to our Sunbeam/Hillman, and they were able to spin it and had all the correct jumpers. I'm off from work Thursday and Friday, so will work on it then.
I'll start running those down as soon as I can. I come from an Italian car background, so I know all about bad connections! You know, English cars get a lot of flack about the "Prince of Darkness", but I have to admit that most of the wiring on our Jags, even the MK VII and 420 are far superior to the stuff I'm used to seeing in Fiat's.
Ray, You definitely put things into perspective! Beginning with the XJ40, Jaguar definitely made improvements in its electrical standards. Many parts previously made by Lucas were now made by Bosch, and some of the ones still marked Lucas appear to have been based on designs licensed from Bosch. I would like to blame Lucas for all the cold solder joints, but the most recent one I found on our '93 was in the TCM made by Bosch.
In my younger years I always wanted a Fiat 124 Spyder, and I found a few with very low miles for their age, but for various reasons I never bought one. I realized years later that the reason all those Fiats had such low mileage was because the owners couldn't keep them running!
OK, here is my update! Checked and cleaned all of the electrical junctions I could find. Got fed up and went to the u-pull-it this morning, figured for $100 I could get everything that might be a problem and work from there. Trip was a success, found CPS, Cam sensor, 4 made in Japan coils, an alternator, ECU, body control module, nice set of chrome VDP mirrors, vent I needed for the dash and some other bits. Happy time!
Got home, put on the alternator and instant 13+ V and it ran better. Got CEL and code for mis-fire on 1 & 6. Changed the coils, no more CEL and it runs pretty good. Not butter smooth, but pretty good. Everyone seems to think Champion are the plug to have, (I have some Densos in there now) so I'm going to order a set and change them out, hopefully that will smooth things out 100%.
Now on to my other problem, the shifter interlock. I've checked the fuses that seem to be involved with that system and everything looks OK. The shifter interlock doesn't work and you can pull the key out with it in gear. I also noticed the door lock switch on the center of the dash doesn't function, but the auto locking does. Also no "you left your key in" chime ( I think it was a chime? not a buzzer? shows you how much you pay attention to that kind of stuff!) Everything else seems to be working in the car. Anybody have any ideas or chased this gremlin before? It got too late to get the test light and meter out today, so tomorrow I hope to have time to start chasing down the power in the system, but if anyone knows of a shortcut, I'll try it!
As always, thanks for any suggestions and if anybody needs a loaner part for testing let me know, I now have some spares.
I would definitely start with testing the Body Processor Module inputs. This will tell you if the problem is from the brake switch or the not-in-park switch or the ignition switch. The signals should be ground when active and B+ when inactive.
If they are ok, check the outputs from the BPM. No or incorrect outputs = bad BPM
The BPM also controls the chimes.
Here is the circuit diagram.
Edit: just saw you bought a spare BPM, if so a quick test would be to swap them over. (Assuming the spare works of course )
I was somewhat cynical about cylinder wash and non starting on this thread. I have just been talking to a young mechanic who is into drift racing at our local garage who instantly said yes he knew all about it and how to remedy it. And mentioned those Nikasol or whatever they are cylinder liners.
So I was quite wrong and exposed my ignorance and I apologise to those whose greater knowledge I doubted.
DrMike:
You have good reaon for skepticism- While cylinder wash can apparently happen in any of the low pressure piston ring engines (done that way for gas mileage), at least it is reportedly the case, the primary sufferers are Nikasil lined engines. And the X-300, which is what this forum section is for DO NOT have Nikasil lined engines.
I assume it has something to do with te tighter tolerances that the Nikasil process allows but I can't really see what unless they don't relay so much on the rings to form the seal but the minimal distance between piston and cylinder plus the oil.
I am pleased to hear my lovely Jag doesn't have such a ticking time bomb.
Having checked the X300 electrical schematic for a friend on another forum in the not-too-distant past, I can confirm that the coils should have 12V at all times when the ignition is on. The GEMS ECM switches each coil to ground and can control the timing and dwell of each coil individually. I think I recall that the 12V was delivered on the White wires with Pink tracers, and the ground wires were Light Green with different colored tracers for each coil. If you don't have the X300 electrical manual it may be available as a download at this forum or I would be happy to send it to you - just PM me.
First of all, thanks to all who replied to my questions. Without the support of a good group like this, owning and repairing a car such as this would be very difficult and I can't afford (or bear!) taking it to the dealership.
After several days interrupted by work, travel, life, etc. I am happy to say I am finally done!
Turns out the primary cause for my troubles was a weak battery and bad alternator. I'd guess the alternator was the original with 105K on it and the battery date codes tells me it is from 2005, can't complain there. I can't say that one took the other one out, I'm just guessing I had the "luck" of having them deteriorate at the same time. Spent a couple of hours with a wire brush, some sandpaper and dielectric grease and cleaned every electrical connection I could find.
Replaced two of the coils that were suspect with some used ones found at the u-pull-it, and removed the Denso plugs and put in some Champions. (not getting into a squabble about plugs, but I always liked Champions, but they got pretty hard to find over the years, everyone wants to sell you Autolites for plain old copper cores around here) Now she runs nice and smooth and accelerates like the old days.
Found my chime was missing due to a bad speaker. Radio Shack doesn't sell a 2.5 inch speaker and I wanted to get done today, so I took a quick trip to a thrift store, a $2.50 answering machine provided a nice replacement.
Shifter interlock failed due to an intermittent fault on the fuse! I have never seen an ATO fuse fail like this, but it was like a regular light bulb where the filament has failed, but if you move it just right it'll make contact. I'll never look at an ATO fuse so casually again. I would have never found this if I hadn't taken the fuse out and checked it with my VOM. It looked fine even with my reading glasses on, but if you move it just right...oh well.
I also tightened up the rocking steering column and found the weak wire that cause the wipers to fail from time to time depending on the steering column position.
Also, while I had it all apart I pulled out the POS factory radio(the one with a knob that you would think controls the volume, but seems to only make it louder, and will never connect with the CD changer it can see, but can't seem to access) with a simple single DIN radio/CD player. Not the most beautiful installation, but it's nice to have a radio that works.
Gave her new belts while I was in there, who knows how old those were. Next on the list, new shocks. Maybe I'll stumble on a set of Koni's or Bilstien's at Carlisle next month.
So all in all, it's a happy time here in Easton, PA!
Again, thanks to all and I hope this will help someone else in the future.
Hello I am new to the forum and have a '95 X300 with precisely the same issue - engine cranks but won't start.
Just purchased the car and not dived into it yet, PO says the engine will run with a squirt of starter fluid/ether, so suspect a fuel issue.
It's a beautiful car otherwise and I will go through everything with reports as time allows...
It has shown error code p1621 on the Foxwell sanner, which immediately repeats after clearing and that code appears in another thread.
But the contributors in that thread seem to be at a loss.
The scanner (Foxwell) also shows two cat error codes and a secondary air pump code, and again, these codes repeat immediately after clearing and attempting to re-start the engine.
Now, it did show an engine speed sensor error, but that code cleared and did not repeat.
Once I get the car in the garage I will have much more to report...maybe I should be careful what I wish for!
During the starter rotation phase does the voltage on the car drop below 11.4 ?
This causes the engine ECU to not run properly and not give you ignition along with other possible things
The volt meter on the instrument cluster is very accurate but can be hard to read in the heat of battle
You can read it with a independent volt meter at the terminal post on any fuse box or maybe at the glove box light socket for a one person operation
To test for fuel pump place your finger on the # 1 fuel pump relay and feel for it to click on then click off after 4 seconds as you rotate the key to the run position before the start position
This primes the fuel rail
Listen for the fuel pump
The relay will click a 3rd time on after the ECU sees engine rotation for the duration of the drive
Last edited by Lady Penelope; 02-09-2019 at 08:20 AM.
Thanks much Lady Penelope for your response and info..!
I won't have this '95 X300 in my garage until Tuesday Feb 12th and will dive in then.
All I could do today is scan the codes in the seller's garage, and got these codes: P1775 Transmission MIL Fault and P0411 secondary air pump.
Also two cat codes and for sure the cats are shot.
The P1775 worries me since with 113K miles on the clock (present mileage) the PO (owner from new) has never changed the ATF..!!
The crankshaft position sensor is working I believe, since the RPM gauge does register when the engine is being cranked over.
As for the turn-over but no-start, I am leaning -- pun intended -- toward a fuel delivery issue, since the car runs with a shot of starter fluid.
As for the codes, I believe it's doubtful that the P1775 could be related to the no-start?
Seller states that he has never done anything to the car other than change the oil, he has run the car fairly regularly until now.
So I'm thinking clogged fuel filter; bad fuel pump; sediment in tank; plugged or leaking injectors; and fuel check relay operation as LP has so kindly suggested.
Besides addressing the fuel delivery problem, as a matter of course I will change the cam position sensor and the crank position sensor
since the car does have over 100K and the seller says none of that work has ever been done.
I won't know more until I can get the car in my garage next week... but meanwhile thanks again for the interest!
Before spending money on a Crankshaft position sensor something to consider is the one sensor signal can be failed to be seen by other sub - systems before complete failure
The Tach is the last to fail
Before the Tach fails the ECU providing the ground to command the # 1 fuel pump relay to close is an early sub - system
Since the car has been sitting for awhile there is a check valve on the fuel pump itself that holds pressure for days
You may have to cycle the key a few times to charge the fuel lines lacking this charge
The Cam position sensor is code P0340 and the engine will start with the connector unplugged by design but takes a few revolutions
The Cam sensor is adjustable and there is a procedure that may have been set incorrectly confusing the ECU and not allowing the designed reverting to the Crankshaft sensor in the starting sequence
The codes like the Trans and Ccats may work out after running
There seems to be a correlation on the O2 sensors efficiency codes and weither the crush washers are present and missing and even placing an extra to bring the sensor depth out biasing the signal . The crush washers can be obtained from cheap 12 mm spark plug
Secondary air pump can be the fuse that was later uprated , the capacitor in the wiring , or the several pump changes it went though . But is nheap ot needed until emissions testing based on location
The 4 speed version of the ZF transmission has a excellent service history and may just be a dirty transmission connector
Get rid of the old fuel and on the X300 there is no anti - siphoning trap in the fill pipe
Keep in mind as the battery drops in charge and the voltage sag on the car during starter rotation the ECU voltage under 11.4 on this model will not function properly but the starter will continue to crank
Last edited by Lady Penelope; 02-09-2019 at 05:38 PM.
Yep all great info.... !!
I got the car in the garage today and started right up.
But the idle is in a subtle way rough, and at times on attempting to start the engine it balks and dies.
I immediately thought spark plugs, and sure enough at 113K miles this engine still has the original factory Champion plugs it was fitted with!
The plugs are very worn and in need of replacement; the coils also looked somewhat cooked.
There was a small pool of oil around the #2 plug thread hole (not on the plug electrode or insulator) and appears the rocker cover gasket/seal there may have partially failed .
WRT the plug insulators it appears that the mixture is too rich, but I don't see any evidence of oil fouling.
Checked the compression and it is 210 Psi on all six cylinders + or - perhaps 5 to 10 psi between them.
The oil looks good so the head gasket is likely okay.
There is some parasitic drain on the battery in need of investigation.
Thanks to Lady Penelope for all your advice and help!
NB: not meaning to hijack ra's thread,
which I thought had finished but apparently not, so I'll do a new thread if anything else come up.
The corona stains around the plugs are normal. There's even a TSB confirming that.
If you have oil in one of your wells, you need to replace the camcover gasket, including the six spark plug gaskets as well. You should also replace the 13 gaskets that the bolts use to snug up to your camcover...I would recommend RockAuto for those.
I have never successfully been able to make an aftermarket camcover gasket work. They are too long. The URO branded spark plug gaskets seem to work well enough. No need for OEM there.
Thanks again for the info!
The plugs are not as bad as first thought, but at the limit of their life.. based on electrode wear.
The check engine MIL light has been on for a couple of months according to the PO, and the scanner was giving two cat errors.
After clearing the codes and running the engine briskly for a while, all codes have disappeared except for a secondary air pump code.
However, this '95 XJ6 X300 has an indicated 113K miles and appears that the o2 sensors have not been changed.
As a matter of course I should change the o2 sensors at this mileage.
Should I also replace the cats? Or change the sensors and see how it goes?
regards
03-17-2014, 04:50 PM
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