Crank pulley bolt
#1
Crank pulley bolt
I know this has probably been beaten to death, and yes I have searched every single post on the subject, but I am in the process of replacing my tensioners/chains, and am stuck at the removal of the harmonic balancer bolt. Using the appropriate holding tool, and a 24mm socket with e breaker bar and a 4' extension, the bolt slowly began to undo with all the might I could muster. After undoing the bolt approx half a turn, I removed the 48" extension and began unwinding the bolt with just the breaker bar, it still had at least 120ft lbs resistance. This resistance increased the more I tried to undo the bolt, until after approx a full turn the resistance increases to such an extent that I am afraid of snapping the bolt. What's the deal here. The bolt has "broke loose", and in theory should now remove relatively easily. I have tried tightening the bolt again, and loosening again, thinking it may loosen it up, but no luck. I had soaked it in WD40 and PB Blaster. When I try to undo it just gets harder and harder to turn, until it takes so much effort I am afraid of snapping the bolt. I have not tried an impact wrench yet because I am afraid of snapping the bolt, as I cannot understand why there should be so much resistance AFTER the bolt has been broken lose. I cannot think why or what is causing this resistance. Anyone else had this problem, and any ideas? It's frustrating because getting this far has been very easy, and I'm spending more time on this stupid bolt than the actual job!
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#2
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Spray it with the PB Blaster while out as far as you have it, ....re-tighten it, but not tightly, ..back it out again, ..spray again, ..re-tighten again, repeat one more time...let sit for awhile. That will help you remove scaling on the threads and get the penetrate into the inner threads to soak in deeper. Read the can, it tells you to apply solid raps to the bolt. In your case use your socket on it and apply some hammer blows. This is to loosen the scaling.
...btw, is that a 3/8" drive? If so, you need 1/2" to get proper torque.
...btw, is that a 3/8" drive? If so, you need 1/2" to get proper torque.
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#3
Spray it with the PB Blaster while out as far as you have it, ....re-tighten it, but not tightly, ..back it out again, ..spray again, ..re-tighten again, repeat one more time...let sit for awhile. That will help you remove scaling on the threads and get the penetrate into the inner threads to soak in deeper. Read the can, it tells you to apply solid raps to the bolt. In your case use your socket on it and apply some hammer blows. This is to loosen the scaling.
...btw, is that a 3/8" drive? If so, you need 1/2" to get proper torque.
...btw, is that a 3/8" drive? If so, you need 1/2" to get proper torque.
..
#4
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Trans line removal is somewhat easy and easy to cap. Take a sandwich bag, laying flat, cut it in half, sealed bottom to opening and get a couple rubber bands or zip ties. Now when you take the lines off you put the pocket corner of the bag over the end of the line and put the rubber band or zip tie around it to prevent drippage. Undo one line at a time, after removal you'll probably get a bit of drip, put a towel or piece of cardboard under the area and cap off.
There's an old trick we used to use, but I don't think you can get into it enough to do such. If you have a torch, heat up the bolt pretty well, take a candle stick and work it around the threads as far down as possible and while still hot, wrench it out. The wax acts as a flux lube and when it starts getting hard to turn, you just need to heat it again and apply wax. But, like I said, this situation really doesn't apply well for this situation.
There's an old trick we used to use, but I don't think you can get into it enough to do such. If you have a torch, heat up the bolt pretty well, take a candle stick and work it around the threads as far down as possible and while still hot, wrench it out. The wax acts as a flux lube and when it starts getting hard to turn, you just need to heat it again and apply wax. But, like I said, this situation really doesn't apply well for this situation.
Last edited by Highhorse; 03-04-2018 at 09:06 PM.
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#5
There's an old trick we used to use, but I don't think you can get into it enough to do such. If you have a torch, heat up the bolt pretty well, take a candle stick and work it around the threads as far down as possible and while still hot, wrench it out. The wax acts as a flux lube and when it starts getting hard to turn, you just need to heat it again and apply wax. But, like I said, this situation really doesn't apply well for this situation.
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#6
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#7
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#8
I guess I'll try the heat, and the impact, and see what happens.
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Don B (03-05-2018)
#9
I don't think the threadlock can hold the bolt so hard, even though it is the red one (pre-applied to the bolt). It is more likely that the bolt was overtightened and stretched deforming the threads. I would go very slowly with a lot more penetrant/lubricant. Heat should help - try heating it up and back the bolt out as much as you dare then let it cool down. Heat up again, see if you can back the bolt a bit further, cool down and so on (with lots of penetrant in between).
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Carnival Kid (03-06-2018)
#10
This picture should show how the threads are actually filled with loctite.
I've removed dozens of these things and heat directly on the bolt head gets this stuff soft enough to remove the bolt. It binds as it comes out otherwise.
The high torque setting is for both Supercharged and NA units.
I've removed dozens of these things and heat directly on the bolt head gets this stuff soft enough to remove the bolt. It binds as it comes out otherwise.
The high torque setting is for both Supercharged and NA units.
Last edited by Sean B; 03-05-2018 at 12:01 PM.
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#11
I don't think the threadlock can hold the bolt so hard, even though it is the red one (pre-applied to the bolt). It is more likely that the bolt was overtightened and stretched deforming the threads. I would go very slowly with a lot more penetrant/lubricant. Heat should help - try heating it up and back the bolt out as much as you dare then let it cool down. Heat up again, see if you can back the bolt a bit further, cool down and so on (with lots of penetrant in between).
The bolt is 1 5/8" long, and approx 12 tpi, and I'm getting about 3/4 of a turn per day, so I should be done sometime in April!
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#12
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I've found that using MAPP gas is often more effective than propane because it has a higher combustion temperature and will get the bolt hot more quickly and thoroughly before the heat has a chance to dissipate into the surrounding metal.
Looking forward to your victory cheer!
Don
Last edited by Don B; 03-05-2018 at 08:48 PM.
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#13
The Loctite "bunches up" as you back the bolt out, actually increasing the resistance.
all that metal in the reluctor/damper core, crankshaft and timing cover form a very efficient heat sink, so you can apply more heat than you think directly to the head of the bolt.
Looking forward to your victory cheer!
Don
all that metal in the reluctor/damper core, crankshaft and timing cover form a very efficient heat sink, so you can apply more heat than you think directly to the head of the bolt.
Looking forward to your victory cheer!
Don
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#14
I had this same thing happen to a 4.0 V8 just out of factory warranty. I finally got the bolt out but there was some metal in the bolt threads. I called Jaguar Tech Line and was advised to consider replacing the crankshaft.
I did NOT want to go through the procedure of matching the bearings etc.
The customer would not want to pay the repair bill I'm sure!!
I cleaned the old bolt and cut grooves along the length of the bolt to fashion a TAP and ran it into the crankshaft end several times to clean the threaded hole.
A new bolt from the parts dept and the pulley went back on properly!!! (hooray)
bob
I did NOT want to go through the procedure of matching the bearings etc.
The customer would not want to pay the repair bill I'm sure!!
I cleaned the old bolt and cut grooves along the length of the bolt to fashion a TAP and ran it into the crankshaft end several times to clean the threaded hole.
A new bolt from the parts dept and the pulley went back on properly!!! (hooray)
bob
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#15
I just installed a new crank pulley bolt on my engine (SC), which came with red pre-applied threadlock. What puzzled me was the specified torque of 375NM whereas I found, in the bolt tightening charts, that the torque for M16 x 2.0 bolts of Grade 10.9 (like the crank pulley bolt) should be 280NM. I understand that some extra torque should be added for the friction under the large bolt head but going to 375NM seems excessive (and risky). Anyhow, I torqued it to about 320NM (afraid to go higher) and I am sure it will hold well. Perhaps the 375NM can, in some cases, cause damage to the thread.
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#16
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#17
YEE HAA!!!! Got it out!
Using the heat method, "melting" the locktite, undoing as fast as I could, reheat, repeat, etc etc,
It was tight all the way to the last couple of threads, and i mean TIGHT! I could only turn it about 1/3 of a turn each heat/reheat.
The bolt is undamaged, and the crank threads also, as far as I can see with a mirror.
Thank you to everyone on here, this forum rocks!
Now.......to remove the pulley!
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Using the heat method, "melting" the locktite, undoing as fast as I could, reheat, repeat, etc etc,
It was tight all the way to the last couple of threads, and i mean TIGHT! I could only turn it about 1/3 of a turn each heat/reheat.
The bolt is undamaged, and the crank threads also, as far as I can see with a mirror.
Thank you to everyone on here, this forum rocks!
Now.......to remove the pulley!
.
.
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#18
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YEE HAA!!!! Got it out!
Using the heat method, "melting" the locktite, undoing as fast as I could, reheat, repeat, etc etc,
It was tight all the way to the last couple of threads, and i mean TIGHT! I could only turn it about 1/3 of a turn each heat/reheat.
The bolt is undamaged, and the crank threads also, as far as I can see with a mirror.
Thank you to everyone on here, this forum rocks!
Now.......to remove the pulley! .
Using the heat method, "melting" the locktite, undoing as fast as I could, reheat, repeat, etc etc,
It was tight all the way to the last couple of threads, and i mean TIGHT! I could only turn it about 1/3 of a turn each heat/reheat.
The bolt is undamaged, and the crank threads also, as far as I can see with a mirror.
Thank you to everyone on here, this forum rocks!
Now.......to remove the pulley! .
WHAT!!....its April already?? Good deal CK and thank goodness it came out clean. Great persistence and patience on your part.
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#19
It is not difficult, you don't pull it all the way. Once you pull the pulley a small amount (1 mm or less), just hit it back with a plastic hammer and it will come loose. You may have to repeat a few times, pull-hit, pull hit (just like hot-cold).
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#20
only thread the bolts into the pulley a SMALL amount (i'd say 4-5 threads of depth is sufficient). If you thread them too far you will crack your timing cover
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