On to my Next Topic for the Vanden Plas: Sound System Upgrades!
#41
05-12-2014, 02:00 PM
Again, the premium Alpine and Harman kardon systems might be O.K. but the majority of XJ8's came with the "standard" radio and Philips speakers which are horrible. I can only assume many of you haven't heard the standard setup or had to live with it for very long. Also, the standard setup didn't include a subwoofer. Replacing the radio with the attractive aftermarket kit and an Alpine cd/receiver along with the Pioneer 6 3/4" mid-bass speakers and Clarion tweeters in place of that Philips junk really did make a huge difference.
I also wouldn't use up the space in the center consol or modify any other part of the interior but what others do to their cars is alright with me. Anything can be put back to stock by the next owner if they so choose.
I'm also not interested in putting a large subwwofer in the trunk but I am trying to figure out a way to add a little low end to the equation. Something inside the car, not the trunk. Just something to fill in the bottom end. The way the 6 3/4" drivers are mounted doesn't leave much space for a proper enclosure so bass response is limited.
So far I've looked at some small 6" sub drivers for the back shelf from Kicker, a Kenwood self-powered 6 1/2" or 8" unit mounted to the top of the shelf or a shallow 8" driver in the stock location but there just doesn't seem to be much room back there.
I also wouldn't use up the space in the center consol or modify any other part of the interior but what others do to their cars is alright with me. Anything can be put back to stock by the next owner if they so choose.
I'm also not interested in putting a large subwwofer in the trunk but I am trying to figure out a way to add a little low end to the equation. Something inside the car, not the trunk. Just something to fill in the bottom end. The way the 6 3/4" drivers are mounted doesn't leave much space for a proper enclosure so bass response is limited.
So far I've looked at some small 6" sub drivers for the back shelf from Kicker, a Kenwood self-powered 6 1/2" or 8" unit mounted to the top of the shelf or a shallow 8" driver in the stock location but there just doesn't seem to be much room back there.
I can not speak to the "standard" systems, however judging by the many posters in these forums, it must be rather poor. My understanding is that the head units are the same in both the premium and standard systems and the only "premium" improvement is the output portion of the sound system. Please correct me if I am in error.
Yes, genec, increased fidelity as well as bass, is much to be desired and the stock location is rather cramped, however my requirements are far short of Richter scale 7. There are several options with none or little changes to the back shelf. The ones you mention above would certainly work well, however I am first exploring increased output within the current physical spaces available.
#42
05-12-2014, 03:39 PM
While I'm confident doing any necessary "butchering" to the audio harness once I'm sure of what needs to be done, This statement makes me think I'm overlooking a simple solution.
Am I missing something obvious?
#43
05-12-2014, 07:01 PM
I can not speak to the "standard" systems, however judging by the many posters in these forums, it must be rather poor. My understanding is that the head units are the same in both the premium and standard systems and the only "premium" improvement is the output portion of the sound system. Please correct me if I am in error.
Yes, genec, increased fidelity as well as bass, is much to be desired and the stock location is rather cramped, however my requirements are far short of Richter scale 7. There are several options with none or little changes to the back shelf. The ones you mention above would certainly work well, however I am first exploring increased output within the current physical spaces available.
Yes, genec, increased fidelity as well as bass, is much to be desired and the stock location is rather cramped, however my requirements are far short of Richter scale 7. There are several options with none or little changes to the back shelf. The ones you mention above would certainly work well, however I am first exploring increased output within the current physical spaces available.
I've been looking at the picture of the door mods posted earlier and I think I'm going to try something like that first, maybe later this summer, before doing anything else. I'm very happy with the Pioneers/Clarions from about 100 hz on up. In fact, I usually leave bass/treble and eq setting flat. It just sounds very natural. But the lack of a bottom end is driving me nuts! Those Pioneers were designed for a more typical door mount rather than the back-side panel mount used in the XJ8. Aftermarket speakers must be designed for a large enclosure like a trunk or a door cavity. Mounted like they are now, there's just nothun' under 100 hz.
#44
05-12-2014, 08:12 PM
I don't want to sound like a broken record, but you should be looking at sealing and deadening your doors, and ideally building pods to mount the speakers to the door, rather than the door card. This will give you a lot of the bottom end you're looking for.
Also, the 'standard' audio was amped at the headunit only, there was no seperate amp, this was only on the premium system.
As for the headunit, I am really hoping someone will clarify the exact differences between models. There are definitely at least two versions, one is pretty basic, and the second has Time Alignment, which is the "left, right, center" setting, which delays the signal from different speakers so that they appear centred around one particular seat.
I have the base model, in a 2000 car, and I have no TA settings.
It is probably just a difference between standard and premium cars, but knowing Jaguar, there could also be differences across years, or markets. Without getting my hands on a range of cars, I can't tell for sure
Also, the 'standard' audio was amped at the headunit only, there was no seperate amp, this was only on the premium system.
As for the headunit, I am really hoping someone will clarify the exact differences between models. There are definitely at least two versions, one is pretty basic, and the second has Time Alignment, which is the "left, right, center" setting, which delays the signal from different speakers so that they appear centred around one particular seat.
I have the base model, in a 2000 car, and I have no TA settings.
It is probably just a difference between standard and premium cars, but knowing Jaguar, there could also be differences across years, or markets. Without getting my hands on a range of cars, I can't tell for sure
#45
05-12-2014, 10:36 PM
I don't want to sound like a broken record, but you should be looking at sealing and deadening your doors, and ideally building pods to mount the speakers to the door, rather than the door card. This will give you a lot of the bottom end you're looking for.
Also, the 'standard' audio was amped at the headunit only, there was no seperate amp, this was only on the premium system.
As for the headunit, I am really hoping someone will clarify the exact differences between models. There are definitely at least two versions, one is pretty basic, and the second has Time Alignment, which is the "left, right, center" setting, which delays the signal from different speakers so that they appear centred around one particular seat.
I have the base model, in a 2000 car, and I have no TA settings.
It is probably just a difference between standard and premium cars, but knowing Jaguar, there could also be differences across years, or markets. Without getting my hands on a range of cars, I can't tell for sure
Also, the 'standard' audio was amped at the headunit only, there was no seperate amp, this was only on the premium system.
As for the headunit, I am really hoping someone will clarify the exact differences between models. There are definitely at least two versions, one is pretty basic, and the second has Time Alignment, which is the "left, right, center" setting, which delays the signal from different speakers so that they appear centred around one particular seat.
I have the base model, in a 2000 car, and I have no TA settings.
It is probably just a difference between standard and premium cars, but knowing Jaguar, there could also be differences across years, or markets. Without getting my hands on a range of cars, I can't tell for sure
My installer said it had a seperate amp but he may have been thinking of the premium systems.
#46
05-12-2014, 10:45 PM
It's actually reasonably simple for someone with experience making speaker pods. We have the advantage of them being inside the door, so they don't have to look pretty, which is where most of the time and effort is when fibreglassing.
Just need to take care when removing the speaker covers, as the plastic tabs can break
Just need to take care when removing the speaker covers, as the plastic tabs can break
#48
05-13-2014, 04:03 PM
Veteran Member
I just find it funny that a "premium" car stereo system uses 8-ohm speakers. It seems inefficient, because all that extra power from the amp would be lost pushing sound through the extra speaker resistance. Conversely, more sophisticated systems can afford driving the amp power through 2-ohm, even 1-ohm speaker arrangements.
Anyway, all the guts from my XJR's original "premium" system are shelved somewhere in my garage, except for the CD changer that I sold. But, the nav system, the amp with matching 8-ohm speakers and head unit are all there. I may just get rid of it all one of these days.
#49
05-13-2014, 04:35 PM
Where did you hear that? It sounds.... wrong.
Since when where the Premium speakers 8ohm?
Also, I thought the Premium setup used a different plug out of the back of the headunit to send the signal to the amp? So the amp component of the headunit won't be connected to anything. What would be the point of a switch under the headunit turning this amp off, if it's not connected to anything in the first place? I may be thinking of X300's though... these had a plug under the rear seat that connected to the premium amp.
Also, I have a 2000, and I don't have any TA settings. Although, I may actually have a 99-spec car.
If what you're saying is true, this would mean that all 2000+ cars should have the time alignment settings? Might be worth looking at picking up a second later model headunit... If I can find one anywhere...
Since when where the Premium speakers 8ohm?
Also, I thought the Premium setup used a different plug out of the back of the headunit to send the signal to the amp? So the amp component of the headunit won't be connected to anything. What would be the point of a switch under the headunit turning this amp off, if it's not connected to anything in the first place? I may be thinking of X300's though... these had a plug under the rear seat that connected to the premium amp.
Also, I have a 2000, and I don't have any TA settings. Although, I may actually have a 99-spec car.
If what you're saying is true, this would mean that all 2000+ cars should have the time alignment settings? Might be worth looking at picking up a second later model headunit... If I can find one anywhere...
Last edited by grandell; 05-13-2014 at 04:39 PM.
#50
05-15-2014, 05:04 PM
Speaker Enclosure
I don't want to sound like a broken record, but you should be looking at sealing and deadening your doors, and ideally building pods to mount the speakers to the door, rather than the door card. This will give you a lot of the bottom end you're looking for.
Also, the 'standard' audio was amped at the headunit only, there was no seperate amp, this was only on the premium system.
As for the headunit, I am really hoping someone will clarify the exact differences between models. There are definitely at least two versions, one is pretty basic, and the second has Time Alignment, which is the "left, right, center" setting, which delays the signal from different speakers so that they appear centred around one particular seat.
I have the base model, in a 2000 car, and I have no TA settings.
It is probably just a difference between standard and premium cars, but knowing Jaguar, there could also be differences across years, or markets. Without getting my hands on a range of cars, I can't tell for sure
Also, the 'standard' audio was amped at the headunit only, there was no seperate amp, this was only on the premium system.
As for the headunit, I am really hoping someone will clarify the exact differences between models. There are definitely at least two versions, one is pretty basic, and the second has Time Alignment, which is the "left, right, center" setting, which delays the signal from different speakers so that they appear centred around one particular seat.
I have the base model, in a 2000 car, and I have no TA settings.
It is probably just a difference between standard and premium cars, but knowing Jaguar, there could also be differences across years, or markets. Without getting my hands on a range of cars, I can't tell for sure
Grandell, soundproofing the doors would seem to be a very good thing to do as they are acting as a speaker enclosure with all the resonance qualities, be that good or bad, of that role. I am unsure as to the improvement made by the fiberglass units, although I suspect the "pods" actually transmit lower frequency vibrations by direct transfer, which would enhance the bass. I know you actually fabricated these from fiberglass, but I am curious how other materials might sound and if there might be a market for these, not only for Jaguar, but other automobile sound systems as well. Wood is a fantastic acoustic transmitter and I wonder how difficult it would be to construct them in a nice hardwood.
RandyS
2003 XJ8 Vanden Plas
1982 BMW 320i
1977 Chevrolet Silverado Stepside
1983 Porsche 944
1987 Mitsubishi Van
#51
05-15-2014, 07:47 PM
The main advantage of the pods is that they provide a much more solid mount for the mids, compared to the door cards. It stops vibration, which is wasted energy, and gives a much cleaner overall sound.
Think of your speakers at home, they're big heavy wooden boxes, not cardboard.
Sealing and sound deadening the door has a similar effect, it creates a nice solid box for the speaker, so that you don't waste energy making other things vibrate.
FYI my pods are MDF rings mounted to a fibreglass base, which was then coated in resin and more fibreglass... I believe. I didn't actually make them myself, but the pics are fairly self-explanatory
Think of your speakers at home, they're big heavy wooden boxes, not cardboard.
Sealing and sound deadening the door has a similar effect, it creates a nice solid box for the speaker, so that you don't waste energy making other things vibrate.
FYI my pods are MDF rings mounted to a fibreglass base, which was then coated in resin and more fibreglass... I believe. I didn't actually make them myself, but the pics are fairly self-explanatory
#52
05-15-2014, 08:35 PM
Veteran Member
Where did you hear that? It sounds.... wrong.
Since when where the Premium speakers 8ohm?
Also, I thought the Premium setup used a different plug out of the back of the headunit to send the signal to the amp? So the amp component of the headunit won't be connected to anything. What would be the point of a switch under the headunit turning this amp off, if it's not connected to anything in the first place? I may be thinking of X300's though... these had a plug under the rear seat that connected to the premium amp.
Also, I have a 2000, and I don't have any TA settings. Although, I may actually have a 99-spec car.
If what you're saying is true, this would mean that all 2000+ cars should have the time alignment settings? Might be worth looking at picking up a second later model headunit... If I can find one anywhere...
Since when where the Premium speakers 8ohm?
Also, I thought the Premium setup used a different plug out of the back of the headunit to send the signal to the amp? So the amp component of the headunit won't be connected to anything. What would be the point of a switch under the headunit turning this amp off, if it's not connected to anything in the first place? I may be thinking of X300's though... these had a plug under the rear seat that connected to the premium amp.
Also, I have a 2000, and I don't have any TA settings. Although, I may actually have a 99-spec car.
If what you're saying is true, this would mean that all 2000+ cars should have the time alignment settings? Might be worth looking at picking up a second later model headunit... If I can find one anywhere...
BTW, I did this installation as soon as I purchased this car, meaning that these four Jaguar/Alpine midrange speakers only have 11,000 miles of use. They look all brand new. Ditto for the rear shelf subwoofer, the head unit, the nav unit. When I did the installation I thought maybe when I sell the car the new owner may want these units, so I kept them. All they've done is take up room in the garage. It'll be silly to go back from a far better system, considering all the work that it takes. I'll find out what they're worth and sell them, instead.
Cheers,
#54
05-16-2014, 11:44 AM
#56
03-31-2016, 03:08 AM
Member
#57
03-31-2016, 09:33 AM
short version, they don't make one. The structure of the dash behind the opening is such that there's not enough room to allow for the upper half of a double din to fit. There are exceptions, certain smaller screen models, with a custom faceplate and the right angle can clear, there are a few people who have done that. Otherwise, much chopping and work is required and it's not a pretty sight. There are some options, but it's not a plug-and-play like a single DIN is.
The following users liked this post:
ahmedalalousi (04-01-2016)
#58
04-01-2016, 09:23 AM
Member
short version, they don't make one. The structure of the dash behind the opening is such that there's not enough room to allow for the upper half of a double din to fit. There are exceptions, certain smaller screen models, with a custom faceplate and the right angle can clear, there are a few people who have done that. Otherwise, much chopping and work is required and it's not a pretty sight. There are some options, but it's not a plug-and-play like a single DIN is.
I'll take the centre console apart and see what could be done/modified. One option I had in mind was to make an entertainment system from scratch, with an 8" - 10" screen fitted instead of the OEM unite, and hosting the CPU to the system in the boot. Alternatively, an embedded board would easily fit in the space behind.
Will get my head round software - AppRadio is one option and runs on Adroid. That said, I had been hoping not to have to spend endless hours on this, hence the desire for a standard double-DIN unit.
Thanks again ..
Thread
Thread Starter
Forum
Replies
Last Post
FS[NorthEast]: HOT Black/Black '07 S-Type R w/55k miles for sale!
08Z06
PRIVATE For Sale / Trade or Buy Classifieds
2
10-24-2015 05:46 PM
Currently Active Users Viewing This Thread: 1 (0 members and 1 guests)