My XJR just tried to kill me...
#21
08-29-2023, 05:28 PM
Fingers crossed 🤞 I'd consider giving it an unscheduled full major service, replacing all fluids and filters and inspecting anything that should be inspected at a major. These days I do this for all used cars that I buy regardless of service history.. it's like the PPI with warranty, it's an added expense but it gives me peace of mind. I had to get an indepenent mechanic to do it for my XES, as the Jag dealer was super weird about doing a service that wasn't scheduled (not many businesses that refuse to take money!).
Re PPI with warranty, here if we join our state's roadside assist club thing (NRMA, RACV, etc - like the AAA) we can have a car inspected by a participating workshop and, if something fails within 12 months that wasn't identified as an issue on the PPI, the workshop will fix it with the cost covered by the auto club's insurance. Maybe $50 or $100 more expensive than a normal PPI, but if the diff falls out of my car I know who's paying for it 🤣 I'd be surprise if nobody does something like that in your country so it might be worth looking into for your next ride.
Most of the threads like this on here seem to rapidly devolve into apportioning blame to the previous owner, the mechanic that did the PPI, Jag themselves, the old lady next door's cat, blah blah... at least you're looking forwards rather than backward 👍
Can you ask your shopfor photos of the inside of the exploded diff? Would love to see the carnage :P
Re PPI with warranty, here if we join our state's roadside assist club thing (NRMA, RACV, etc - like the AAA) we can have a car inspected by a participating workshop and, if something fails within 12 months that wasn't identified as an issue on the PPI, the workshop will fix it with the cost covered by the auto club's insurance. Maybe $50 or $100 more expensive than a normal PPI, but if the diff falls out of my car I know who's paying for it 🤣 I'd be surprise if nobody does something like that in your country so it might be worth looking into for your next ride.
Most of the threads like this on here seem to rapidly devolve into apportioning blame to the previous owner, the mechanic that did the PPI, Jag themselves, the old lady next door's cat, blah blah... at least you're looking forwards rather than backward 👍
Can you ask your shopfor photos of the inside of the exploded diff? Would love to see the carnage :P
#22
08-29-2023, 05:32 PM
Senior Member
#23
08-29-2023, 10:44 PM
Let's be honest Mercedes make better cars and you can find parts for it but for our cars 1000$ for a radiator!
this car fail if we like it or not once you hit 100k it probably will need restoration the engine all bushings fail
Tensioners and ignition coils cooling fan transmission oil cooler all the struts and the mounts you will be lucky if the rear main seal didn't leak . I don't like Mercedes that much they make better cars in this forum there must be sticky page of warning this car must be owned by retired millionaire . I didn't have the knowledge and I believed it's just as Honda and Toyota I spent over 10k on repairs while my nissan just had fuel pump over the years
this car fail if we like it or not once you hit 100k it probably will need restoration the engine all bushings fail
Tensioners and ignition coils cooling fan transmission oil cooler all the struts and the mounts you will be lucky if the rear main seal didn't leak . I don't like Mercedes that much they make better cars in this forum there must be sticky page of warning this car must be owned by retired millionaire . I didn't have the knowledge and I believed it's just as Honda and Toyota I spent over 10k on repairs while my nissan just had fuel pump over the years
True, if you buy an old luxury car you better have some know how or some cash. But this is the case for ANY 20-25 year old luxury car that isn't a Lexus or Acura. However I have been surprised at how reliable the Jaguars I bought have been, well beyond 100K. I'm sorry if your experience has been negative but nothing looks or drives like the Jags. If I wanted boring and bulletproof I'd buy an old Camry.
#24
08-29-2023, 10:56 PM
> The era of Jaguar unreliability ended in the mid 90s.They aren't Toyotas but I'd take one over any BMW or MB of the last 20 years.
Indeed. And that date is not a coincidence, as Ford took the helm at Jaguar around 1990.
The British (and apparently the rest of the world, too) kind of hated Ford for taking over Jaguar, and Ford/Jaguar got punished for it with bad sales figures.
I worked for Ford (Cologne, Germany) and Jaguar (Coventry). and while Ford is not perfect (resisting the "journey" towards less fuel efficient cars and newer transmissions (e.g. putting the very old Fiesta engine into the Focus - and only adding a bit of shiny metal on the top to make it look shiny, and kind of the same for transmissions)), you cannot fault Ford for not doing everything for making cars more reliable. FMEAs were a big thing at Ford/Jaguar. Plenty of road-test before official sales. I myself drove way more than 1000km with a Ford Puma in my spare time in1997/8 to road-test it before it gets offered for sale. And that is only on top of testing the carts at Proving Grounds - the Lommel Proving Ground was one of them:
https://www.fordlpg.com/en/indexjs.h...in_act_dur.htm
Lommel is in Belgium. I drove there from Ford in Cologne to interview the guys there, who tested the "pascars" (test cars, models not released yet).
Ford takes feedback from garages/repair shops serious and it constantly does improvements based upon the feedback they are getting. Ford stuffed many millions into improved manufacturing processes at Jaguar, but the public did not see it...
The end of the story was that "the public" actually punished itself by attempting to punish Ford with bad sales figures: Ford was forced to sell Jaguar at a loss to an Indian car-maker (Tata) at around 2010. I for one will not put up my hand for when any Indian Jaguar is up for sale...
PS:
I only just stumbled over a news feed - apparently I am not alone in my feelings regarding an Indian Jaguar:JLR posts £524 million loss after slow production ramp-up
Jaguar Land Rover has posted a loss of £524 million for the first quarter of the 2023 financial year, as it continues to suffer the impacts of the global semiconductor shortage and Covid lockdowns.
The Tata-owned British company sold 78,825 new cars from April to June – a drop of around 46,000 year on year, representing a 37% drop.
Indeed. And that date is not a coincidence, as Ford took the helm at Jaguar around 1990.
The British (and apparently the rest of the world, too) kind of hated Ford for taking over Jaguar, and Ford/Jaguar got punished for it with bad sales figures.
I worked for Ford (Cologne, Germany) and Jaguar (Coventry). and while Ford is not perfect (resisting the "journey" towards less fuel efficient cars and newer transmissions (e.g. putting the very old Fiesta engine into the Focus - and only adding a bit of shiny metal on the top to make it look shiny, and kind of the same for transmissions)), you cannot fault Ford for not doing everything for making cars more reliable. FMEAs were a big thing at Ford/Jaguar. Plenty of road-test before official sales. I myself drove way more than 1000km with a Ford Puma in my spare time in1997/8 to road-test it before it gets offered for sale. And that is only on top of testing the carts at Proving Grounds - the Lommel Proving Ground was one of them:
https://www.fordlpg.com/en/indexjs.h...in_act_dur.htm
Lommel is in Belgium. I drove there from Ford in Cologne to interview the guys there, who tested the "pascars" (test cars, models not released yet).
Ford takes feedback from garages/repair shops serious and it constantly does improvements based upon the feedback they are getting. Ford stuffed many millions into improved manufacturing processes at Jaguar, but the public did not see it...
The end of the story was that "the public" actually punished itself by attempting to punish Ford with bad sales figures: Ford was forced to sell Jaguar at a loss to an Indian car-maker (Tata) at around 2010. I for one will not put up my hand for when any Indian Jaguar is up for sale...
PS:
I only just stumbled over a news feed - apparently I am not alone in my feelings regarding an Indian Jaguar:JLR posts £524 million loss after slow production ramp-up
Jaguar Land Rover has posted a loss of £524 million for the first quarter of the 2023 financial year, as it continues to suffer the impacts of the global semiconductor shortage and Covid lockdowns.
The Tata-owned British company sold 78,825 new cars from April to June – a drop of around 46,000 year on year, representing a 37% drop.
That said Ford became more homogenized. The X type was a Ford Contour (though some love them) and the X350 from 2004 on looked like a fat Taurus IMO. The Tata cars don't even look like Jaguars. Yet in the sweet spot, 1995-2003 they revived the brand and made cars with old school charm and modern tech. Seemed like the perfect blend which is why I love these cars.
#25
08-30-2023, 02:04 AM
Veteran Member
Indeed, anduha!
> ... plastic. It's cheaper.
Sad, but true - in many cases and places.
> ....better have some know how or some cash. But this is the case for ANY 20-25 year old luxury car that isn't a Lexus or Acura.
Ok, I never hear of Acura, but googled that it is the luxury version of Honda. But yes: My mechanic said, when I asked him what car to buy: "What is it that you cannot spell on Toyota?" And Lexus - I know that - is the luxury brand of Toyota. However, I will never understand that kind of brain-damage the Lexus designer had, who came up with the Lexus Century: The Century is the only V12 Lexus/Toyota, and it is pretty much the most ugly car I have ever seen.
Yes, Ford really tried to let Jaguar be Jaguar, but the press destroyed it (like many things). Btw.: Jaguar before Ford planned already an S-Type revival, and Ford then but a stop to the idea, only to give it the green light anyway. The new S-Type was indeed a JAGUAR idea.
As said: I worked on the X400 (X-Type), but I never heard anything about "Contour", but I just googled it and apparently you call the Mondeo "Contour" in the US.
Yes, that WAS the idea, to make a Jaguar affordable to a wider customer base, by basing it on the Ford Mondeo CD132, but that basic idea concept backfired in almost every corner - it was just not possible, so that it ended up to be a Jaguar in the end anyway and not a Ford. Talking about the electrical design of the X400 light-switch, which was my responsibility: Carry-over from the CD132 was the idea, but nothing was left of the idea, as the CD132 design did not allow for the high current requirement the X400 had on the switch: It was mainly the HID headlight, which killed the carry-over idea. And like that it was in many departments, but the press killed it off anyway. But I do not only want to defend the X400, I also have some criticism on the X400, based upon all those shortcomings, I see now when fixing up my X-Types: Many things seemed to have been designed with the explicit intention that it is not fixable (not for a reasonable price anyway), when faulty, and it is designed to get faulty...
> The Tata cars don't even look like Jaguars.
I totally agree: A Jag needs quad-headlights to start with, which is what I also invested into aftermarket quad-headlights for my XJS. The fish-tanks just don't do it for me.
> Yet in the sweet spot, 1995-2003 they revived the brand and made cars with old school charm and modern tech. Seemed like the perfect blend
> which is why I love these cars.
...and which is why I started buying and collecting Jags in 2020. It all started with a Ford Fairlane spare-wheel for sale on facebook from a nice old bloke here around the corner: We drove there, it turned out he preferred to sell the whole car for AU$400. It did not start anymore. I agreed to buy it, bought a fuel pump on ebay, put it into the car at his place, and drove it home. It was better then the red Fairlane we had. But my wife hated that the new Fairlane was white. And repaint was also not in her imagination. Hence, we looked for what else facebook-marketplace had to offer and I saw the green 2.1L X-Type - the car I worked on back then - I fixed it up and from there the collection grew. Latest count: 11 cars, 8 of them Jags.
> ... plastic. It's cheaper.
Sad, but true - in many cases and places.
> ....better have some know how or some cash. But this is the case for ANY 20-25 year old luxury car that isn't a Lexus or Acura.
Ok, I never hear of Acura, but googled that it is the luxury version of Honda. But yes: My mechanic said, when I asked him what car to buy: "What is it that you cannot spell on Toyota?" And Lexus - I know that - is the luxury brand of Toyota. However, I will never understand that kind of brain-damage the Lexus designer had, who came up with the Lexus Century: The Century is the only V12 Lexus/Toyota, and it is pretty much the most ugly car I have ever seen.
Yes, Ford really tried to let Jaguar be Jaguar, but the press destroyed it (like many things). Btw.: Jaguar before Ford planned already an S-Type revival, and Ford then but a stop to the idea, only to give it the green light anyway. The new S-Type was indeed a JAGUAR idea.
As said: I worked on the X400 (X-Type), but I never heard anything about "Contour", but I just googled it and apparently you call the Mondeo "Contour" in the US.
Yes, that WAS the idea, to make a Jaguar affordable to a wider customer base, by basing it on the Ford Mondeo CD132, but that basic idea concept backfired in almost every corner - it was just not possible, so that it ended up to be a Jaguar in the end anyway and not a Ford. Talking about the electrical design of the X400 light-switch, which was my responsibility: Carry-over from the CD132 was the idea, but nothing was left of the idea, as the CD132 design did not allow for the high current requirement the X400 had on the switch: It was mainly the HID headlight, which killed the carry-over idea. And like that it was in many departments, but the press killed it off anyway. But I do not only want to defend the X400, I also have some criticism on the X400, based upon all those shortcomings, I see now when fixing up my X-Types: Many things seemed to have been designed with the explicit intention that it is not fixable (not for a reasonable price anyway), when faulty, and it is designed to get faulty...
> The Tata cars don't even look like Jaguars.
I totally agree: A Jag needs quad-headlights to start with, which is what I also invested into aftermarket quad-headlights for my XJS. The fish-tanks just don't do it for me.
> Yet in the sweet spot, 1995-2003 they revived the brand and made cars with old school charm and modern tech. Seemed like the perfect blend
> which is why I love these cars.
...and which is why I started buying and collecting Jags in 2020. It all started with a Ford Fairlane spare-wheel for sale on facebook from a nice old bloke here around the corner: We drove there, it turned out he preferred to sell the whole car for AU$400. It did not start anymore. I agreed to buy it, bought a fuel pump on ebay, put it into the car at his place, and drove it home. It was better then the red Fairlane we had. But my wife hated that the new Fairlane was white. And repaint was also not in her imagination. Hence, we looked for what else facebook-marketplace had to offer and I saw the green 2.1L X-Type - the car I worked on back then - I fixed it up and from there the collection grew. Latest count: 11 cars, 8 of them Jags.
#26
08-30-2023, 08:41 AM
Mercedes MADE better cars. Prior to their merger with Chrysler they made tanks. That's why it isn't unusual to see an 80's turbodiesel still chugging along. Since the early 2000's it's been downhill. The parts are no cheaper even for newer cars. BMW engines these days are lucky to make it to 100K, they're garbage. Tons of XJ owners on this forum have taken theirs well over 200K without rebuilds. Things like bushings and ball joints wear out on any car after 25 years. Many engines even today from BMW, MB, Ford have timing chain issues because... plastic. It's cheaper. Timing chains are a known issue and if taken care of are not an issue for the life of the car.
True, if you buy an old luxury car you better have some know how or some cash. But this is the case for ANY 20-25 year old luxury car that isn't a Lexus or Acura. However I have been surprised at how reliable the Jaguars I bought have been, well beyond 100K. I'm sorry if your experience has been negative but nothing looks or drives like the Jags. If I wanted boring and bulletproof I'd buy an old Camry.
True, if you buy an old luxury car you better have some know how or some cash. But this is the case for ANY 20-25 year old luxury car that isn't a Lexus or Acura. However I have been surprised at how reliable the Jaguars I bought have been, well beyond 100K. I'm sorry if your experience has been negative but nothing looks or drives like the Jags. If I wanted boring and bulletproof I'd buy an old Camry.
I still suggest to make sticky at the forum warn college kids and someone wants buy their first car to not fall for the beauty only retired millionaire must own this car
#27
08-30-2023, 09:35 AM
I did work on bmw's their straight inline 6 cylinder is bullet proof and it's also used on the new Toyota supra Mercedes still make better car and it's the most reliable European car maker . Of course our cars are classic and fun to drive but it fails you can't rely on it that's the main problem I beat my 20+ years Subaru STI and it needs nothing except oil change and it's fun to drive after years of owning jaguar I honestly wouldn't touch any jaguar no matter what is it xtype or s or e or any other model they're going bankrupt probably
I still suggest to make sticky at the forum warn college kids and someone wants buy their first car to not fall for the beauty only retired millionaire must own this car
I still suggest to make sticky at the forum warn college kids and someone wants buy their first car to not fall for the beauty only retired millionaire must own this car
#28
08-30-2023, 09:43 AM
Indeed, anduha!
> ... plastic. It's cheaper.
Sad, but true - in many cases and places.
> ....better have some know how or some cash. But this is the case for ANY 20-25 year old luxury car that isn't a Lexus or Acura.
Ok, I never hear of Acura, but googled that it is the luxury version of Honda. But yes: My mechanic said, when I asked him what car to buy: "What is it that you cannot spell on Toyota?" And Lexus - I know that - is the luxury brand of Toyota. However, I will never understand that kind of brain-damage the Lexus designer had, who came up with the Lexus Century: The Century is the only V12 Lexus/Toyota, and it is pretty much the most ugly car I have ever seen.
Yes, Ford really tried to let Jaguar be Jaguar, but the press destroyed it (like many things). Btw.: Jaguar before Ford planned already an S-Type revival, and Ford then but a stop to the idea, only to give it the green light anyway. The new S-Type was indeed a JAGUAR idea.
As said: I worked on the X400 (X-Type), but I never heard anything about "Contour", but I just googled it and apparently you call the Mondeo "Contour" in the US.
Yes, that WAS the idea, to make a Jaguar affordable to a wider customer base, by basing it on the Ford Mondeo CD132, but that basic idea concept backfired in almost every corner - it was just not possible, so that it ended up to be a Jaguar in the end anyway and not a Ford. Talking about the electrical design of the X400 light-switch, which was my responsibility: Carry-over from the CD132 was the idea, but nothing was left of the idea, as the CD132 design did not allow for the high current requirement the X400 had on the switch: It was mainly the HID headlight, which killed the carry-over idea. And like that it was in many departments, but the press killed it off anyway. But I do not only want to defend the X400, I also have some criticism on the X400, based upon all those shortcomings, I see now when fixing up my X-Types: Many things seemed to have been designed with the explicit intention that it is not fixable (not for a reasonable price anyway), when faulty, and it is designed to get faulty...
> The Tata cars don't even look like Jaguars.
I totally agree: A Jag needs quad-headlights to start with, which is what I also invested into aftermarket quad-headlights for my XJS. The fish-tanks just don't do it for me.
> Yet in the sweet spot, 1995-2003 they revived the brand and made cars with old school charm and modern tech. Seemed like the perfect blend
> which is why I love these cars.
...and which is why I started buying and collecting Jags in 2020. It all started with a Ford Fairlane spare-wheel for sale on facebook from a nice old bloke here around the corner: We drove there, it turned out he preferred to sell the whole car for AU$400. It did not start anymore. I agreed to buy it, bought a fuel pump on ebay, put it into the car at his place, and drove it home. It was better then the red Fairlane we had. But my wife hated that the new Fairlane was white. And repaint was also not in her imagination. Hence, we looked for what else facebook-marketplace had to offer and I saw the green 2.1L X-Type - the car I worked on back then - I fixed it up and from there the collection grew. Latest count: 11 cars, 8 of them Jags.
> ... plastic. It's cheaper.
Sad, but true - in many cases and places.
> ....better have some know how or some cash. But this is the case for ANY 20-25 year old luxury car that isn't a Lexus or Acura.
Ok, I never hear of Acura, but googled that it is the luxury version of Honda. But yes: My mechanic said, when I asked him what car to buy: "What is it that you cannot spell on Toyota?" And Lexus - I know that - is the luxury brand of Toyota. However, I will never understand that kind of brain-damage the Lexus designer had, who came up with the Lexus Century: The Century is the only V12 Lexus/Toyota, and it is pretty much the most ugly car I have ever seen.
Yes, Ford really tried to let Jaguar be Jaguar, but the press destroyed it (like many things). Btw.: Jaguar before Ford planned already an S-Type revival, and Ford then but a stop to the idea, only to give it the green light anyway. The new S-Type was indeed a JAGUAR idea.
As said: I worked on the X400 (X-Type), but I never heard anything about "Contour", but I just googled it and apparently you call the Mondeo "Contour" in the US.
Yes, that WAS the idea, to make a Jaguar affordable to a wider customer base, by basing it on the Ford Mondeo CD132, but that basic idea concept backfired in almost every corner - it was just not possible, so that it ended up to be a Jaguar in the end anyway and not a Ford. Talking about the electrical design of the X400 light-switch, which was my responsibility: Carry-over from the CD132 was the idea, but nothing was left of the idea, as the CD132 design did not allow for the high current requirement the X400 had on the switch: It was mainly the HID headlight, which killed the carry-over idea. And like that it was in many departments, but the press killed it off anyway. But I do not only want to defend the X400, I also have some criticism on the X400, based upon all those shortcomings, I see now when fixing up my X-Types: Many things seemed to have been designed with the explicit intention that it is not fixable (not for a reasonable price anyway), when faulty, and it is designed to get faulty...
> The Tata cars don't even look like Jaguars.
I totally agree: A Jag needs quad-headlights to start with, which is what I also invested into aftermarket quad-headlights for my XJS. The fish-tanks just don't do it for me.
> Yet in the sweet spot, 1995-2003 they revived the brand and made cars with old school charm and modern tech. Seemed like the perfect blend
> which is why I love these cars.
...and which is why I started buying and collecting Jags in 2020. It all started with a Ford Fairlane spare-wheel for sale on facebook from a nice old bloke here around the corner: We drove there, it turned out he preferred to sell the whole car for AU$400. It did not start anymore. I agreed to buy it, bought a fuel pump on ebay, put it into the car at his place, and drove it home. It was better then the red Fairlane we had. But my wife hated that the new Fairlane was white. And repaint was also not in her imagination. Hence, we looked for what else facebook-marketplace had to offer and I saw the green 2.1L X-Type - the car I worked on back then - I fixed it up and from there the collection grew. Latest count: 11 cars, 8 of them Jags.
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