I have a Gearbox Cooler Pipe leak that's been annoying for some time, from what I can find searching the Forum this is a fairly common problem with the pipe(s) rubbing against the sub-frame? I have got a second hand pair of Gearbox Oil Cooler pipes, in good condition, no visible leaks, though I have no proof they are ‘good’.

Without clouding this Post with other issues and reasons, I decided to remove the engine to replace the gearbox, due to access this gave me the ideal opportunity to resolve the cooler pipe leak.

Previously, I followed the advice of searching the Forum, and came across a Post where someone had been very clever and fixed a similar cooler pipe leak by fitting a braided flexible hydraulic hose. The hose was attached using AN fittings to the radiator end, and gearbox end, by cutting off the pipes about 10cm at either end. Then the flexible braided hoses were routed through to the gearbox bypassing the original pipe and obviously the leak. Again before deciding to change the gearbox, I purchased a set of the AN fittings and the braided hose, the lady who owns the company selling these parts remembered the guy on the Forum, and knew exactly what I needed.

Radiator end



Gearbox end


My question is:
1. Do I stick to original and replace the damaged ones with the second hand pair of pipes, and try and route the pipes so they don’t foul against the sub-frame again …. or
2. Do I use the AN fittings and braided hose, bypass where they would normally ‘rub’ against the sub-frame, and cure the problem forever?

The first option could result in damage again in the future I guess, unless there’s room for moving/manipulating the original pipes to miss the sub-frame. The second option eliminates the problem, and although makes it easier should it require ever needing to be done again, it is not original and visibly obvious when you look under the hood/bonnet?

Always welcome advice from anyone with experience with this, and any opinions?

Paul

 

I think you know that answer my friend, ....you've already purchased the fix and I wouldn't worry about it being obvious. You own the car, you drive it, if someone asks, tell them what you told us...its the fix for an unforeseen engineering issue you came up with. If you are that concerned about the braided hose, any hydraulic hose repair place can make you one that looks more factory. Just take that to them and they'll duplicate it with black hosing and mill finish couplings.

 

Yep, must admit the braided hose has its attractions. I just thought I would run it past a few people and see what they thought.

I'm not too bothered about the braided hose, I could always paint it black with an aerosol, and the couplings for that matter, but you know how some owners don't like changing from original?

Many thanks for your quick reply :-)

 

It's a mod on a car that makes it more usable and more reliable. These cars aren't rare so DO IT! I love the stock look of my cars, but am happy to perform mods whenever they improve reliability, longevity, or do a better/similar job to OEM at less money.

I've put heatshrink over braided hoses before to prevent chafing things like tires (braided brake hose), and it has the effect of making it black as well. I wouldn't go the paint route, but you could put wire harness coverings over it. They make braided black nylon, the black plastic with ribs or just plain black like motorcycles have for their harnesses. They make kinds that slip over existing and you can zip tie it on, that's great if removing the item is a lot of work. I like that route since it looks more polished.

If you have more than like 50k miles, long term collectors are not interested in the car anyway. If you don't have a rare special edition, and not just a badge engineered SE, but a performance or demonstrated rarity difference special edition; they likely aren't interested. I'm not trying to be down on your car, mine definitely aren't collectable. I'm saying that you need to have fun! It's a burden removed from you, you can use it and enjoy it. It's freeing .

 

I'd leave it with the fittings and braided hose unless there's a particular reliability reason not to. If the bright ano'd colors bother you, like others have said, wrap it in some tech-flex and call it a day. Looks like it's right near the sway bar though so it's not like it's sticking out of the engine each time you open the hood.

 

Many thanks for the replies on here, and the private messages. I've received mixed views but, that was what I was hoping for so I would have a good cross section of opinion to help me decide the best route for me.

Not having the luxury of a lift available, working mostly on the concrete floor with the car jacked and on stands ...this job isn't not easy. So, after listening, reading, weighing up the options, I've decided to go Braided Hose, covering the hose with some heat-shrink or similar, so the job is more permanent. Also going to paint the anodised joints black, just to take away the obviousness.

I'll take some pictures and cost it out, putting the results on the Forum so others have a good idea of the options available.

Anyone want a set of good 2nd hand original cooler pipes ...buckshee?

 

Being an NCRS member and card carrying member of OCD Anonymous, you might be shocked but I absolutely agree. There are certain cars where keeping it original makes sense from the standpoint of maximizing future resale value, but in most cases it doesn't.

Still, I personally feel it necessary to preserve at least some mass market cars as original purely for posterity rather than any economic value. If you feel that way too, just box up and label all the original parts that you remove and pass them along with the car when you ultimately sell it or bequeath it to your heirs. You've already sourced a stock replacement, which would be all that much harder to find 30 years from now when some restorer wishes to take on your Jaguar as a project. So I'd say, as long as you're just gonna keep driving it, just use the braided hose, but hold onto the stock part for posterity.

 

Anything that improves performance or reliability of a car is a win with me. I have absolutely no problem with using performance, race or aviation grade parts on my car if it will solve or prevent a problem. I've seen those braided pipes in a black finish, and I also know there are covers available for them so if you were concerned about how it looks, there are ways around it. I did the exact same thing for my old 2001 Sovereign, the cost of having the pipe made was a lot less than a new one and 100% better.

 

Thanks pdupler & stu 1986. I agree with you both, my car is never going to be a concourse show-off car, so why worry so long as the braided hose gives me the fix required and it's working 'better' than before? I had made the same decision, but I like the idea of boxing up the original part, and keeping it, who knows, in years to come these parts I'm storing may become a rarity and valuable?

Stu 1986: Where would I look for the covers you mention for the connections? I have a colleague that works for the UK company that supply AN fittings, should I start there?

 

These can be pricey sometimes, but here's a hose covering product that may interest you or give you an idea... Cleaning Up The Engine Bay With Hose Candy - Rod Authority

 

Those particular lines are a real pita - I've seen serious botch jobs with them.
Replacing them with the engine installed is akin to making Salade Nicoise in your jacket pocket.
Alloy lines, going into alloy trans with alloy slip bolt is for advanced tech install, they're completely unforgiving of a crossed thread.
So this upgrade HAS to be better, I wouldn't even try and hide the fixings, but just puff satin black round.

 

So, the engine's out, (BTW, searching the Forum I found some great advice on getting it out, worked like a charm, particular thanks to Sean B on that).

Here's the offending article


Where the pipe has been rubbing against the sub-frame, is clear, there's 3 or so small holes where the tranny fluid was leaking. Once the engine was out, I was able to find the original problem. There's a small bracket, that should hold both pipes snug to the engine block, and mine was missing because the small bolt fastening the bracket to the engine had been snapped off, and judging by the look of it, it had been snapped off for some time.

Whoever had the car when the bold was snapped had tie wrapped the pipes together, but they weren't anywhere near the engine block and fouled against the sub-frame instead.

Some other jobs to do now in the engine bay, including the braided hose mods. Then the gearbox which, I think is damaged due to it being run with a lack of oil in it. I believe this damage was done before I even got the car, as one of the things I first did was to change the gearbox oil filter, and I found some fairly sized pieces of sharp metal on the magnet in the bottom of the oil pan.

I have had lots of advice regarding the rumbling I get through the car at 50mph, and lots say it could be the Torque Converter, so with all the other work I've done, i'm taking the plunge on another gearbox inc. the Torque.

I'll post some pics of the braided hose mod when done, but if anyone has some ideas to improve anything while have the big lump out of the car, your ideas are very welcome.

 

Vibration at 50? ....have you checked your flex discs on the driveshaft?

 

Many thanks for the reply Highhorse. Yes, the Jurid couplings have been checked along with a complete refurb of the whole rear suspension, drive axle joints, discs, bearings, bushes, shocks, springs... the lot, very similar on the front suspension too. The rumbling that existed before all that work still remains. While the engine is out I will be changing the 2 Jurid couplings anyway, after this goes back in the only thing left is the Differential that hasn't had any work on it.

I did post a thread regarding the rumbling that's separate to this thread, just about everything I did under the car is in that (long) post.

 

While the engine is out, have a look at the engine mounts. Still attached to the engine? These things wear out, split and drop the damping fluid.
Heater valley hoses, timing gear uprated? Also the general Thermo tower in alloy and waterpump, yours may have the black impeller - the later white impeller pump is the one to fit.
I'd recommend cleaning the earth posts and contacts for reinstall on the engine harness.
With a replacement trans - do the Transgo valve kit along with fluid & filter.

 

Hi Sean B, thanks for your suggestions.

Coolant tower, Tensioners & Guides: The tower is the metal one, changed when I did a valve timing upgrade including the tensioners and guides, and new water pump. One interesting point, (for another post maybe), is that I have a full service history showing that the timing chain guides were replaced for the upgraded ones sometime ago, but when I did them recently, one of the guides was cracked? As I say, maybe room for another post at some point?
Valley pipes: Checked and Ok when I fitted new Knock Sensors but will check again before re-installing the engine.

Not much to see, but here's the lump in the garage:-


Engine mounts, bang on, they are still connected to the engine as I took your advice and removed the Torx headed bolt from underneath. I admit to not knowing how to check the mounts, I didn't notice them being 'wet' from dropping any fluid, but the gearbox/rear engine mount seemed worn, not sure if that could affect/cause the rumble at 50mph? Any help on what to look for would be appreciated?

Jurid couplings 'appear' to be Ok, and will do the earth posts, great idea.

Transgo Valve Kit: Really interested to know more about this, what is it and what does it do, and where would I get one? Again I admit I've never heard or seen anything about this? New Filter and Oil on the list already for the new box.

This feedback is invaluable, many thanks to all helpers

 

RE: TransGo valve kit - you may know that the gearboxes on these cars can wear, specifically the solenoid valve block bore gets a shoulder on it. The pressure valve binds on this step and leads to over pressure - then a bang into gear - a couple of these high pressure shifts busts a circlip that holds the A drum leading to the outer edge of the A drum getting damaged. A gearbox fault is then logged and restricted performance. A rebuild is in order at this point. Sometimes the valve body is also cracked.
To avoid this issue a company in the USA has produced a valve/seal kit that corrects the wear, once fitted it will prolong the life of the trans.
For >$100 it's a 'no brainer' and many guys on here have fitted them as a preventative measure, along with full fluid change and filter.
Here's one...
TransGo 5HP-24-PR Pressure Regulator Valve Repair Kit ZF 5HP24 A BMW Audi Jaguar | eBay

 

Thanks Sean B yet again, as you point out, for around $100 it's a no brainer. And thanks for the link too, I 'll get on with getting one sent as I guess it will take a while to get here.

 

It really is. I've owned 2 cars with ZF 5HP24 variants in them, a BMW 740i and an Audi A4 2.8 Quattro. Both had the transmissions fail prematurely compared to other transmissions of the same era. This kit does help if you have a NA X308 or NA 4.0L X100.

I've used transgo in other makes and models, it's a great company.

 

I've been working on the engine/gearbox as said earlier in this thread, I thought that while the engine and box are out I would do some cleaning up and detailing, here's a few pictures of my progress.

Here's the engine/box before:




And after:






And with the new gearbox fitted: