rear differential fluid type
#1
06-15-2015, 01:09 PM
rear differential fluid type
What is an acceptable off the shelf replacement gear oil for the rear differential on a 99 XJ8L? What weight for the oil? I have some bottles of Lucas 80W90 from another car, nut sure if this is OK for the Jaguar. I'm just going to pump the old stuff out and new oil in, but can't seem to find this info.
Thanks
Thanks
#2
06-15-2015, 04:01 PM
What is an acceptable off the shelf replacement gear oil for the rear differential on a 99 XJ8L? What weight for the oil? I have some bottles of Lucas 80W90 from another car, nut sure if this is OK for the Jaguar. I'm just going to pump the old stuff out and new oil in, but can't seem to find this info.
Thanks
Thanks
Valvoline SynPower full synthetic 75W-140 which meets M2C-192A and GL-5
The following users liked this post:
Roldano (10-02-2019)
#4
06-16-2015, 05:49 AM
Jaguar specifications for differential oil is to meet specifically "M2C-192A - Synthetic" referencing Jaguar documentation, JJM 10 34 99/40, and by the time that the X350 was released Jaguar had specified weight as 75W-140.
Per TSB;
Technical Service Bulletin
No.JagA100-0004
13 December 2004
Final Drive Recommended Lubricants
Differential Differential Transfer Case
Recommended fluids Shell Spirax Super TS90 M2C 192A Synthetic; M2C 192A Synthetic
Model Service Fill Specification Shell Spirax Super TS91 M2C 192A Synthetic; M2C-192A Synthetic
VIN Range From Up to
XJ
3.2/4.0 N/A 812317 878273 ×
3.2/4.0 N/A 878274 F59525 ×
4.0 SC 812317 878273 ×
4.0 SC 878274 F59525 ×
3.0, 3.5, 4.2 N/A G00442 current ×
XK
4.0 V8 N/A 001246 042634 ×
4.0 V8 N/A 042635 A30644 ×
4.0 V8 SC 024687 042634 ×
4.0 V8 SC 042635 A30644 ×
4.2 V8 N/A and SC A30645 current ×
S-TYPE
3.0/4.0 L00600 L86901 ×
3.0/4.0 L86902 M45254 ×
2.5/3.0/4.2 N/A and SC M45255 current ×
X-TYPE
2.5/3.0 V6 C00344 current × ×
2.0 V6 C00344 current
2.0 Diesel D55324 current
Per TSB;
Technical Service Bulletin
No.JagA100-0004
13 December 2004
Final Drive Recommended Lubricants
Differential Differential Transfer Case
Recommended fluids Shell Spirax Super TS90 M2C 192A Synthetic; M2C 192A Synthetic
Model Service Fill Specification Shell Spirax Super TS91 M2C 192A Synthetic; M2C-192A Synthetic
VIN Range From Up to
XJ
3.2/4.0 N/A 812317 878273 ×
3.2/4.0 N/A 878274 F59525 ×
4.0 SC 812317 878273 ×
4.0 SC 878274 F59525 ×
3.0, 3.5, 4.2 N/A G00442 current ×
XK
4.0 V8 N/A 001246 042634 ×
4.0 V8 N/A 042635 A30644 ×
4.0 V8 SC 024687 042634 ×
4.0 V8 SC 042635 A30644 ×
4.2 V8 N/A and SC A30645 current ×
S-TYPE
3.0/4.0 L00600 L86901 ×
3.0/4.0 L86902 M45254 ×
2.5/3.0/4.2 N/A and SC M45255 current ×
X-TYPE
2.5/3.0 V6 C00344 current × ×
2.0 V6 C00344 current
2.0 Diesel D55324 current
Last edited by Box; 06-16-2015 at 06:44 AM.
The following 2 users liked this post by Box:
Roldano (10-02-2019),
someguywithajag (02-19-2019)
#5
06-16-2015, 09:13 AM
Veteran Member
supersedes?
Thank you for taking the time to answer. I find all of this confusing and appreciate the information. The specifications pdf I downloaded as a reference (see picture) lists a JLM 20255 (shell spirax superr ts90) for my car (x308) and lists the JLM 20117 (M2C 192A synthetic) for my wife's car (x350). When I look those up it "appears" that the JLM 20255 is a 75w 90 and the JLM 20117 is a 75w 140.
So, what do I take from this? Well, it appears that the TSB you posted is more current and now they recommend using the 75w 140 in the x308 as well, rather than the 75w 90 that came originally.
Or, I could be reading EVERYTHING wrong and they never recommended the 75w 90 in the first place.
Is my trail of logic, well....logical? haha -- thanks.
So, what do I take from this? Well, it appears that the TSB you posted is more current and now they recommend using the 75w 140 in the x308 as well, rather than the 75w 90 that came originally.
Or, I could be reading EVERYTHING wrong and they never recommended the 75w 90 in the first place.
Is my trail of logic, well....logical? haha -- thanks.
#6
06-16-2015, 05:52 PM
Thank you for taking the time to answer. I find all of this confusing and appreciate the information. The specifications pdf I downloaded as a reference (see picture) lists a JLM 20255 (shell spirax superr ts90) for my car (x308) and lists the JLM 20117 (M2C 192A synthetic) for my wife's car (x350). When I look those up it "appears" that the JLM 20255 is a 75w 90 and the JLM 20117 is a 75w 140.
So, what do I take from this? Well, it appears that the TSB you posted is more current and now they recommend using the 75w 140 in the x308 as well, rather than the 75w 90 that came originally.
Or, I could be reading EVERYTHING wrong and they never recommended the 75w 90 in the first place.
Is my trail of logic, well....logical? haha -- thanks.
So, what do I take from this? Well, it appears that the TSB you posted is more current and now they recommend using the 75w 140 in the x308 as well, rather than the 75w 90 that came originally.
Or, I could be reading EVERYTHING wrong and they never recommended the 75w 90 in the first place.
Is my trail of logic, well....logical? haha -- thanks.
Concerning what was the car shipped with in 1998, Spirax was 80W-90 GL-3. Now we have GL-5 and viscosities that are much broader and better protection.
#7
06-16-2015, 06:59 PM
Veteran Member
The Spirax Super TS90 refers to a Thermally Stable 90 weight GL-5 according to old references that can be found by using a search engine.
GL-3 never entered the picture and the S-Type/X350 use a completely different differential.
Since the differential is a descendant of the DANA 44, some guidance from DANA
might be applicable.
I use Redline 80/140.
Red Line Synthetic Oil - Gear Oil for Differentials - 80W140 GL-5 Gear Oil
Shell Thermally Stable Super SAE90 GL-5 Advanced high quality oil for Limited Slip Differentials.
Shell Thermally Stable Super 90 is a premium quality LSD performance axle oil specifically formulated to meet the frictional and high temperature requirements of Dana Spicer axles.
Automotive Axles
Thermally Stable Super 90 is uniquely developed by Shell and Dana Spicer to provide optimum performance in rear axle systems. It has been specifically designed for automotive rear axle systems requiring LSD performance, combined with excellent friction and high temperature properties. Extensive field trials have been carried out on this product resulting in sole approval for initial and service fill in Jaguar models and a number of other UK OEMs using these axles. It is the exclusive Factory and Service Fill axle oil for the following models, Jaguar XJR, XJ, XK and XKR.
Reduced power loss:
Thermally Stable Super 90 has been developed in close cooperation with Dana Spicer in the U.K., to reduce friction and significantly increase power transmission yield. Superior Lubricant Life:
Thermally Stable Super 90 has been specifically formulated to provide long life even under the most severe operating conditions and high operating temperatures, providing for even greater gear protection.
Extended Gear Life Performance:
Thermally Stable Super 90 has been developed specifically to allow for superior gear
protection in the following areas:
* Anti-Pitting
* Shear Stability
* Fretting Performance
These performance characteristics provide the best in gear protection and performance, which maximize the designed gearbox life when used for top up and fluid changes.
* API Service Classification GL-5
* Jaguar Part No JLM 20237
* Unipart Part No 900687
Shell Thermally Stable Super 90 is a premium quality LSD performance axle oil specifically formulated to meet the frictional and high temperature requirements of Dana Spicer axles.
Automotive Axles
Thermally Stable Super 90 is uniquely developed by Shell and Dana Spicer to provide optimum performance in rear axle systems. It has been specifically designed for automotive rear axle systems requiring LSD performance, combined with excellent friction and high temperature properties. Extensive field trials have been carried out on this product resulting in sole approval for initial and service fill in Jaguar models and a number of other UK OEMs using these axles. It is the exclusive Factory and Service Fill axle oil for the following models, Jaguar XJR, XJ, XK and XKR.
Reduced power loss:
Thermally Stable Super 90 has been developed in close cooperation with Dana Spicer in the U.K., to reduce friction and significantly increase power transmission yield. Superior Lubricant Life:
Thermally Stable Super 90 has been specifically formulated to provide long life even under the most severe operating conditions and high operating temperatures, providing for even greater gear protection.
Extended Gear Life Performance:
Thermally Stable Super 90 has been developed specifically to allow for superior gear
protection in the following areas:
* Anti-Pitting
* Shear Stability
* Fretting Performance
These performance characteristics provide the best in gear protection and performance, which maximize the designed gearbox life when used for top up and fluid changes.
* API Service Classification GL-5
* Jaguar Part No JLM 20237
* Unipart Part No 900687
Since the differential is a descendant of the DANA 44, some guidance from DANA
might be applicable.
I use Redline 80/140.
Red Line Synthetic Oil - Gear Oil for Differentials - 80W140 GL-5 Gear Oil
Trending Topics
#8
06-16-2015, 08:02 PM
Veteran Member
So, I followed most of that.
I think I understand that there are general quality improvements in newer fluids over older ones, and that there are several good alternatives that ALL meet the basic requirements.
The only newbie question I think I have left is "Is there no significant disadvantage in using a thicker fluid verses the original?".
When I changed the Diff fluid in my BMW I thought of using a 75w-140 instead of the stock 75w-90 that came in the car; thinking the added protection would be good for an older differential (over 200k miles). I was advised that using a thicker fluid would create more work for the engine (reduced power transfer) and possibly cause temperature problems. I don't know how much truth was in that, but to play it safe I went with the original weight that came in the car (used Redline).
Obviously many smart, experienced, veteran Jaguar owners are using the 140 in their x308 vehicles in all variations, therefore my inclination is to just buy the Redline 80w-140 and be done with it.
Does anyone think those above mentioned arguments regarding reduced power and increased heat with 140 verses 90 have any validity?
Thanks
The only newbie question I think I have left is "Is there no significant disadvantage in using a thicker fluid verses the original?".
When I changed the Diff fluid in my BMW I thought of using a 75w-140 instead of the stock 75w-90 that came in the car; thinking the added protection would be good for an older differential (over 200k miles). I was advised that using a thicker fluid would create more work for the engine (reduced power transfer) and possibly cause temperature problems. I don't know how much truth was in that, but to play it safe I went with the original weight that came in the car (used Redline).
Obviously many smart, experienced, veteran Jaguar owners are using the 140 in their x308 vehicles in all variations, therefore my inclination is to just buy the Redline 80w-140 and be done with it.
Does anyone think those above mentioned arguments regarding reduced power and increased heat with 140 verses 90 have any validity?
Thanks
#9
06-17-2015, 02:31 AM
Veteran Member
In today's world any good quality full syn GL-5 75-9- or 75-140
is perfectly acceptable.
The only reason you would ned to use the heavier weight in a 308 diff
is if you give a good old caning ;o))
#10
06-17-2015, 07:59 PM
Veteran Member
So 75w-90 came in the car. Modern day 75w-90 or 80w-140 are equally acceptable, BUT heavier oil is not necessary? Maybe I need some oil 101 classes. Isn't 80w-140 thicker (heavier) than the stock 75w-90?
Sorry to require that it all be broken down for me. Contrary to what may be perceived in this thread, I am fairly well educated. Lol
Sorry to require that it all be broken down for me. Contrary to what may be perceived in this thread, I am fairly well educated. Lol
#11
06-17-2015, 08:27 PM
Veteran Member
Join Date: Nov 2006
Location: Glasgow, Scotland UK
Posts: 47,302
Received 9,011 Likes
on
4,114 Posts
Did this initially on my X358 and used 75-140 iirc
In actual fact did this once and then again about a few weeks later using the first fill as a flush of sorts as you'll never get all the old stuff out.
My diff was noisy and to be fair, on its way out, but this certainly helped to quieten things down, although a new diff / prop shaft etc was the order of the day for me in the end
In actual fact did this once and then again about a few weeks later using the first fill as a flush of sorts as you'll never get all the old stuff out.
My diff was noisy and to be fair, on its way out, but this certainly helped to quieten things down, although a new diff / prop shaft etc was the order of the day for me in the end
#12
06-17-2015, 10:12 PM
So 75w-90 came in the car. Modern day 75w-90 or 80w-140 are equally acceptable, BUT heavier oil is not necessary? Maybe I need some oil 101 classes. Isn't 80w-140 thicker (heavier) than the stock 75w-90?
Sorry to require that it all be broken down for me. Contrary to what may be perceived in this thread, I am fairly well educated. Lol
Sorry to require that it all be broken down for me. Contrary to what may be perceived in this thread, I am fairly well educated. Lol
What a modern multi-viscosity oil does is provide a much more stable viscosity index over a much broader range of temps. Think of it like this, we have 75 weight oil and at 40c it's viscosity is (arbitrary) 175 and at 100c it is 20. We need to provide at least a viscosity index of 50 or better for the protection we want, so cool 75 weight is great with an index of 175, but not at 100c. A 90 weight oil at 100c is only 35 and still doesn't meet what we are wanting, but a 140 weight at 100c is 65. So we use viscosity improvers to make the oil have a 140 viscosity at 100c, but it returns to 75 weight viscosity when cooler. Whomever advised you about your BMW really doesn't understand what they were telling you.
Last edited by Box; 06-18-2015 at 07:40 AM.
#13
06-18-2015, 05:47 AM
Shell's Spirax lubricants were designed for industrial uses, and the GL-3 spec used until the mid to late 90's was for transmission/final drive specs. My point was the T series fluid were originally designed for this purpose. GL-5 is hypoid use.
#15
06-23-2015, 05:44 PM
Veteran Member
practiced on my wife's car...
So today I changed the differential fluid in my wife's 2004 xj8 (x350) with 133,000 miles. I was pleasantly surprised by how easy the job turned out to be! Something rarely said in relation to that car.
I used Redline 75w-140 and did not jack the car up off the ground. I was able to remove the fill plug, pull out about 1.3 quarts of fluid and refill with a pump while just lying under the rear of the car (so I am thinking it was surely level?).
The surprise was that the unit was full already, and the fluid in there was dirty but not terrible. There was no terrible smell and only a thin coating of metal flecks on the magnet/full plug. The new fluid certainly looked better, but I think I was expecting to find a lot worse.
Anyway, so my plan is to get two more quarts of the same (Redline 75w-140) and perform this on my x308 on my day off next week. While it is several years older than her car it has about 36,000 less miles so I hope the differential fluid looks at least as good as it did in her car.
I used Redline 75w-140 and did not jack the car up off the ground. I was able to remove the fill plug, pull out about 1.3 quarts of fluid and refill with a pump while just lying under the rear of the car (so I am thinking it was surely level?).
The surprise was that the unit was full already, and the fluid in there was dirty but not terrible. There was no terrible smell and only a thin coating of metal flecks on the magnet/full plug. The new fluid certainly looked better, but I think I was expecting to find a lot worse.
Anyway, so my plan is to get two more quarts of the same (Redline 75w-140) and perform this on my x308 on my day off next week. While it is several years older than her car it has about 36,000 less miles so I hope the differential fluid looks at least as good as it did in her car.
#16
06-30-2015, 07:36 PM
Veteran Member
Did the x308 today.
So I changed the differential fluid in the 2001 XJ8 today (along with replacing the front upper shock mount bushings). This was decidedly more difficult than performing the differential service on my wife's 2004 XJ8 last week.
The fill plug is so difficult to access it's just silly. I don't back down from a good challenge though, so I manufactured a tool using parts from a broken 1/2 inch torque wrench and a ratcheting 15 mm box end wrench. Once the tool was invented, the service went fairly smoothy. The Redline website specified 75w-90 for my car and since I've been told any quality 75w-90 or 75w-140 will work, I went with the 75w-90 from Redline.
The fluid that came out was MUCH dirtier than what came out of my wife's car and the differential was even a little bit low, although not much (1.6 quarts came out, 1.8 quarts went in). Her car has 36,000 more miles so I was surprised that MY fluid was in worse shape. My car IS 3 years older and used a different "lifetime" fluid than hers, so I guess her "lifetime" fluid was better than mine.
I feel a great sense of relief that the filthy old fluid is out and it's up to the full level with new quality synthetic.
The fill plug is so difficult to access it's just silly. I don't back down from a good challenge though, so I manufactured a tool using parts from a broken 1/2 inch torque wrench and a ratcheting 15 mm box end wrench. Once the tool was invented, the service went fairly smoothy. The Redline website specified 75w-90 for my car and since I've been told any quality 75w-90 or 75w-140 will work, I went with the 75w-90 from Redline.
The fluid that came out was MUCH dirtier than what came out of my wife's car and the differential was even a little bit low, although not much (1.6 quarts came out, 1.8 quarts went in). Her car has 36,000 more miles so I was surprised that MY fluid was in worse shape. My car IS 3 years older and used a different "lifetime" fluid than hers, so I guess her "lifetime" fluid was better than mine.
I feel a great sense of relief that the filthy old fluid is out and it's up to the full level with new quality synthetic.
#17
06-30-2015, 10:06 PM
Veteran Member
Spirax is a generic Shell trademark for a lot of gear oils used in many
applications.
#18
06-30-2015, 10:10 PM
Veteran Member
#19
08-18-2015, 08:57 AM
Member
#20
05-18-2018, 01:14 PM
Junior Member
Join Date: May 2018
Location: Virginia
Posts: 3
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Hello,
I hope you can provide some guidance as I am trying to change my differential oil. I looked a the Technical Service bulletin you provided and it appears that my car is not on the list based on the last 6 digits of my VIN.
VIN: SAJPX1847WC851695.
Year: 1998
Model: Jaguar XJR
Any help would be appreciated. Thanks.
Best,
R
I hope you can provide some guidance as I am trying to change my differential oil. I looked a the Technical Service bulletin you provided and it appears that my car is not on the list based on the last 6 digits of my VIN.
VIN: SAJPX1847WC851695.
Year: 1998
Model: Jaguar XJR
Any help would be appreciated. Thanks.
Best,
R