Hey guys. So I inquired with Jaguar Parts Center about my engine number and here's what I got:

MESSAGE New Message Orginal Message: From: Christopher Chin Date: Monday, November 08 2010 02:35 AM Subject: Engine Number Lookup Order Number: Hi there. I read a post on JaguarForums where a member inquired about his engine number and came here asking for it, and was emailed it by JPC.

I would like to see if it was possible to look up my engine number.

My VIN is SAJDyadayadayadayada, and it is a MY2002 XJ Sport.

I would just like to know my Engine number so I can know whether my AJV8 has the third generation steel timing chain tensioners or the second generation plastic tensioners.

Thanks.

Chris Reply Sent:
From: Rick Witt Date: Monday, November 08 2010 07:48 AM Subject: RE: Engine Number Lookup Thanks for your inquiry.
The engine number as recorded by Jaguar Cars is LL0107050235. As built,it would have the plastic tensioners.
Thanks,
Rick
Jaguar PartsCenter

So all of that said and since my car is a MY 2002, apparently I have the plastic tensioners, albeit the second gen ones because of the model year.

How long do I have until I should except to replace them?

I did a long search through the forums and I couldn't find anything on the second generation tensioners. All of the threads I found were pertaining to the first generation tensioners.

I inquired with the two dealers that my car was taken to for service and neither of them had any record of any work done on the timing chain.

Otherwise, regular maintenance has been performed on this car all the way until I bought it.

Also, another reason why I decided to make this post is because I think I might be due for the timing chain replacement.

I say this because cold starts are getting a little interesting...at least I think.

First thing I can say is, during a pure cold start, the car actually takes as long as 1-2 seconds to turn over, and I can definitely feel the engine shaking a little but not crazily, once running. it smooths out as the car warms up and warm starts are perfect, the engine turns over instantly and there's no shaking.

I thought the longer starts meant that I didn't allow the fuel pumps to build up pressure, which is what I usually like to do. For example, on my Mercedes, if I cold started the car by cycling the key straight to the start, turning over would take a couple fractions of a second longer, where as if I waited for the fuel pumps to pressurize (I like to use the SRS bong/noise as a guide), the car started up quicker. Tried this method on the Jag by waiting for the SRS bong to stop before starting and cold starts still take that extra second.

Do these symptoms suggest that my time is running out very soon on my timing chain?

Thanks for your help guys.

 

Second gen tensioners are PLASTIC with a spring to keep the rattle to a minimum. I just replaced some 2nd gen tensioners that had 60,000 miles and they both had vertical cracks in the bodies.

The problem is twofold.

The tensioner plastic 'slippers' on GEN 1 AND GEN 2 can become disconnected and get between the chain and sprocket (breaks the chain).

The plastic housing cracks completely and the steel piston bore assy topples over causing the moving tensioner part to get into the chain/sprocket (breaks the chain).

The broken secondary chain stops the exhaust cam from rotating in sequence with the intake cam and pistons.

If the cam stops at the wrong time and holds a valve open when the piston is at top dead center, then the valve GETS BENT!!!!!

There's and old saying 'It's all about timing'!!

It's not IF the plastic tensioners crack but WHEN????

Primaries are not that prone to failure so I would not replace them until the guides crack or the primary chain rattles (curved blade moves freely with a prybar)

hope this helps

bob gauff

 

Both my '02 tensioners were cracked at 46k miles.

Don't believe the 'rattle warning' line because of the spring assisted gen 2 tensioners tend to lose the slippers without any rattle.

As Bob said, " . . . but WHEN . . . "

 

My late year 2001 runs fine, makes no strange noises at 75K miles. So...... I guess I dare not drive it? It's enough to make one paranoid!

 

I have an '01 VDP S/C and it always cranks longer before starting when it has sat overnight. When warm it starts instantly. This has not changed since in any way after changing the secondary tensioners.

My tensioners looked fine but after removing them I could see they were both cracked. I used the ones available from Ford to save some money - a forum search will provide the part numbers

 

The positive side of this is, a common fault that a good shop will have encountered, maybe contact a few members in your area for workshops of note. Needless to say main dealer will be expensive.
A good tip is above locating Ford items. There's a fast way and a slow way of doing it. One needs the right crank pulley removal tool, the other is to undo the exhaust camshaft caps, lift it and remove the old tensioner, and put the new one in (with new bolts, the same bolt as the cam caps bolt, it's *shorter*) then put the cam back without rotation, I used a marker pen to be sure. I prefer the latter.

 

Just bought my Jag and I have a question on this topic, if you would be so kind:

1999 XJ8 Vanden Plas

The car has 140,000 miles. Starts at 25 degrees Fahrenheit take 1-1.5 seconds at the most. I hear what might be a rattling (not sure if it is from the engine or what, because it is really quiet) for about 1-2 seconds on start, then nothing but the super quiet engine. Car runs perfectly, no sounds. I hear a bit of whining, but those are obviously the belts, and shouldn't be a problem.

I figure at 140k miles, problems like nikasil, tensioners, and water pump were probably already averted by the previous owner.

The car itself is in perfect condition, like it had just been restored. Literally, like it had just come out of the factory.

Any thoughts?

I also need to find the hood ornament. Apparently it was stolen while the car was at the dealership (Nashville). Any way to get one under $60,000?

Last note, I bought the car for 3600 as a third car for family reasons. For me, I would have paid 10000 for this kind of thing. Is that a good price on this?

 

As long as your tensioners don't kill the engine sounds like a good deal. Just because it made it to 140k miles does not mean the tensioners or water pump has been replaced. You are probably out of the black plastic impeller era but certainly not red plastic tensioners one.

 

Yeah, that kinda falls under the fact that this is a very nice engine. Being a very nice engine, it is good to keep up on the work, and replacing things every so often isnt too bad of an idea.

 

3870x2:
You need to check/change the secondary tensioners. PERIOD.

 

Description: Jaguar Leaping Cat Hood Ornament
Application: XJ6 1995-1997 | XJ8 1998-2003
Price: $140.00
http://www.motorcarsltd.com/HNA6350BA.html

Search the forum for tips on replacing or installing the leaper. May need to remove old base & adhesive & there are tricks posted for best methods.

There are also other places to purchase online.

 

I wouldn't wait to change the tensioners.. just go ahead and get them swapped. Mine gave out on 12/23 and left me with a broken timing chain, a broken valve, and a piston with a hole in it. $3K and a week later, the car is back on the road.. but I wish I'd have just swapped the old tensioners out for steel.

 

I am not sure if you are a DIY guy or not, but if you are adventurous, you could pull one the cam cover off the to take a look.(driver side, I would suggest) If you have 140,000 miles, you are definitely on borrowed time. It could be that the tensioners have been changed. You will see metal bodied ones if they have. If not.... change them.

Changing the secondary tensioners is quite easy, especially if you have the cam shaft lockdown bars. You should also have the crankshaft position pin and the pre-tension tool to take the slack out of the drive side of the chains before tightening down the camshaft sprocket. Getting your hands on those tools may be the bigger challenge. I was fortunate to have a dealer who lent the tools to me ( with a deposit of course).

There are a number of detailed posts on how to do it.

 

Just to add to the discussion and as another point of reference, I have just replaced the plugs and while at it, as it is a new car to me (2002, XJR, 61k miles) 10 days ownership, I decided to also do the tensioners as it was built in July '01 '02MY.
Engine was VERY clean, no signs of overheating, no deposits on any surfaces
Tensioners removed had no cracks, and hardly any wear marks, but they were coming out no matter how good they looked.

Cable tie method used, with modifications and notes.

• Remove Intake air filter and airbox.
• Did NOT need to drain or even remove coolant overflow or intercoler hoses
  Covers will come out.
• Clean and remove spark plug cover, coils, valve cover, Oil dipstick lifted slightly.
• Valve cover breather tubes are kept captive with a 'hooked' edge. It is necessary to lightly squeeze this to release the capture.
• Check exhaust cam position
• Hint: With the engine crank/camshaft in the correct position, the exhaust cam will NOT have any valves open and hence has NO pressure on it to bend. Trick is rotating the engine the right amount. Different possition for each bank.
• Cable tie Chain to gear to ensure it does not move when cam is lifted.
• Only need to lift cam an inch or so to remove tensioner from between gears.
• New metal tensioners used SHORTER bolts
• Completed each side in a constant but leisurely pace in 2 hours each, including plugs.
• 7, 8, 10mm sockets and extensions and wobble drive.

FYI Plugs were DENSO TT with anti seize on the threads

After reassembly, she started right up, and purred peacefully with no noises or leaks, just as before.
The test drive was even more relaxing knowing that I did not have to worry about if the 'when' moment would arrive with the collapse of the old tensioners. I like to think the new plugs have helped and she seems to fairly jump to life now.

I would not say this is to hard, as long as you have a variety of sockets and are torquing bolts rather than wrenching, a stripped thread ruins your whole day.

Dave

 

So does this same basic write-up cover my 99 Vanden Plas 4.0L?

 

Yes, same basic engine. Your car will have Variable Valve Timing units on the intake cam end but that, in no way, affects the description provided.

 

To dsetter:
How do you ensure you get the crankshaft turned to the "correct position"? Thx.

 

It was pure dumb luck that I 1st saw that there was no valve tension one side when the cover was removed, so when I did the other side and saw tension, (cam lobes pressing on valve buckets), I did a few short key cranks to turn it a little. I tried to man handle the crack pulley but was not to successful with that.

 

I also worried EVERY time I started the car. Especially since I kept hearing a little tapping noise when it was cold. I pulled the valve cover and looked and thank goodness, it's metal! It really gives peace of mind that at least this one issue is of no worry to me any more. The whole process of inspection took all of about 20 mins and a gasket, but SO worth the extra sleep I now get. (I even took pictures while in there, just in case I wake up in the middle of the night freaking out! I can take a look at the pics and go back to sleep. zzzzz)

PS: I've now decided by reading many other posts that the light tapping noise is likely VVT or oil viscosity. I'm not stressing on that any more either. I was also able to verify my Intake was replaced TWICE (through a vin check), and my Water Pump and Thermostat housing have both been replaced with metal. I'm really comfortable taking off on a long trip without worry.

Thank you to everyone here that helps us all sleep better at night. We Really Do appreciate it.

 

One poster found a metal tensioner on one side and a plastic one on the others side.