Ball Joints/Front end bushings-advice?
#1
Ball Joints/Front end bushings-advice?
Ok so I have bought an entire bushing/ball joint/tie rod end kit for my car. I have read the service manual and some info on the FAQ section of Jaglovers. It does not appear to be all that difficult overall but anytime I do something for the first time (never done ball joints before) there can be issues.
If anyone has done this project on their car, any advice or suggestions?
I currently have any/all tools and lifts at my disposal. I am in a class at a local college that is basically a "bring in your car and do whatever you want" class. They have everything I need including an alignment machine to finish it off at the end.
If anyone has done this project on their car, any advice or suggestions?
I currently have any/all tools and lifts at my disposal. I am in a class at a local college that is basically a "bring in your car and do whatever you want" class. They have everything I need including an alignment machine to finish it off at the end.
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Cinny65 (05-04-2014)
#2
I'm most of the way through mine. I've done tie rod ends, upper control arm bushings, sway bar bushings, new shocks, and upper and lower ball joints.
Tie Rods - Loosen the lock nut (tighten it further on the rod) and the tie rod end should come off pretty easily.
Upper Ball Joint - Make sure you keep up with where the shims go.
Upper Control Arm Bushings - Are a snap while you have the Upper Ball Joint out.
Lower Ball Joint - If you have the new style (non-greasable) ball joint you will need to tap out the seat from the hole in the control arm. I ended up hitting it with a dremmel and cut off wheel, folding back a part of the upper lip and driving it out of the bottom with a hammer and screwdriver. Also pay attention to supporting the control arm. I used a jack under the spring to make sure the spring didn't unload when I took it apart. The ball joint separator I have was too big for this joint, so knowing I was trashing the joint I just took the 2.5 lb sledge to it until it came out.
Also anti-seize is your friend. Especially if you ever have to take it apart again.
Tie Rods - Loosen the lock nut (tighten it further on the rod) and the tie rod end should come off pretty easily.
Upper Ball Joint - Make sure you keep up with where the shims go.
Upper Control Arm Bushings - Are a snap while you have the Upper Ball Joint out.
Lower Ball Joint - If you have the new style (non-greasable) ball joint you will need to tap out the seat from the hole in the control arm. I ended up hitting it with a dremmel and cut off wheel, folding back a part of the upper lip and driving it out of the bottom with a hammer and screwdriver. Also pay attention to supporting the control arm. I used a jack under the spring to make sure the spring didn't unload when I took it apart. The ball joint separator I have was too big for this joint, so knowing I was trashing the joint I just took the 2.5 lb sledge to it until it came out.
Also anti-seize is your friend. Especially if you ever have to take it apart again.
Last edited by Kalahari; 10-13-2010 at 01:31 PM.
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Cinny65 (05-04-2014)
#3
The ball joints are easy (as ball joints go) as they bolt in. You probably got the later style joints (which is fine) which means that the old seats will have to be knocked out of place to allow installation of the new joints (this applies to the lower joints only)
The upper control arm bushings are very easy. The lower control arm bushings are the only really hard part of the job. You have to remove the spring and the lower control arm....and the big shaft that runs thru the lower arm is often seized in place.....requiring cussing, banging, cutting, and WMDs to remove. Or...you might get lucky and it'll come out with a few taps. I've always been lucky....others, not so much. You'll have to shift the steering rack out of the way to remove the shafts.
Use extreme caution when removing and reinstalling the springs. There's a very real element of danger involved. ISince you've never done this sort of work an experienced helper looking over your shoulder would be a good idea.
Some guys replace 4 of the spring pan bolts with long (15-18") threaded rods with washers and nuts. The remove the remain spring pan bolts. Now the spring pan can be lowered by loosening each of the 4 nuts a few turns at at time, allowing the pan to come down evenly and the spring to de-compressed gently. This method also helps keep everything lined up on reinstallation.
Another method is a long threaded rod (3/4" by about 30" or so) thru the centter of the spring. Insert the road thru the center of the spring and thru the hole in the spring tower. Use a nut and big, thick washer to keep the rod in place. Now devise/find some sort of plate (with a hole in the middle for the rod) to bear against the bottom of the spring pan. Cinch the plate up against the bottom of the spring pan with a nut a thick washer. Now remove the pan bolts. Now the force of the spring is held by the long threaded rod. Slowly loosen the bottom nut and the spring pan will come down and the spring will decompress. Check the upper nut often to make sure it isn't coming off as well.
I use the long-rod-thru-the-middle method for removal and installation but, on installation, I add the 4 rods-thru-the-spring-pan to help keep everything lined up.
Cheers
DD
The upper control arm bushings are very easy. The lower control arm bushings are the only really hard part of the job. You have to remove the spring and the lower control arm....and the big shaft that runs thru the lower arm is often seized in place.....requiring cussing, banging, cutting, and WMDs to remove. Or...you might get lucky and it'll come out with a few taps. I've always been lucky....others, not so much. You'll have to shift the steering rack out of the way to remove the shafts.
Use extreme caution when removing and reinstalling the springs. There's a very real element of danger involved. ISince you've never done this sort of work an experienced helper looking over your shoulder would be a good idea.
Some guys replace 4 of the spring pan bolts with long (15-18") threaded rods with washers and nuts. The remove the remain spring pan bolts. Now the spring pan can be lowered by loosening each of the 4 nuts a few turns at at time, allowing the pan to come down evenly and the spring to de-compressed gently. This method also helps keep everything lined up on reinstallation.
Another method is a long threaded rod (3/4" by about 30" or so) thru the centter of the spring. Insert the road thru the center of the spring and thru the hole in the spring tower. Use a nut and big, thick washer to keep the rod in place. Now devise/find some sort of plate (with a hole in the middle for the rod) to bear against the bottom of the spring pan. Cinch the plate up against the bottom of the spring pan with a nut a thick washer. Now remove the pan bolts. Now the force of the spring is held by the long threaded rod. Slowly loosen the bottom nut and the spring pan will come down and the spring will decompress. Check the upper nut often to make sure it isn't coming off as well.
I use the long-rod-thru-the-middle method for removal and installation but, on installation, I add the 4 rods-thru-the-spring-pan to help keep everything lined up.
Cheers
DD
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LnrB (05-05-2014)
#4
Great info. I did not think it would be terribly tough and it appears as if a first-timer can tackle it. Will document the results on Monday.
I may save the lower control arm bushings for later. That sounds like a stand alone project that demands full attention.
Yes, I do have a service tech that wanders around the work area but there are 6 other people in this course so I do not get his full attention. He consults more than directs.
I may save the lower control arm bushings for later. That sounds like a stand alone project that demands full attention.
Yes, I do have a service tech that wanders around the work area but there are 6 other people in this course so I do not get his full attention. He consults more than directs.
#6
#7
Yeah, that is the one that I am most concerned with. It will be a project that I will have the experienced tech in our class work with me on. The college has all the tools to work with springs so that will be a good learning experience.
On a side note, I once saw a guy (I'm a fireman and respond to this kind of stuff) use bolt cutters on the springs that open his garage door. When he cut it, one of the pieces flew out and split his face open like someone cutting a fillet off a fish. So I have seen what those types of springs can do to someone. I will be extra cautious.
On a side note, I once saw a guy (I'm a fireman and respond to this kind of stuff) use bolt cutters on the springs that open his garage door. When he cut it, one of the pieces flew out and split his face open like someone cutting a fillet off a fish. So I have seen what those types of springs can do to someone. I will be extra cautious.
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#8
Update
I was able to successfully install the upper and lower ball joints, upper control arm bushings, and tie rod end on the passenger side. There are several observations and comments from this experience that may be helpful to those thinking about taking on this project.
1. It is absolutely something most people can do themselves.
2. Having a person help with certain aspects is helpful. There are times when you need three hands to do a task properly/safely and to reduce brake line damage potential.
3. It is easier to install both the upper and lower ball joints simultaneously than separately.
4. The "hardest" part of the job is removing the factory collar the the lower ball joint sits in. This is a perfect example of a two person part of the job. What I did was use an impact hammer with a blunt round disc as the tip. While I held the hub assembly stable, a helper hit the edge of the collar with the impact and it popped right out. If the upper lip is damaged by a previous person (which was the case for me) then die grind it down flush with the top of the ball joint opening. This added 15 mins to the job.
5. New ball joints and tie rod ends make a HUGE difference in the handling and feel of the car. I was shocked at the difference.
6. It took me three hours to complete the passenger side. I would say I can cut an hour off that now that I know what to do.
If anyone has any specific questions about this, feel free to ask.
1. It is absolutely something most people can do themselves.
2. Having a person help with certain aspects is helpful. There are times when you need three hands to do a task properly/safely and to reduce brake line damage potential.
3. It is easier to install both the upper and lower ball joints simultaneously than separately.
4. The "hardest" part of the job is removing the factory collar the the lower ball joint sits in. This is a perfect example of a two person part of the job. What I did was use an impact hammer with a blunt round disc as the tip. While I held the hub assembly stable, a helper hit the edge of the collar with the impact and it popped right out. If the upper lip is damaged by a previous person (which was the case for me) then die grind it down flush with the top of the ball joint opening. This added 15 mins to the job.
5. New ball joints and tie rod ends make a HUGE difference in the handling and feel of the car. I was shocked at the difference.
6. It took me three hours to complete the passenger side. I would say I can cut an hour off that now that I know what to do.
If anyone has any specific questions about this, feel free to ask.
The following 4 users liked this post by sneal46:
#11
I just finished the other side over the weekend. I have not installed the lower control arm bushings but everything else on both sides is on.
Some additional observations... the second side is much easier than the first one because you learn the "technique". First side took me 3-3.5 hours and the second took only 2. One thing to note for sure is that the metal bushing (factory) on the lower ball joint will only come out going down. It is tempting to press it up and out of the hole because it is easier to access from the bottom. This is where a second person comes in handy to steady the wheel assembly while using an air hammer/blunt end to pop out that ring.
For the upper ball joint nut I was unsure how tight to make the lock nut. What I determined is that you tighten it until you cannot wiggle the wheel assembly when grabbing on the top and bottom and shaking it. At first I thought it was tight enough but there was still a 1/4" (1/2 cm?) of play. So I tightened it more.
You will not believe how much difference a new set of ball joints and bushings have on the steering/handling. I feel like the car can take any turn at any speed and stick to the ground.
As for the alignment after the project is done. I have had the Jag on the alignment rack a couple times in my class. I have yet to get it right on but the camber and castor were both a little off when I was done. I also put new tie rod ends on and had to adjust those. Car pulls slightly to the left (pulled harder right before) so I still have some more shims to adjust. Certainly much better than before.
Some additional observations... the second side is much easier than the first one because you learn the "technique". First side took me 3-3.5 hours and the second took only 2. One thing to note for sure is that the metal bushing (factory) on the lower ball joint will only come out going down. It is tempting to press it up and out of the hole because it is easier to access from the bottom. This is where a second person comes in handy to steady the wheel assembly while using an air hammer/blunt end to pop out that ring.
For the upper ball joint nut I was unsure how tight to make the lock nut. What I determined is that you tighten it until you cannot wiggle the wheel assembly when grabbing on the top and bottom and shaking it. At first I thought it was tight enough but there was still a 1/4" (1/2 cm?) of play. So I tightened it more.
You will not believe how much difference a new set of ball joints and bushings have on the steering/handling. I feel like the car can take any turn at any speed and stick to the ground.
As for the alignment after the project is done. I have had the Jag on the alignment rack a couple times in my class. I have yet to get it right on but the camber and castor were both a little off when I was done. I also put new tie rod ends on and had to adjust those. Car pulls slightly to the left (pulled harder right before) so I still have some more shims to adjust. Certainly much better than before.
Last edited by sneal46; 11-08-2010 at 08:11 AM.
#14
The difference will be astonishing to you. I had to start taking curves a little faster just to see how the car handles.
#15
#18
This assembly is the power-steering valve and is what detects steering effort and direction and diverts fluid to one side or the other of the rack piston, and, at the same time, allows pressure to build in the system so that the driver receives assistance with his steering. When there is no steering effort, the fluid is allowed to pass through the valve and back to the reservoir. Other thing to mention is that there is a blow-off valve somewhere, probably the pump to set a maximum pressure and stop hoses and seals blowing.
#20
Hi Tsingtao35
A don't think there are any serviceable parts in this assembly, except maybe the oil seals. Inside there is a torsion bar to detect steering effort, and if this breaks, obviously the valve does not work correctly.
As to where you find this assembly, it is normally part of the rack assembly. If you have a leak it sounds as if you need new seals, nothing else. Of course a Series 2 is getting quite old now, so I suppose such leaks can now be expected. Try searching the internet for the parts; there are a couple of UK dealers with a seal kit advertised.
http://www.jagspares.co.uk/Manners/C...mageField.y=13
http://www.britishparts.co.uk/.sc/ms...g-Suspension/3
A don't think there are any serviceable parts in this assembly, except maybe the oil seals. Inside there is a torsion bar to detect steering effort, and if this breaks, obviously the valve does not work correctly.
As to where you find this assembly, it is normally part of the rack assembly. If you have a leak it sounds as if you need new seals, nothing else. Of course a Series 2 is getting quite old now, so I suppose such leaks can now be expected. Try searching the internet for the parts; there are a couple of UK dealers with a seal kit advertised.
http://www.jagspares.co.uk/Manners/C...mageField.y=13
http://www.britishparts.co.uk/.sc/ms...g-Suspension/3