Project Jag-Dad---Budget Restoration of a lumped 1971 Series I XJ6
#61
04-10-2013 | 03:05 AM
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Joined: Feb 2013
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From: San Antonio, NM
What usually happens is cam and lifter wear from lack of Zinc in modern oils. Then metal particles clogg the oil filter. The clogged filters causes pressure bypass to open allowing dirty un filtered oil to circulate which wipes the bores and main bearings and seals.
What was the oil pressure like hot and cold ? Finger nail grabbing gouges are not good.
Would you consider getting a LT1 caprice cop car as a doner? They're everywhere on CL and you can drive 'em and ensure the engine and trans runs right before you buy. You'll get a 4 speed auto, the performance of fuel injection and the engine / trans are run by one computer so it will be a well driving package. The Lt1 is sequential injection so it is smooth running and has a roller valve train for performance. 1500 for a jegs crate motor is a great deal but you'll need 200$ in gaskits, you'll need a cam, lifters, head rebuild, carb rebuild and after all that work you've got a grumpy carbed 350 with a lazy 3 speed trans that will wipe the cam again unless you go roller ($$$) or monitor your oil carefully. The LT1 is easy to install and get running with stand alone engine / trans wiring harness but you'll need to shorten the drive shaft a bit and install a fuel pump and return line.
What was the oil pressure like hot and cold ? Finger nail grabbing gouges are not good.
Would you consider getting a LT1 caprice cop car as a doner? They're everywhere on CL and you can drive 'em and ensure the engine and trans runs right before you buy. You'll get a 4 speed auto, the performance of fuel injection and the engine / trans are run by one computer so it will be a well driving package. The Lt1 is sequential injection so it is smooth running and has a roller valve train for performance. 1500 for a jegs crate motor is a great deal but you'll need 200$ in gaskits, you'll need a cam, lifters, head rebuild, carb rebuild and after all that work you've got a grumpy carbed 350 with a lazy 3 speed trans that will wipe the cam again unless you go roller ($$$) or monitor your oil carefully. The LT1 is easy to install and get running with stand alone engine / trans wiring harness but you'll need to shorten the drive shaft a bit and install a fuel pump and return line.
I agree with you diagnosis about the ZDDP. I've learned alot about oils and flat tappet motors in the last few weeks and that sounds pretty plausible. I'm not sure about oil pressures, the gauge isn't working (which I'm kicking myself for not fixing first).
The 350 from JEGS is a brand new long block from GM Goodwrench. Its the same replacement 350 they have been making for years. There is tons of info on how to liven up that particular motor it consists of pretty typical 350 stuff: Cam, intake, carb, headers and you're in ~250 hp on the stand. Heads if you want more and have the dough.
I'm looking at at 350 powered RX-7 project tomorrow. It runs and drives so I'll be able to feel it out a bit.
#62
04-10-2013 | 04:40 AM
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From: on-the-edge
Another possibility is the 400 cid small block with the siamesed bores.
Externally the same as the 350, but inches is inches on a 2 ton car.
On the ZDDP, go with the 20W50 oils or the diesel 15W40. Both retain higher levels of ZDDP. Look for API ratings of SJ or earlier.
Externally the same as the 350, but inches is inches on a 2 ton car.
On the ZDDP, go with the 20W50 oils or the diesel 15W40. Both retain higher levels of ZDDP. Look for API ratings of SJ or earlier.
Last edited by plums; 04-10-2013 at 04:43 AM.
#63
04-10-2013 | 10:12 AM
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From: New York City
Go LT1
If you saw metal and brass in the oil the engine is toasted. Don't kick yourself about the guage, The engine probably was already self desctucting when you got it and it would have read good enough oil pressure to lul you even it the filter was clogged because the relieve would have opened. Some people switch to an oil filter appliance that doesn't have the relieve valve...that way the gauge actually offers meaningful info. Also...some SBC oil filters have a relieve valve built in to the bottom of the filter which is usually visible from the top hole.
We don't see many caprices painted up or donked up here in NYC, not my style but I respect the effort. If caprice's are hard to come by you can also try a Buick Roadmaster or Cadilac Fleetwoods. You should be able to find many running and driving examples for 2500 or less. Find the best one...pay for it, order standalone engine harness, start your swap, then send me the PCM, I'll reprogram it for you and remove the trouble codes for the stuff like EGR, CCP, ABS, ASR VATS, and test it in my LT1 swap. Job done! Your best options are 1995 and 1994. Those are OBD1 and much easier to swap. Then put your old engine where the LT1 was and scrap the doner. We get $300 for scrap vehicles here which helps offset the cost of the wiring harness and helps clean up a bit. The LT1 isn't as smooth as the Jag big 6 but it's real close and I believe the LT1's refinement is in keeping with the vehicles intent.
As for the 400...I have an XJ6C with one...it's built stout with Trickflow heads, 6 inch rod kit, 10.2:1 compression, mid range cam, custom roller Rhoads lifters, 700R4 with shift kit done right, Tunnel Ram Fuel Injection and all the speed goodies. It's my favorite SBC because of the novelty, power and challenge. Since it's a Gen1 SBC its done with all the speed part I always wanted. If I had to do it all over again I'd do a LT1 383 because of the refinement. It took me a year to get the ECM and 7004R set up right on the 400 then the block cracked in the valley near a head bolt boss. Undeterred... I installed another block. The LT1 probable would nto have cracked, and the refinements can be done right in the PCM with out getting dirty... There are 3500LB Camaros running mid 12's with a decent idle... not too shabby!
We don't see many caprices painted up or donked up here in NYC, not my style but I respect the effort. If caprice's are hard to come by you can also try a Buick Roadmaster or Cadilac Fleetwoods. You should be able to find many running and driving examples for 2500 or less. Find the best one...pay for it, order standalone engine harness, start your swap, then send me the PCM, I'll reprogram it for you and remove the trouble codes for the stuff like EGR, CCP, ABS, ASR VATS, and test it in my LT1 swap. Job done! Your best options are 1995 and 1994. Those are OBD1 and much easier to swap. Then put your old engine where the LT1 was and scrap the doner. We get $300 for scrap vehicles here which helps offset the cost of the wiring harness and helps clean up a bit. The LT1 isn't as smooth as the Jag big 6 but it's real close and I believe the LT1's refinement is in keeping with the vehicles intent.
As for the 400...I have an XJ6C with one...it's built stout with Trickflow heads, 6 inch rod kit, 10.2:1 compression, mid range cam, custom roller Rhoads lifters, 700R4 with shift kit done right, Tunnel Ram Fuel Injection and all the speed goodies. It's my favorite SBC because of the novelty, power and challenge. Since it's a Gen1 SBC its done with all the speed part I always wanted. If I had to do it all over again I'd do a LT1 383 because of the refinement. It took me a year to get the ECM and 7004R set up right on the 400 then the block cracked in the valley near a head bolt boss. Undeterred... I installed another block. The LT1 probable would nto have cracked, and the refinements can be done right in the PCM with out getting dirty... There are 3500LB Camaros running mid 12's with a decent idle... not too shabby!
Last edited by icsamerica; 04-10-2013 at 10:32 AM.
#64
04-10-2013 | 10:40 AM
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Joined: Jun 2012
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From: Glendora, CA USA
Too bad you are not in CA - my 383/700R is for sale
Remember, it is still here, 15K on the engine and trans but the car is
rusting away. Was my first Jaguar! could be driven from CA to your place...
Has great oil pressure and carb just rebuilt. Mild custom engine done by local shop with "nice" idle and uses 87 octane.
Putting in the LT1 is not just a slam dunk. Your car would need return lines - I put in SII tanks and new lines to the front with a electric inline pump and (6)
way valve in the trunk. Needs different radiator as water flows different direction and on and on...
You can get the pan off by loosening the motor mounts and trans mount and
jacking it up enough. But, it sounds like you will not like what you see in there.
I bought the same type of problems with the '74, was supposed to be 350 and was 305 that soon broke the crank spout off due to the rust! That is why there is a 383 in there now!!!!
rusting away. Was my first Jaguar! could be driven from CA to your place...
Has great oil pressure and carb just rebuilt. Mild custom engine done by local shop with "nice" idle and uses 87 octane.
Putting in the LT1 is not just a slam dunk. Your car would need return lines - I put in SII tanks and new lines to the front with a electric inline pump and (6)
way valve in the trunk. Needs different radiator as water flows different direction and on and on...
You can get the pan off by loosening the motor mounts and trans mount and
jacking it up enough. But, it sounds like you will not like what you see in there.
I bought the same type of problems with the '74, was supposed to be 350 and was 305 that soon broke the crank spout off due to the rust! That is why there is a 383 in there now!!!!
#65
04-10-2013 | 05:44 PM
Senior Member
Joined: Aug 2012
Posts: 414
Likes: 33
From: NC
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Personally - I think the above statement answers your question for you... And since the budget is an issue, AND this if for your Dad and not yours per say, go with another lump in better condition. Your car is already set up for a SBC. Keep the costs down and find a better one in that huge junkyard you have access to, or refresh what you have. Dont get me wrong, the LT1 option would be awesome... but wasted on your Dad? Unless he is a speed nut, get him a reliable gift that you are not traveling to Chicago and back every weekend to repair. Dont forget the "Gift" part of this project. Even with a fresh 350 - and not the LT1 - it is a gift he will not soon forget.
I'd never hear the end of it if I gave my dad a car that needed a new engine.
Personally - I think the above statement answers your question for you... And since the budget is an issue, AND this if for your Dad and not yours per say, go with another lump in better condition. Your car is already set up for a SBC. Keep the costs down and find a better one in that huge junkyard you have access to, or refresh what you have. Dont get me wrong, the LT1 option would be awesome... but wasted on your Dad? Unless he is a speed nut, get him a reliable gift that you are not traveling to Chicago and back every weekend to repair. Dont forget the "Gift" part of this project. Even with a fresh 350 - and not the LT1 - it is a gift he will not soon forget.
#66
04-11-2013 | 05:31 PM
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Joined: Feb 2013
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From: San Antonio, NM
Personally - I think the above statement answers your question for you... And since the budget is an issue, AND this if for your Dad and not yours per say, go with another lump in better condition. Your car is already set up for a SBC. Keep the costs down and find a better one in that huge junkyard you have access to, or refresh what you have. Dont get me wrong, the LT1 option would be awesome... but wasted on your Dad? Unless he is a speed nut, get him a reliable gift that you are not traveling to Chicago and back every weekend to repair. Dont forget the "Gift" part of this project. Even with a fresh 350 - and not the LT1 - it is a gift he will not soon forget.
Naturally, a lumped 72 XJ6 in dire condition was posted on craigslist today to muddy the decision. It looks ghastly but might be worth picking it up for spares and scrapping the shell (though it pains me to do that). If its still around this weekend, I'll take a look at it. I could use a few various pieces and can pull any valuable parts off it to fund my project. Maybe the 350 is salvageable. Its looks awful messy though.
If anyone is interested in it, I'd be happy to look at it for you but if you're following this thread, you probably don't want to get into the same mess I am in.
1972 Jaguar - MUST SELL
#68
07-30-2022 | 02:39 AM
Joined: Dec 2011
Posts: 120,461
Likes: 16,877
From: Durham, UK
(I've removed your duplicate of this post.)
This thread is over 9 years old and the OP Johnny Bouncewell was last on the forum in July 2014.
Graham
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