Hello to all. I am a new member here, but not new to the Jaguar marque.

I have a 1985 H.E. V12 XJS. I purchased the car with a locked up engine, from being severely overheated. I purchased a used engine from a wrecking yard in MA. The engine had reportedly only 71,000 miles on it.

I installed the engine, and yesterday I filled the pan, filled the oil filter, and filled the freshly flushed and cleaned oil cooler. However, the engine refuses to move any oil. Upon cranking, it has no pressure. Pulled the banjo bolt at the back of the sending unit / switch and cranked, no oil. Pulled the filter, no oil dripping out of the housing.

I have contacted the firm from which I bought the engine, and they stated that the engine sat on the shelf for a year. The next step is to pull the oil pan and check the sump pickup, and maybe try to inject oil up to the pump in case it lost its prime.

Does anyone know the oiling system on these engines? Where is the pump? is it actuated by the distributor shaft, or by the crank? has anyone had this issue before?

 

I have pulled the lower oil pan ($90 worth of oil wasted), and the lower sump windage tray. The pickup tube is nice and clean, has residue from all of the oil that I put in.

The tube runs away in the darkness to somewhere in the front of the engine. I am guessing that the pump is mounted in the front of the engine behind the timing case cover.

The wrecking yard is trying to throw the screws to me, stating that only the block and heads are covered. Basically a long block, but not the oil pump. In my 18 years of automotive experience, I have never seen a long block that didn't come with an oil pump.

 

Okay, now I have oil pressure during cranking; I will continue with the assembly of the car.

I took the oil cooler line and fitting off of the front of the upper oil pan (also called a sandwich plate), and used a gear oil pump attached to a quart of oil to squirt oil up into the pump's intake. Then using a traebon gun (basically a grease gun for liquids), I pumped two quarts into the engine's oil galleys and pump through the idiot light switch hole in the tower at the back of the block. Now the light goes out immediately upon beginning cranking.

 

Geez, you answered your own questions before anyone else could!
Sitting for a year just allowed all the oil to drain out of the pump and it was dry.

 

When I rebuilt the V12 in our '72 E-Type I primed using a external pump. I agree it just was likely dry in your case.

The pump on the V12 is mounted at the front and driven directly by the crankshaft. These pumps are pretty much bullet proof. I did nothing to this one except check specs and it was fine. Engine had 70k miles when I rebuilt it.

Rich

 

The engine is running well, I have a custom (by me!) 2-1/4" exhaust built that comes from the y-pipes into an X-pipe, through two Dynomax Bullet mufflers, and just dumps before the rear wheels. No cats, no other mufflers, no resonators.
The car breathes and sounds like a 6000 - 7000 RPM V12 should. I am chasing down some gremlins in the car though.
Still need to get it to an exhaust shop for finish work over the axles and tailpipes (I dant have a lift or exhaust pipe bender.

It sat for about 8 years before I bought it, so the fuel pump was locked up. I happened to have a used one on the shelf in my shop (and my wife gives me crap for saving stuff!), and used it. I have taken the Lucas (Bosch) pump apart at the crimps, cleaned the varnish out of it and redressed the brushes / rotor, and now it works like new. Toughest part was getting the crimp back right.

The car blows the Reverse light / instument fuse whenever the shifter is put into N or R. Cant figure this one yet. If it just blew it in R, it would be easier.

Once the budget allows, I will install a growler intake system and the cat cooler radiator and fan setup from fasterjags.com (look into it - expensive, but could possibly save you a very expensive engine!)

On a different note, The wrecking yard I got the engine from sent me another one when I complained of no oil pressure. Not sure what to do there - anyone got a car with a bad V12 to sell??

I'll get some pics together and post when I can. I work 12-16 hours a day, 6 days a week, so not much time for anything other than the sack when I'm off. I took a week of vacation to put the car together.

 

If I lived closer I'd offer to take that spare off your hands! LOL

 

I have the original overheated and previously locked up (Stuck a BIG breaker bar and socket on it, and three of us pulled to break it free so I could unbolt the torque converter for removal) engine from the car, and now the wrecking yard spare.
I am going to mount the old engine to one of my stands and tear it down. Curiosity has always been one of my faults, and I want to know what happened. I dont think it dropped walve seats, because it still turns normally and the timing chain moves with it. I do know it either blew a head gasket or cracked block / head; it had chocolate milk for oil, and was at least twice as high on the dipstick as it should have been (took two 3 gallon buckets to drain it all).
I'm toying with the idea of finding a wrecked xjs and put all of the drivetrain into my 1973 Datsun 240 Z. Thoughts?

 

Interesting idea but I don't think the suspension in a 240 could handle the weight of the V12 without significantly increasing the spring capacities, and then it would probably plow through corners like a farm tractor. Without any of the add-ons, the V12 weighs around 700 lbs.

 

The Z has a cast Iron block, with an aluminum head. Im not sure what the weight of it is, but it is a heavy long engine. I would also be eliminating the A/C compressor and smog pump and A.I.R. exhaust porting system. The Z has about a 15" drive shaft now, and I would have to cut the Jag shaft to probably about 12". I don't know how well a Jag suspention would fit under front and rear though.

 

I may be mistaken, but even with the cast iron block the Z motor will still be lighter than the V12. I'm sure you can probably find the weights of both engines online somewhere.
As far as the suspension, both cars are unibody construction and although grafting the Jag front end onto the Z would solve your suspension and engine mount problems, I think you'll find it's a tremendous amount of work that may not match up no matter how you do it. The first thing that comes to mind is that the Jag is considerably wider.
I certainly don't want to discourage you from attempting this "out of the box" thinking, but I do see some major obstacles to overcome.

 

I did some rudimentry prelim measuring last night, and the v12 is about the same height as the L6 in the Z. The strut towers are too narrow between for the air filter boxes, but it looks as though the trottle bodies will nestle in nicely behind them. Then I can fashion my own cold air intakes. The transmission tunnel is too small for the TH400 trans, so ill have to modify that. My measurements are all from a 1977 parts donor 280 Z instead of my 240, but the bodies are the same.
The z has a fully independent rear, but i bet it would only take one romp on the accelerator to grenade it. The Jaguar is definately wider than the z, but the length of the engine compartment is only about 5 inches longer. I think after some measurements to be sure, I could probably roll the fenders out on the Z to allow the width of front and rear suspensions. Not sure which Z i'll go with. the 240 is worth more left original, but is rusty. It is all there, and somebody upgraded it to weber carbs quite a few years ago. The car has sat and not been used in about a decade.
The 280 has no trans or windsheild and has not been on the road in about 20 years, but the body is in pretty nice shape. All of this depends on whether the measurements will work out, and whether or not I can score a parts XJS for a reasonable sum.

 

Jag V12 in a 240 Z has been done. So someone has worked it all out. If you have the skills it shouldn't be an issue. If it handles oddly then simply make adjustments and tweeks til you get it right.
This is the traditional Hot Rodders mentality, and it works for those of us willing to see it through and deal with things till we get solutions.

Honestly a shame to change a very rare and significant Japanese sports car though.
The 240 was a rip off of an E-type but so what? It was a great car and history has given it a much deserved niche. Rust has gotten the better of so many of them. If yours is good enough to do this with I would encourage its preservation.

Personally I will cheer you on no matter what your decision.

One car I saw that made me smile was a T-bucket rat rod with a Jag V-12 in it.
a local paint ball place "SGT Splatter's" uses it as a promo tool and he drives it too.

It looks SO COOL! I want to do something like that eventually. Wonder what they would say at the JCNA concours? Open engined V-12 stripped down to carburetors, six webbers sticking straight up. Nothing that isn't essential,... so beautiful to look at.
.

One more suggestion,use the engine with a manual trans to buld an XJ-13 from a kit supplied from England.
Or a silk cut replica or???

I am getting dizzy from excitment I need to lay down now

JustV12

 

What is an XJ13? I know that the not-for-america bound xjs, a stick was available, and when I owned my '94 XJS 6.0 coupe, I remember finding a company that would sell you a kit with a Borg Warner T56 6 speed and everything necessary to convert it for around $10K.
I never have that kind of scratch around to dump on a trans. Most everything I've done, has been homebuilt with what I can afford at the time.

The 1973 240 Z is pretty rusty, but only on the doors and hatchback. The car is also worth way more than the 1977 280 Z. The 280 has pretty much been gutted; it is a parts car for my brother-in-law's 1978 280 Z (which I sold him).

I think if I were to play with either one of them, it would probably be the 280, because the 240 is 100% complete, and I have the CU carbs that came on it stock.

All of this is just throwing Ideas around of course. How about a Jag V12 powered sandrail?

 

Hey:

A V-12 sandrail sounds ridiculous! To quote the kids, that means something good.

Anyway there are lots of manual trannies that will go behind a V 12 without a ton of work. Those 10 K kits are for conversions to cars that are complete, runners and maybe dont even have a place for a clutch box. What I was refering to a total kit build, such as the XJ -13.

The XJ 13 is my fantasy so I won't force it on anyone else, but if you google it you will see one of the most beautiful Jaguars racers ever made.

There exists only one car and it is in the Jaguar heritage museum in Coventry. It does run and run WELL! It is taken out and uised for lots of special events. I think I rememebr some you tube video of the XJ 13 being run. It was even crashed once and repaired. Jaguar doesn't baby the collectibles thats for sure.

Anyway, there are companies in England that offer XJ 13 replica's and they can be spot on perfect.
If I had a spare V-12 (which technically I do) or a spare any Jag engine I would be looking to use it in a good Jag replica of which MANY are available.
The good thing about Jag replica's that have Jag engines is they are fully respected by the Jag clubs and they even have classes for them at the annual concours shows. In Toronto last year the peoples choice award went to a replica 56 D-Type racer. BUT!!! It must have a Jag engine which of course you have.

Another best part is when you are done with the build and it is a good build, you have something of unquestionable value. If you stuff a V-12 into that Datsun you will have a really neet one of a kind machine, extra cool points for that, but the value will be questionable and it may turn out to be a job done at great expense just for your amusement.

Nothing at all wrong with that and don't let purists tell you different, its your car and your engine. However, if its all the same work why not end up with something that is valuable.
Oh that replica D-Type? You could buy it from the guy for anywhere north of 80 grand maybe closer to 150,000. Try that with a Datsun hotrod.

Anyway Cheers and support here for whatever you do, as long as you consider both sides, its all good.
The world is your oyster as they say.

Cheers again!
JustV12

 

I have to agree with many of the points offered by JustV12. Hotrodding the Z certainly would be cool in a technical aspect, and I'd love to see the outcome. But there is a question of what happens after the "ohh...ahhh!" factor wears off. Once you've put blood, sweat, money and tears into this project, you'll certainly have some fun for a while but it's value will probably be to you only.
The sandrail idea is the same, but the engine is a bit more visible and again, I'd love to see it. The prospect boggles the mind!

 

I am not sure which way to go with this; I am going to google the XJ13. There is alot of time, and I am not feeling belabored by having this engine laying around. It may also be a great candidate for a spare engine.

I dont plan on overheating my XJS, but no-one does. Any and all ideas and feedback are genuinely appreciated, as I am a very open-minded person when it comes to automobiles.

I have owned over 400, 6 of them have been Jaguars. I am not a purist, but I have never been interested in stuffing a chevy powerplant into a Jag.

How about a V12 powered older Corvette? Hahaha!

 

Did you google the XJ-13 and then almost drop dead with excitement?! I almost did.

I will definitely build one of the replicas some day.

These guys nailed it! XJ13 Replica

I found your post intriguing as I am a Z enthusiast and a Jag lover. This is my daily driver right now. It is the great great great grandbaby of the 240z.

 

just start it. It will not register oil pressure until it is started. The starter does not spin it fast enough to build pressure on an engine that had its oil changed.

 

l would imagine it has been started by now, it has been a full decade after all.