Can anyone on here tell me what is inside the steering column that actually mates with the horn button rod when installed? I'm guessing it's a long pointed brass rod that goes inside the horn button tube when installed. I think there might be something wrong with that pin but don't know how to get it out of the steering column. What holds it to keep it on center in place? My checks show I've lost continuity in this column. .....thanks, Mike.

 

Remove the steering wheel. You will see a large nylon nut with a brass centre; gently unscrew it and you will find you can withdraw a long rod fixed to it with a special end on it. There are copper wipers on the outside of the column above your ankles. These contact to the piece you have just removed, via the column steel. When you press the horn, it earths the signal from the rod you have just removed.

 

Thanks once again Greg. I have found that the continuity from my brass ring around the column (where the wiper makes contact) to the top of my horn button is infinite. In other words, there is no grounding taking place.to make the horn work. I have made the horns work by loosening the nylon plastic nut at the top at the wheel, pulling out the plastic nut about 1" to show the bare brass and moving the long brass tube from side to side against the inside of the steering column, forcing the tube to ground.will make it intermittently work. Yet if I take a solidly grounded jumper wire and hook it to the contact point on the horn button at the steering wheel, it doesn't work. That makes me think that the contacts of the horn button tube don''t have good contact with whatever is inside the column (a pointed rod?). I would like to know what it is actually down inside the column that goes up inside the horn button tube and how it connects to the brass ring on the outside of the shaft tube. Is it possible to remove this for cleaning? Thanks, Mike......

 

Pictures are worth a 1000 words

Jaguar XJS Restoration : XJS Steering Column Repair

You can see the rod Greg mentions about 1/2 way down the page and just above it the pic of the wire coming out with the copper collar, there is a spring in the hole that touches the rod and the OEM collar this is the connection between the horn button and the outside world.

 

I found a couple of pics the bottom one is the spring I mentioned in my last post

 

Wow, a pix IS worth a thousand words. That helps allot in my case. Do you know what holds that rod in place? Is it the broken up black plastic piece on the left end of the rod? I guess you had to break it all out by driving it down the back end of the shaft and out the back. I'll get back on mine tomorrow after work and do some more testing before I remove the column. I got some erratic resistance measurements. Maybe I can remove the spring contact on the "lead" wire at the column and clean it and the brass shaft first to see if I'm losing continuity there. Thanks for all the help, .............Mike in College Station TX

 

Yes that black plastic thing on the pin holds it down the column,

What is the problem.

 

The problem is intermittent continuity between the rod in the hole and the horn button tube. Sometimes I can ground my horn tube, .....the part that screws in at the top of the column over the rod inside the column, ....and the horn works and then it doesn't work. It's like the wiper on the end of the horn button tube is making intermittent contact with the rod at the bottom of the column (maybe needs cleaning?). If I take a grounded wire and touch it directly to the wiper or wiper ring at the bottom of the column it always makes the horn work. So it appears I have an intermittent circuit break between the rod and tube in the column or, ...now that I understand how the rod at the bottom is connected to the wiper ring (through a spring), perhaps the problem is between the spring and the rod itself. That's where I am right now in my problem analysis.

 

Ok, my guess would be the spring under the collar. This is what caused my horn to blare when the steering wheel was turned 1/4 turn.

 

Before I pull the upper column out to tear it down for inspection I need to clarify the sequence so I don't destroy anything.
I'm assuming the pointed rod removal sequence is: Slip the brass "feed" contact ring off the plastic insulator. I looks like it is held in place with its edge fingers in your pix. Then pull out the ring-to-rod spring that is under it out of the hole. Then pull the rod out the front of the column tube. Question, ....does it just pull out by pulling on the pointed end? Is it difficult to pull it out? .............Thanks, Mike. .

 

That is what I thought, I found it impossible to get the old ring back on so it worked reliably, that is why I replaced it with a copper pipe fitting. The spring in my column was jammed in there and removing it destroyed it. Same getting the pin out of the column, it did not want to come out and I ended up with an ever so slight bend in the pin again it did not want to work.

So I just ditched the whole lot and replaced it with a bit of wire. Been there now for 6 years and no issues.

 

Okay! That's what I'll do too. I'm working on it this weekend and will see how much damage I do getting it all out, assuming this is where my problem is. Did you use actual copper tubing or did you get a copper fitting and just machine it to size? I see you used mylar bags, which I have, but did you use any adhesive glue under it to hold the new ring in place? Do you remember how many wraps you used? Somehow that ring has to be held in place if it is still going to be turning with a contact wiper against it. .......thanks, Mike.

 

I used a copper pipe joiner and machined it to fit. The mylar was just wrapped around the column, I used heatshrink with glue inside it to hold it all together.

The other thing mine squeaks a little, the wiper on the copper, I plan to replace the wiper with a carbon brush.

 

I spent the best part of Saturday under and in front of the dash removing all the items in the way of getting the upper steering column out (instrument panel, plug wiring, dash trim etc. Of all the painful things having to be removed from any dash is all that plastic trim stuff because you have to be so careful not to break old plastic non-replaceable parts. A good part of my time was spent searching for hidden screws when something wouldn't budge. Talk about a patience challenge! I also spent time looking for what the manual refers to (in British terms) as nylon nuts on the column. Thinking in US terms I was looking for a nylon nut, which I finally figured out was what we here commonly refer to as a "nyloc" locking steel nut.

Got the column out okay and then removed the Ignition switch from it while it was on the bench. I bought the 1" copper coupling yesterday and will probably start the column disassembly repair tomorrow after work, So, I have a couple of questions:

Once the coupling is in the lathe I will do the boring and turning operation (I hate boring copper parts!).
:
Questions:
What did you use to determine the outside ring diameter, ......the same as the original ring?

Did you bore the inside I.D. to the original size or did you pick the final I.D. to be a slip fit of whatever you came up with for the milar film wrap O.D.?

Did you use the 1" shrink wrap that already has its glue on the inside or did you just use normal shrink wrap and something like 5 minute epoxy or Gorilla glue underneath it?

Why do you think your contacts squeak against the new copper ring? Is it because now there are 2 different metals? Could it be you didn't use the right contact grease? At this point I can drill a small hole in each of my existing wipers, make a couple of small carbon buttons with a stud on the backside (to fit the holes, epoxied glued in place) but that seems to me another headache if they ever come out. I'm "all ears" on this one. ...............thanks! .....Mike.

 

In place of your carbon contact points I'm thinking I'll instead use the silver contact buttons that I can extract out of an old relay contactor. I can solder them in place on the existing springs and should last forever. It also allows me to lube the contact ring like Jag did with the original springs without getting in to possible problems with the carbon brushes. ..........Mike

 

Yep machining copper sucks. Use HSS and hone it sharp, does a far better job than carbide insert tooling.

I bored the collar large enough to wrap the mylar at 4-5 times around the column. OD I cleaned it up and polished it with emery in the lathe, then parted it off.

This is the heatshrink I used except I have an account with RS Components

https://www.jaycar.com.au/heatshrink...-12mm/p/WH5643

I used contact grease I bought from RS. I think the squeak is the type of materials. Carbon brushes run at 3600+rpm in a DC motor so will last multiple lifetimes on the column.

 

I've worked on DC motors and generators in the past and I've even heard carbon brushes squeak on an armature too. Like you say, I think it's just the dissimilar metals. I did get an extra set of contact springs for this column so if my silver tip relay contact squeaks I'll just replace it with the original one. I got my column all torn down last night and managed to get it apart without destroying anything but the spring between the brass rod and the slip ring. I found my problem to be the brass pointed rod inside had corrosion both at the spring under the slip ring as well as half way up the rod where my slip connector in the upper tube made contact, ....or was suppose to. I know I can clean it all up and put in a new spring but I think I'm going to just do what you did with some good fine strand teflon coated wire (aircraft quality), which I have plenty of. I'll probably just wind it in a coil like your wrist strap is and as long as I have enough telescoping travel it will be fine. I'm going to come up with some sort of electrical connection at the top using the original horn button brass tube so I can disconnect it at the top if I want to remove my wheel. I'll use my original brass ring with its black insulator and just run the wire up where the spring was, soldering it to the original ring. I found I had some glue type heat shrink to put on it as you did but it may not be big enough. I measured it to be over an inch but I may just have to buy some larger diameter.
BTW, I posted another separate thread this afternoon showing some of the detailed pix of what I had after I took it all apart last night. Between yours and my pix I hope it helps others understand what they're looking at in the unseen darkness of the "Lucas" horn delemma.