does your jaguar run fast enough?
#21
07-07-2013, 10:45 PM
Oh no! I think it was a good question - and I encourage you to ask more! While there are many practical factors, such as better flowing head and exhaust designs, improved fuel injection techniques, better air/fuel ratio control, lighter weight, and more gears in the transmission, it's all part of a broader theme of constant innovation and improvement.
#22
07-08-2013, 11:24 AM
I agree. Always ask questions. There are some very bright people here who have experience and opinions and are well worth listening to (can't say that I'm one of them, but I am right about asking questions!).
#23
07-08-2013, 02:08 PM
Fast Enough?
I've enjoyed reading this thread, and as was the common feed, our XJS was never geared for neck snapping take-off acceleration, and I've had a couple 'Fart-Piped Tuner Cars' whip past me screaming -and I've let them, and by the same token, I've also taught an older hopped-up Camaro what the old V-12 can do when I let it stretch her legs after he passed me, hammer down. A long straight stretch of 4-lane opened up and at half throttle I cruised past him with a tip of the hat and THEN, I toed the throttle to open up the distance between us at 245kpm, with still 1000rpm to go.
Like was said, it's all in the gearing and cams, and the XJS is built for the long run. I love the handling and ride, and the rubber-necking looks as I cruise around or pull into a parking lot. Many people will openly come ovber to ask what IS this car, and circle around it in awe. -You just don't get that with Tuner cars, no matter how fancy the wheels.
After owning my car for a year and half, I wouldn't trade it for many cars worth twice the dollars...and I have had the offer.
Like was said, it's all in the gearing and cams, and the XJS is built for the long run. I love the handling and ride, and the rubber-necking looks as I cruise around or pull into a parking lot. Many people will openly come ovber to ask what IS this car, and circle around it in awe. -You just don't get that with Tuner cars, no matter how fancy the wheels.
After owning my car for a year and half, I wouldn't trade it for many cars worth twice the dollars...and I have had the offer.
#24
07-08-2013, 02:12 PM
Veteran Member
#26
07-08-2013, 05:16 PM
#27
07-08-2013, 05:22 PM
That 4.0 engine is pulling 4,000 lbs. If the car weighed 3,000 lbs it would be faster.
The tranny switch on the console will make the engine rev higher before it shifts if you put it in 'sport' but it won't make the car much faster to 60 mph. Just enjoy the ride. These cars look fast even though they aren't. If anyone challenges you to drag at lights just ignore them so as to not embarrass yourself.
Cheers, RagJag
The tranny switch on the console will make the engine rev higher before it shifts if you put it in 'sport' but it won't make the car much faster to 60 mph. Just enjoy the ride. These cars look fast even though they aren't. If anyone challenges you to drag at lights just ignore them so as to not embarrass yourself.
Cheers, RagJag
you got the point, this car is not as fast as it looks like, those mustang guys challenges me all the time, outrun me, show off in front of my jag, and I found out I can't even catch those Japanese cars. although speed is not the purpose I bought it, but I still get a bit frustrated every time it happens
#28
07-08-2013, 05:41 PM
I've enjoyed reading this thread, and as was the common feed, our XJS was never geared for neck snapping take-off acceleration, and I've had a couple 'Fart-Piped Tuner Cars' whip past me screaming -and I've let them, and by the same token, I've also taught an older hopped-up Camaro what the old V-12 can do when I let it stretch her legs after he passed me, hammer down. A long straight stretch of 4-lane opened up and at half throttle I cruised past him with a tip of the hat and THEN, I toed the throttle to open up the distance between us at 245kpm, with still 1000rpm to go.
Like was said, it's all in the gearing and cams, and the XJS is built for the long run. I love the handling and ride, and the rubber-necking looks as I cruise around or pull into a parking lot. Many people will openly come ovber to ask what IS this car, and circle around it in awe. -You just don't get that with Tuner cars, no matter how fancy the wheels.
After owning my car for a year and half, I wouldn't trade it for many cars worth twice the dollars...and I have had the offer.
Like was said, it's all in the gearing and cams, and the XJS is built for the long run. I love the handling and ride, and the rubber-necking looks as I cruise around or pull into a parking lot. Many people will openly come ovber to ask what IS this car, and circle around it in awe. -You just don't get that with Tuner cars, no matter how fancy the wheels.
After owning my car for a year and half, I wouldn't trade it for many cars worth twice the dollars...and I have had the offer.
this is my first car, it is a 4.0L version, I was looking for a old classic muscle for my first one, something like Chevelle SS, or a Buick,but for the MPG concern I bought this one, I love it, but recently I got several guys "showing off" with their mustangs on the road, that made me feel offended and found this car can't accelerate so well. it is a nice car though, a truly classic.
#29
07-08-2013, 06:04 PM
Veteran Member
sidescrollin was all over the reasons newer cars are faster. I agree with everything he said.
1977 Ferrari 308 GTB 0-60 mph 8.1 Quarter mile 16.8 -- according to 0-60 Times | 0 to 60 MPH and Quarter Mile Times for Fast Sports Cars, Muscle Cars, Luxury Car Performance Stats & more!
Not as quick as it looks.
Jaguars (this thread has been about post-XK-engined ones) may not all be quick from rest, but they are fast. Very easy to overtake, or get $300+ speeding tickets, or burn up hundreds of km on the autobahn.
For those interested, my XJS (AJ6, 5-spd) has covered 4000km so far this year at an average 28.5 mpg Imperial, or 23.7 mpg US, or 9.9 L/100km, mostly on two-lane blacktop through rural southern Ontario where the speed limit is mostly 80km/h. I know it's a heavy car but it is nimble.
1977 Ferrari 308 GTB 0-60 mph 8.1 Quarter mile 16.8 -- according to 0-60 Times | 0 to 60 MPH and Quarter Mile Times for Fast Sports Cars, Muscle Cars, Luxury Car Performance Stats & more!
Not as quick as it looks.
Jaguars (this thread has been about post-XK-engined ones) may not all be quick from rest, but they are fast. Very easy to overtake, or get $300+ speeding tickets, or burn up hundreds of km on the autobahn.
For those interested, my XJS (AJ6, 5-spd) has covered 4000km so far this year at an average 28.5 mpg Imperial, or 23.7 mpg US, or 9.9 L/100km, mostly on two-lane blacktop through rural southern Ontario where the speed limit is mostly 80km/h. I know it's a heavy car but it is nimble.
#30
07-08-2013, 06:38 PM
the XJS is not a sports car, neither is the XK8. The F-type is the first sports car they have made in nearly 30 years.
Don't expect to be blowing peoples doors off just because it is a jag or just because you have a V12.
A number of cylinders has NO correlation with its power, it is merely a different way of accomplishing the same thing. V12s are incredibly smooth and balanced, but they are complicated. The idea that a V12 is powerful and fast is only in your head because the excessive engineering has always been reserved for nicer, more powerful cars.
There have been transitions over time of large engines and large cylinders to smaller ones as we get more efficient. We used to make inline 8s, V10s, V12s. V8s were popular throughout the 90s and 2000s but if you notice V6s are becoming "the new V8".
With that out of the way, look at what the XJS is and WHEN it is. The XJS primarily lives in the 80s. It has a 5.3l v12 that makes roughly 300hp. This is at a time when corvettes, camaros, Mustangs, etc had V8s between 5 and 6 litres that made 150-250hp.
On to new cars. They are more efficient, require less maintenance, and make more power. The 70s and 80s were a time of NEW emissions regulations that, compounded with NEW fuel injection technology, equaled an industry wide fumble with engineering. All of this was new and had little engineering development compared to today. Cars of the 60s made more power, but the systems used there were 60 years in development. Bottomline, it was inefficient, and all cars from this era are in some sense.
To cap this all off NEW cars are made for regular people and this means the power is designed to either be low down, or the car is designed to kickdown very quickly and take power off the top. New cars (im using the term as in new econoboxs and common cars) will beat an XJS from 0-60 for several reasons. The biggest in my opinion is the 3 speed transmission. You have a tranny with only 3 speeds that has to be spread out so the vehicle has a high top speed and accomplishes acceptable MPG. To achieve a decent top end and MPG acceleration suffers. Throw a 5 or 6 speed in an XJS and it will surprise you.
I drive my girlfriends 2009 kia suv that makes more power than my XJS on a regular basis. While it feels snappier and will throw you in the seat when you floor it, it is overall much slower.
Rentals and friends cars I have driven all do the EXACT same thing. They instantly kickdown and rev the ever-loving **** out of the car. You get all the power and are able to pass in traffic. That is ALL they are designed to do. It is not at all smooth and it is totally uncomfortable, not to mention it sounds like the car is going to explode.
While my XJS is not much off the line, get up in the revs on the highway and it feels UNSTOPPABLE. This is 100% the transmission in my opinion. The XJS has a broad power band of smooth power, when i pass in traffic it doesnt feel like a kick and take off, its a smooth acceleration. However, what feels like a 150mph kick in the *** to pass the car ahead in a new car thats actually only going 35mph, is a wafty and unnoticeable jump to 60mph before you even notice in an XJS.
I cannot speak for the 6 cylinder, but taken for what it really is, the XJS does not at all disappoint me. It is one of the fastest cars of its time and the tranny is its downfall.
If you can take a v12 xjs on the highway and tell me you are disappointed you are being unrealistic. I traveled through lower georgia once averaging 95mph and it felt like 55.. The XJS truly is a grand touring machine, if you let it do what it was designed, it eats the road alive.
Don't expect to be blowing peoples doors off just because it is a jag or just because you have a V12.
A number of cylinders has NO correlation with its power, it is merely a different way of accomplishing the same thing. V12s are incredibly smooth and balanced, but they are complicated. The idea that a V12 is powerful and fast is only in your head because the excessive engineering has always been reserved for nicer, more powerful cars.
There have been transitions over time of large engines and large cylinders to smaller ones as we get more efficient. We used to make inline 8s, V10s, V12s. V8s were popular throughout the 90s and 2000s but if you notice V6s are becoming "the new V8".
With that out of the way, look at what the XJS is and WHEN it is. The XJS primarily lives in the 80s. It has a 5.3l v12 that makes roughly 300hp. This is at a time when corvettes, camaros, Mustangs, etc had V8s between 5 and 6 litres that made 150-250hp.
On to new cars. They are more efficient, require less maintenance, and make more power. The 70s and 80s were a time of NEW emissions regulations that, compounded with NEW fuel injection technology, equaled an industry wide fumble with engineering. All of this was new and had little engineering development compared to today. Cars of the 60s made more power, but the systems used there were 60 years in development. Bottomline, it was inefficient, and all cars from this era are in some sense.
To cap this all off NEW cars are made for regular people and this means the power is designed to either be low down, or the car is designed to kickdown very quickly and take power off the top. New cars (im using the term as in new econoboxs and common cars) will beat an XJS from 0-60 for several reasons. The biggest in my opinion is the 3 speed transmission. You have a tranny with only 3 speeds that has to be spread out so the vehicle has a high top speed and accomplishes acceptable MPG. To achieve a decent top end and MPG acceleration suffers. Throw a 5 or 6 speed in an XJS and it will surprise you.
I drive my girlfriends 2009 kia suv that makes more power than my XJS on a regular basis. While it feels snappier and will throw you in the seat when you floor it, it is overall much slower.
Rentals and friends cars I have driven all do the EXACT same thing. They instantly kickdown and rev the ever-loving **** out of the car. You get all the power and are able to pass in traffic. That is ALL they are designed to do. It is not at all smooth and it is totally uncomfortable, not to mention it sounds like the car is going to explode.
While my XJS is not much off the line, get up in the revs on the highway and it feels UNSTOPPABLE. This is 100% the transmission in my opinion. The XJS has a broad power band of smooth power, when i pass in traffic it doesnt feel like a kick and take off, its a smooth acceleration. However, what feels like a 150mph kick in the *** to pass the car ahead in a new car thats actually only going 35mph, is a wafty and unnoticeable jump to 60mph before you even notice in an XJS.
I cannot speak for the 6 cylinder, but taken for what it really is, the XJS does not at all disappoint me. It is one of the fastest cars of its time and the tranny is its downfall.
If you can take a v12 xjs on the highway and tell me you are disappointed you are being unrealistic. I traveled through lower georgia once averaging 95mph and it felt like 55.. The XJS truly is a grand touring machine, if you let it do what it was designed, it eats the road alive.
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#31
07-11-2013, 04:59 PM
Veteran Member
Jaguarlover, excellent question - with excellent replies all around. I'll throw in my 2 cents, especially regarding what Spikepaga brought up.
Is your XJS properly tuned? This can make a tremendous difference. My first XJS, an 89.5 bought in the mid 90s, was slow. I mean slow slow. Sluggish, lethargic, a real disappointment anywhere but on the open freeway. But creamy smooth.
I had no frame of reference, the WWW & Jaglovers were barely coming into existence, and the waiting list for the one Jag specialist in town was usually weeks long.
That one burned itself to a crisp, and I was left with bitter memories - LOL. Fast forward a few years, I'm in a large city, much better educated about the vehicles, and decided to give ownership another go. Like night and day is how I'd describe it. This 89.5 (damn near identical to the first, just different wheels), is a beast! No modifications that I'm aware of, but it will bark the tires all day long from takeoff and when shifting into 2nd at full throttle.
I'm under no illusions that I will beat any Camry or minivan off the line, but I know that it's now running as intended from the factory. And it's an awesome experience being wafted along with that (I know it's overused, but...)turbine-like rush of seamless power.
If you'd like to modernize performance, I'd suggest the following:
- get it running right
- gut the cats if you don't need to pass emissions
- polyurethane bushings (for improved steering feel)
- upgrade the brakes (need to be able to stop before going fast)
- FORCED INDUCTION (fellas, can he swap in an XJR-S motor??)
Welcome, get her running as the factory intended, then reevaluate. At least you can always feign disinterest when challenged to a race, and casually drive off with an air of indifference / superiority
Is your XJS properly tuned? This can make a tremendous difference. My first XJS, an 89.5 bought in the mid 90s, was slow. I mean slow slow. Sluggish, lethargic, a real disappointment anywhere but on the open freeway. But creamy smooth.
I had no frame of reference, the WWW & Jaglovers were barely coming into existence, and the waiting list for the one Jag specialist in town was usually weeks long.
That one burned itself to a crisp, and I was left with bitter memories - LOL. Fast forward a few years, I'm in a large city, much better educated about the vehicles, and decided to give ownership another go. Like night and day is how I'd describe it. This 89.5 (damn near identical to the first, just different wheels), is a beast! No modifications that I'm aware of, but it will bark the tires all day long from takeoff and when shifting into 2nd at full throttle.
I'm under no illusions that I will beat any Camry or minivan off the line, but I know that it's now running as intended from the factory. And it's an awesome experience being wafted along with that (I know it's overused, but...)turbine-like rush of seamless power.
If you'd like to modernize performance, I'd suggest the following:
- get it running right
- gut the cats if you don't need to pass emissions
- polyurethane bushings (for improved steering feel)
- upgrade the brakes (need to be able to stop before going fast)
- FORCED INDUCTION (fellas, can he swap in an XJR-S motor??)
Welcome, get her running as the factory intended, then reevaluate. At least you can always feign disinterest when challenged to a race, and casually drive off with an air of indifference / superiority
#33
07-12-2013, 08:04 AM
Another thing you can do to improve performance is install Andy Stodart's 5 degree advance bracket on AJ6 and AJ16 engines.
I have just installed it on my 94 and it makes a palpable difference in acceleration and drivability. The thing that I like the most is that it definitely improves engine response in the 1500-2500 rpm range where the the AJ6 can feel a little lazy. Fuel economy appears to have improved a bit also but I have only driven about 150 miles so need a a few more tankfuls to see how much.
I'll post next week on my impressions.
Here is a link to the thread that explains the bracket https://www.jaguarforums.com/forum/x...nigines-66536/
Cheers,
Allan
I have just installed it on my 94 and it makes a palpable difference in acceleration and drivability. The thing that I like the most is that it definitely improves engine response in the 1500-2500 rpm range where the the AJ6 can feel a little lazy. Fuel economy appears to have improved a bit also but I have only driven about 150 miles so need a a few more tankfuls to see how much.
I'll post next week on my impressions.
Here is a link to the thread that explains the bracket https://www.jaguarforums.com/forum/x...nigines-66536/
Cheers,
Allan
Last edited by AllanG; 07-12-2013 at 06:19 PM.
#34
07-12-2013, 10:32 AM
Jaguarlover, excellent question - with excellent replies all around. I'll throw in my 2 cents, especially regarding what Spikepaga brought up.
Is your XJS properly tuned? This can make a tremendous difference. My first XJS, an 89.5 bought in the mid 90s, was slow. I mean slow slow. Sluggish, lethargic, a real disappointment anywhere but on the open freeway. But creamy smooth.
I had no frame of reference, the WWW & Jaglovers were barely coming into existence, and the waiting list for the one Jag specialist in town was usually weeks long.
That one burned itself to a crisp, and I was left with bitter memories - LOL. Fast forward a few years, I'm in a large city, much better educated about the vehicles, and decided to give ownership another go. Like night and day is how I'd describe it. This 89.5 (damn near identical to the first, just different wheels), is a beast! No modifications that I'm aware of, but it will bark the tires all day long from takeoff and when shifting into 2nd at full throttle.
I'm under no illusions that I will beat any Camry or minivan off the line, but I know that it's now running as intended from the factory. And it's an awesome experience being wafted along with that (I know it's overused, but...)turbine-like rush of seamless power.
If you'd like to modernize performance, I'd suggest the following:
- get it running right
- gut the cats if you don't need to pass emissions
- polyurethane bushings (for improved steering feel)
- upgrade the brakes (need to be able to stop before going fast)
- FORCED INDUCTION (fellas, can he swap in an XJR-S motor??)
Welcome, get her running as the factory intended, then reevaluate. At least you can always feign disinterest when challenged to a race, and casually drive off with an air of indifference / superiority
Is your XJS properly tuned? This can make a tremendous difference. My first XJS, an 89.5 bought in the mid 90s, was slow. I mean slow slow. Sluggish, lethargic, a real disappointment anywhere but on the open freeway. But creamy smooth.
I had no frame of reference, the WWW & Jaglovers were barely coming into existence, and the waiting list for the one Jag specialist in town was usually weeks long.
That one burned itself to a crisp, and I was left with bitter memories - LOL. Fast forward a few years, I'm in a large city, much better educated about the vehicles, and decided to give ownership another go. Like night and day is how I'd describe it. This 89.5 (damn near identical to the first, just different wheels), is a beast! No modifications that I'm aware of, but it will bark the tires all day long from takeoff and when shifting into 2nd at full throttle.
I'm under no illusions that I will beat any Camry or minivan off the line, but I know that it's now running as intended from the factory. And it's an awesome experience being wafted along with that (I know it's overused, but...)turbine-like rush of seamless power.
If you'd like to modernize performance, I'd suggest the following:
- get it running right
- gut the cats if you don't need to pass emissions
- polyurethane bushings (for improved steering feel)
- upgrade the brakes (need to be able to stop before going fast)
- FORCED INDUCTION (fellas, can he swap in an XJR-S motor??)
Welcome, get her running as the factory intended, then reevaluate. At least you can always feign disinterest when challenged to a race, and casually drive off with an air of indifference / superiority
Thanks！
I think it is tuned properly, I dropped it off to a local jaguar specialist before, he said everything is just fine,
I think my situation is similar with your situation when you having your first XJS, lacking experience and educations of cars. but I will try your suggestions. thank you !
#35
07-12-2013, 11:06 AM
Veteran Member
Here ya go... damn sure he won't get anywhere near $20k though...
Jaguar : XJS XJS in Jaguar | eBay Motors
Jaguar : XJS XJS in Jaguar | eBay Motors
#36
07-12-2013, 11:15 AM
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Here ya go... damn sure he won't get anywhere near $20k though...
Jaguar : XJS XJS in Jaguar | eBay Motors
Jaguar : XJS XJS in Jaguar | eBay Motors
Off topic:
Too bad Jaguar couldn't manage getting the top to fold down more fully into the body. The "top stack" really spoils the lines, IMHO.
Cheers
DD
#38
07-12-2013, 05:35 PM
I think the problem was that the XJS was originally designed as a coupe only. When they did decide to make the convertible, the only way to give it a flat deck and keep the lines would be to give up some boot space and/or fuel tankage or use a thin unlined top with a lightweight frame. Probably none of those choices were palatable.Cheers,
Allan
Last edited by AllanG; 07-12-2013 at 06:20 PM.
#40
07-13-2013, 10:03 AM
Here ya go... damn sure he won't get anywhere near $20k though...
Jaguar : XJS XJS in Jaguar | eBay Motors
Jaguar : XJS XJS in Jaguar | eBay Motors