Have pretty much everything loose and disconnected, the only thing remaining is the starter - how is one supposed to disconnect that beast - can barely see it let alone disconnect it and my engine is sat on axle stands so I can't be poking around unnecessarily under there, that and some areas are restricted by the position of the stands. There is a heavy wire at the bulkhead - cloth covered - can't see where it comes from or goes to other than down, I can see the alternator cable goes through a metal tube on the side of the engine, this disappears behind the starter heat shields so may have mounts that I can't see. Is this a case of drop the starter then disconnect ? - the exhaust is long since out of the way.

I want to make sure 110% that everything underneath is undone because the first plan is to lower the engine at the same time as the entire car, once I do this there is no going back under the car without major hassle. I'll put the chassis on the stands and the cars rear on its wheels, this will give me additional height on the crane, it will also allow me to reset the sill jacks since the car over the last 12 months has settled backward and one of the rubber pad's it is on is looking a tad sketchy and has quite a lean on it. Also noticed that one of my rear subframe mounts has separated.

 

The starter positive cable comes from the RHS firewall post. If you undo it there, it will come out with the engine. No need to touch the alternator as it goes via the starter and uses the starter positive cable.
If the downpipes are still on the manifolds, they will catch on the cross member V mounts, which have to be removed to get the engine out! As I found out the hard way...
In this pic the blue line shows the starter cable undone from the firewall post. Also the part of the downpipe that catches on the V mounts attached to the lower chassis rail.

 

My crossmember is out - actually my old subframe is languishiung at the side of the driveway - I've a nice shiny one ready to go back.

Where are the solenoid activation wires or have I already inadvertently disconnected - it isn't very obvious - can't see how the starter is grounded.

My biggest issue is that the car is on top of quick jacks, all the front suspension is off and the engine is sat on two 6 ton axle stands (only ones high enough) - but that means the car needs to be dropped which I cannot do until I undo the transmission mount which I cannot do until the engine is suspended. I'm tempted to lower the engine and box to the floor on some 6x4's then lower the car and then pull the engine and box - I don't have the vertical space available to lift it all out with the car as high as it is, I've no way to do Grants trick with a skateboard - 1 I have no skateboard, 2 I'm an abject coward I hate being under suspended loads - don't even like being under the car it creeps me out.

 

My positive cable is connected through the tube you mention that runs through to the alternator. Yes it is easist to disconnect the wires with it removed.

It bolts from back of the starter on the transmission side with a 12 point head bolt on top, 6 point on the bottom. I had to remove the 3 mounting bolts of the steering rack and lower it to get it out of the way. May not be necessary if you are lifting the engine out.

 

Getting the starter out in place is not easy at all. As Jeff mentioned, the top bolt is a 12 point. It's not easy, but clean it first if you can to get all the dirt and oil off the bolt head before putting a socket on. I didn't, and started to round off the head of the bolt. It sometimes helps to hammer it on to make sure the socket is seated fully on the bolt head. You'll need a swivel and bunch of extensions.

The starter grounds through the bellhousing and then via the earth straps back to the body.

 

Ben

The MAIN power cable is as Greg stated.

The solenoid activation wire is the White/Red wire that runs past the trans dipstick RED top, where there is a joiner (male.female spade). Unplug that joiner, if its not already disturbed, This joiner can also be easily disturbed when checking trans fluid levels later, so remember that one.

The Ground is via the bolts that hold it to the engine assembly and the engine earth straps fiasco.

 

All disconnects at high level in bulkhead area - roger that - thanks all.

There isn't a whole lot under the engine currently except a pair of axle stands one for each engine mount and the driveway, you can just see the left hand sill jack (QuickJack), this was taken before I gave up fighting and removed the bonnet. Welding is completed, I was putting things back together when even more opportunities presented themselves to delay the project.

So tempted to put a new starter on this just because the engine is out because this task is clearly not a job I want to undertake in future once re-assembled.

 

AAAAAH Ben

I have never had starter issues with any Jag, 6 or 12.

BUT

All my Jags ALWAYS started on the very 1st rotation of the starter motor. NONE of this cranking nonsense until it catches.

If one had a Female moment, the cranking was ALWAYS at a very minimum, thus saving the starter motor.
One V12, the PreHE XJ12 I think?? went odd. When I got it out, HAHAHA, that was NOT fun, and reduction starters were not around back then, I went looking.

Eventually found the 2 Solenoid wires, inside the solder blob, between the 2 threaded studs, were able to be moved slightly. NOT what you want. BIG MOTHER soldering iron, and "reflowed" the solder.

Never had an issue after that, and that starter is the 1976 unit the car came with, and that car is at 655000kms now,.

Service the one you got, and dont crank it relentlessly, and it will never fail.

 

I aim for my engine to be no different and catch first turn, I am actually quite obsessive about such things, I don't do the breakdown thing - leastways not if a bit of appropriate maintenance can prevent. Wisdom assimilated, it shall be so. I'll check the windings etc, service and put back.

 

Ben
You will notice when you get there, that the charging cable from the alternator to the starter positive pole is actually two not very big diameter cables! When in there, replace this with one large diameter positive cable.

I hesitate to disagree with the Great XJS Prophet of the Southern Cross (bow to the south east at the mention of his name) but I have had a starter fail - maybe a climate thing. I would buy and fit a nice new gear reduction starter from Fosseway Performance.

 

I'll do some navel gazing when I service it - already have the brake bleed stuff from Fosseway on the bench. I wonder some of it isn't the driving scenario's - here in the UK there isn't much 'open road' these days around the major cities, I live in a rural area so we face the hoards of caravans and suchlike so being nose to tail in traffic isn't unusual so airflow under the bonnet will be bad to non existent a lot of the time here. I don't however have any desire for cutting in vents.

I've googled around some and I think a mistake many make if they introduce electric fans is to allow them to stop - at least the belt driven is always moving 'some' air - and yes not that I've gone this far I'm considering going electric with potential for manual override / control.

 

Greg,

I would use a reduction if needed these days. The ones on offer way back then were rubbish, and fitting was a LOT of hot and miss in my opinion. Things have changed in 30 years, thank goodness sometimes.

Ben,
As for the Efans and traffic.
My LH fan is A/C controlled, meaning A/C is ON so is that fan.
The RH is thermo, using the factory switch in the water pump Inlet.
Without the A/C on, that Thermo fan rarely cuts on, even in traffic snarls, which here can last 30 minutes.
With the A/C on, and 45C outside, the Thermo fan NEVER cuts in. I have an override for that fan, just in case back in the day, and have never needed to use it.

The airflow OUT of the engine bay is more important, in my opinion, than air IN.
Inbound air is a given, even at 10MPH, but getting that air out is an issue. The foam pad on top of the transmission, once glued to the tunnel, and IF its still there, many are not, is the single biggest outbound air issue I have had on any of them.

 

Well your climate would test things for sure - 45C ... nay thanks that's about 30 degrees too hot for me.

That sounds like a vote for going electric though, and I am leaning that way, given that I've surpassed what I paid for the car in what I've spent to date - significantly so.

I never turn off the AC in my cars because it does so much more than cool.

 

Put me down as one who has had a starter fail too. It actually seized up, but the time I figure out what was happening and disconnected the wires at battery the wires were too hot to touch. Everything inside the starter melted from all the current going through it.

In order to get the starter out I had to drop the exhaust downpipe on the right side. Even with the car on a hoist it wasn't an easy job.

 

I'm forced to be brutally honest and say that once I put this car back together I really don't want to be spending more time under it than driving it for something I can pre-empt, health and other issues are closing in on me and this will likely be the last project I complete, I'm already considering parting with the others - I currently have 5 vehicular projects on the go although two of them were obtained simply to keep them out of the scrapyard, one of them I simply cannot get the parts for and I've been searching for a decade the only option now is manufacture and that is crazy money - jury is out on where I'll go with them.

I've been told that my particular starter as fitted is an early type by a Jaguar specialist that are prone to failing without warning, I was actually looking for service parts when I was given this information.

To that end I am more than likely going to put in a WOST LMS017 geared starter, as ,much as I value Grants advice he's never steered anyone wrong but I'm going the easy route on this one - albeit a tad expensive.

 

The engine and box are on the floor - and not accidentally - didn't even need to lower the car so it is still on the sill jacks. In the end I pulled it complete with prop shaft - there was no shifting the front bolts - was easy peasy with it in the air as its angle made access possible with the impact wrench.

I know Grant mentioned a foam pad but man I wasn't prepared for that thing - wow - fire hazard or what, I can see why this pad would limit airflow - tunnels lovely and clean where it was though.

I also got out every single bolt from the thermostat rails intact and only one thread looks like it needs attention but there's plenty of good thread in there but I'll do a decent inspection when I don't hurt so much. Just the broken one to deal with now - nuts ordered, I'll try welding a nut to it first and hit it with the air hammer and then the impact wrench. I tried the induction heater on it but it is having none of it and I got it really hot.

I've got to recommend when doing hoses etc on a resurrection that the thermostat rail seals are done - all 4 of mine are toast - you can break them with a hammer ...