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New to Me 88 XJS V12 2nd Drive and Thoughts/Questions
Warning: Long post, grab a cup of PG Tips before reading.
I just took my new to me '88 XJS V12 for a short drive to put some fuel in it. It re-started there, so I took a gamble and stopped another place to get some beer. Some observations and thoughts that have come in the 30 or so miles I've driven the car since I've owned it:
Transmission was bad when I bought the car. I knew this, and it was priced accordingly. I got the tranny rebuilt. There was a bit of miscommunication, and the shop owner didn't talk to me until after he had the car back together. The transmission mount is bad, and he didn't know where to get another one. This was before I looked up pics of the XJS trans mount and its oddball spring-loaded construction. I found a likely replacement on Jagbits, but I want to get a look at exactly what's wrong before I start buying more parts. WOT upshifts and hard bumps cause the transmission to hit the floor pan. It doesn't do that in mild to moderate driving.
The fuel gauge works, sort of. The PO said he put 5 gallons in to get it running and smogged after two years sitting. The gauge was always on E. However, the fuel light came on as I was leaving the tranny shop in Reno. I drove it 25 miles home, then parked it until today when I took it out and put 14 gallons in. According to the owner's manual, which actually came with the car and looks like it's never been used, that should be a bit more than half tank. The gauge shows a bit less than half tank. I reset the trip odometer and then learned the next thing.
I wondered how a car with under 93,000 miles could have as many problems and be in as poor of a condition as this one is. Then I found out that the odometer only works some of the time. Same with the speedometer. Seems like about 2-4 miles from a cold start is when it decides to start reading.
The driver's door only opens from the inside. This is far and away the most annoying thing about the car. I'm fixing that before I mess with anything else.
Driver seat belt issues. As in the shoulder belt is missing. The lab belt is there, but the buckle for it seems to have been ripped in half.
The center brake light is falling out of its mount, but it does work.
Power windows don't work. I've read elsewhere that it tends to be the switches, but I need to troubleshoot before I order parts. Driver's is up, passenger halfway down. I'd like it better the other way. Hard to hear the V-12 with the window up.
The wheels are 20". The tires are crap and might be a little flat spotted from sitting. 16" wheels from a 90's XJS are on the way. Tires to match are already sitting in my garage.
The temperature gauge stayed right in the center on the trip home from Reno. Driving around it became slightly elevated. I downloaded the .pdf on recommended cooling system maintenance. I'm not sure where to buy all the stuff.
Oil pressure. It doesn't read above 50 on a cold start, and reads near, but not at 0 on hot idle. I'm thinking it's more likely the gauge, than the actual pressure. Is there a good spot to hook up an auxiliary gauge? Then engine didn't sound like it was running with collapsed lifters, which is probably good, but leads to another question. Does this thing even have hydraulic lifters?
Exhaust smell. Right bank running warm doesn't smell like anything. Left bank has a faint odor that I think might be burning engine oil. No visible smoke once warmed up. Once warmed up.
Poor running when cold. It seems to have gotten better this trip than the other two times I started it. Might clear up with additional running. If not, I'll be back on to see what to check. I've read that the fuel injection in this thing is a Lucas copy of Bosch D-Jet, with which I'm vaguely familiar.
Battery is bad. If I leave it on a tender in the garage, it will re-start (slowly) shortly after being driven.
Parking brake does not work. Parking brake indicator stays on at all times. When attempting to engage the parking brake, the lever falls back down to the rest position.
Other stuff: Windshield wipers don't work. Paint is awful but there's no rust on the body (at least that I've found so far). I haven't tried the radio or the aircon. Both left side headlights come on with the switch. The right ones don't. I found the fuse box cover in the trunk, but I haven't found the fuse box yet. Oh, and the hood struts are shot. Exhaust has been modified and seems to sound good, but not quite loud enough for my liking. Low priority at the moment. Air cleaner assemblies seem to have been modified. Does anyone have pics of stock? Day I checked it out before buying.
So, what are you're thoughts? After I make it so I can get in the thing normally, what should I work on next?
Your parking brake is fine you've just been burning the pads off, gotta jack it up one more notch then button in and pu it down.
Poor running can be quite a list of neglected things, but you can start with proper ultra premium gas and an Italian tune-up. Do NOT use regular.
Oil pressure is usually low on these engines, even with nice thick 20w50 it will lazily tick over at near '0' while hot
Gauge or instrumemt controls etc aswell as engine wiring probably have cruddy connections at this point, expect to spend some time with electrical cleaner and a tootbbrush.
Cooling system must be a priority, aswell as rubber fuel hoses. Expect all rubber to be crap by this age, it may be worth it to get the system professionally flushed as the v12 cooling sys can collect quite alot of sludge, bits of rubber, sand etc inside the rad.
Read Kirby Palms book, and everything Grant says on the forum here, learn to laugh (or cry its up to you) and remember they are really very simple cars.
SNGBarrat, JaguarClassicParts, Welsh Enterprises are all good suppliers.
Last edited by VancouverXJ6; 11-02-2019 at 08:54 PM.
The fuel gauge works, sort of. The PO said he put 5 gallons in to get it running and smogged after two years sitting. The gauge was always on E. However, the fuel light came on as I was leaving the tranny shop in Reno. I drove it 25 miles home, then parked it until today when I took it out and put 14 gallons in. According to the owner's manual, which actually came with the car and looks like it's never been used, that should be a bit more than half tank. The gauge shows a bit less than half tank. I reset the trip odometer and then learned the next thing.
Probably needs a new sending unit; not expensive, EZ to replace
But, the gauges themselves are known to be flakey. Removing the cluster to clean all the contacts and add an extra ground wire usually restores normal operation
I wondered how a car with under 93,000 miles could have as many problems and be in as poor of a condition as this one is. Then I found out that the odometer only works some of the time. Same with the speedometer. Seems like about 2-4 miles from a cold start is when it decides to start reading.
It ain't the miles. It's neglect. Problems have surely been accumulating for years but nobody fixed 'em along the way.
Driver seat belt issues. As in the shoulder belt is missing. The lab belt is there, but the buckle for it seems to have been ripped in half.
Probably has the motorized shoulder belts, which gave problems. Somebody got annoyed enough to just remove it
The temperature gauge stayed right in the center on the trip home from Reno. Driving around it became slightly elevated. I downloaded the .pdf on recommended cooling system maintenance. I'm not sure where to buy all the stuff.
It's all readily available. When you're ready to begin give a shout and we'll help
Oil pressure. It doesn't read above 50 on a cold start, and reads near, but not at 0 on hot idle. I'm thinking it's more likely the gauge, than the actual pressure.
That's probably IS the actual pressure, or close, and there's nothing wrong with it
. Does this thing even have hydraulic lifters?
No
Parking brake does not work.
The parking brake caliper are probably seized from lack of use
Parking brake indicator stays on at all times.
Switch needs cleaning and adjusting, or perhaps replacement
When attempting to engage the parking brake, the lever falls back down to the rest position.
Normal. It drops back down so it isn't in the way on entering/exiting the car. When you fix the parking brakes you'll pull up to engage them and then let the lever drop down. Then, to disengage, pull the lever all the way and let it comes back down
So, what are you're thoughts? After I make it so I can get in the thing normally, what should I work on next?
New fuel hoses should be high on your list unless you're sure they've been recently replaced
Your parking brake probably is on! Pull up the lever again, push the button on the end and release. When the brake is on or off the lever will be against the floor to allow easy entry and exit from the car.
Welcome to the forum and welcome to a world of fun. My knowledge is limited but for a starters
The transmission mount is bad, - look up Wheeler Dealers episode on the XJS - Ed changed one of these out
The fuel gauge works - normal for these to read low - full tank is just over 90 litres (24 gallons).
The odometer only works some of the time - Cannot help at all with this as mine is cable driven
Power windows don't work. I've read elsewhere that it tends to be the switches - yes - usually switches - fairly easy to remove the area around the gear stick and swap things around and clean up to start finding the issues. Again - Ed removed this area to reapply the wood work in the wheeler dealer episode
The wheels are 20". The tires are crap and might be a little flat spotted from sitting.- their has been a recent post regarding tires just recently - lots of different responses from many members which tend to lean towards the same outcome
The temperature gauge stayed right in the center on the trip home from Reno. Driving around it became slightly elevated - sounds promising, you will get recommended to change out all the hoses from our experienced people, but this sounds better than normal
Oil pressure. It doesn't read above 50 on a cold start, and reads near, but not at 0 on hot idle. V12 runs at low oil pressure - so this is normal. Apparently the oil pump is bullet proof Is there a good spot to hook up an auxiliary gauge? - no idea Does this thing even have hydraulic lifters? - no idea
Poor running when cold. It seems to have gotten better this trip than the other two times I started it. Might clear up with additional running - might need a Ferrari tune up
Parking brake does not work. Parking brake indicator stays on at all times. When attempting to engage the parking brake, the lever falls back down to the rest position. This parking brake was used on a lot of Australian cars, therefore we are use to them. They do not stay in the up position when applied - but are designed to fall freely to the floor after engaging. So you basically lift the handle up - push the botton and lift up that little bit more, and then with the button still pressed - drop it down to the floor. Since you have been driving it around with the red light - you might need to repair the hand brake pads.
I found the fuse box cover in the trunk, but I haven't found the fuse box yet. - I think yours and mine are different, My main fuse box is below the steering wheel, near my speed foot (Right hand drive), There is another fuse box station near the front left hand mud guard. There might be another one on yours under the glove box - but I could be wrong
Hood struts are shot - so were mine - very cheap to replace.
Welcome to the fun - from the photo - it looks good
First of all, buy yourself a new battery. That will do a lot to reduce the amount of uncertainty about the car. Then download Kirby Palm's book, "Help for the XJS owner." He has a helpful section on the tranny mount. Skim through the whole book stopping on relevant topics. It will answer a lot of questions. Your question, How can a car with such low mileage have so many problems? Easy, it's a 31 year old car that once cost 60,000 dollars. Maintenance and repairs were expensive when it was new, and are just as expensive now. Therefore it has built up a huge amount of deferred maintenance and repairs as it made it's way down the social scale of ownership. Now it is in your hands. If you are the rich, check writing type, then you can find a good shop and let them bring it back to health. If, like most of us on the forum, you are already handy with tools or willing to learn, than you can handle most of the repair work yourself. There is a huge learning curve with these cars, no body builds a car quite like the British. You will find the proper attitude is also helpful. Don't see yourself fighting with the car, instead think of it as a relationship. You will find this forum to be an extremely knowledgeable and helpful community. You've come to the right place. Good Luck and have fun. At least you are starting off with a running car!
Easy, it's a 31 year old car that once cost 60,000 dollars. Maintenance and repairs were expensive when it was new, and are just as expensive now. Therefore it has built up a huge amount of deferred maintenance and repairs as it made it's way down the social scale of ownership.
Precisely this. I just looked up retail MSRP for the XJS, it was the equivalent of a $146,000 dollar car by the end of the 80s.
Trans mount sort out = 6-8 beers.
Cooling system, including ALL the hoses, = 48 beers at best.
Wiring, as in EFI loom, etc ,etc, = 24 beers, maybe more, depending on how reliable YOU want this thing.
Fuel system = 10 beers if you are smart.
My beers are the Aussie Standard Stubby (375ml), NOT the Darwin Stubby.
NEVER, and I mean NEVER let the car know yow are scared of it, it is a Big Cat, and Big Cats sense fear, and you WILL lose.
Last edited by Grant Francis; 11-03-2019 at 08:07 PM.
Welcome to the club. Like everyone mentioned before tackle the little stuff first. It will give u confidence in seeing progress and in turn make things go better.
My 88 didnt even run when I got it. A few days later it was alive. Invest in hand cleaner lol.
Read everything. Kirby's book is the bomb at 700 plus pages.
Thanks to all for the replies. I just tried the parking brake via the old "put it in neutral and see if you can roll it" trick. Parking brake is definitely inoperable. I started it while I was messing with it and the poor running while cold seems to be resolving on its own. I have a short day at work tomorrow, so I think I'll take it to the grocery store afterward and then maybe start on the driver's door.
I was probably flummoxed by the condition vs miles because my Mercedes had 200,000 more miles on it when I bought it and was in better shape. However, it was only 22 years old at the time, and I'm only the third or fourth owner.
Be careful with the metal collar on the armrest there is a screw behind it, one of a few needed to get the door panel our, my Jag mechanic suggested petroleum jelly so as to minimize scraping on the swollen leather armrest
I ended up not messing with the driver's door (yet). I managed to work 12 days in a row across three jobs, then got a weekend off. I had to do some stuff around the house, so the Jaguar sat. The wheels I ordered showed up, and I got the tires mounted on them today. Then I found out the jack is missing and my bottle jack doesn't fit under the front jack points. So, I went to Harbor Freight and got myself a low profile floor jack. Quite nice considering what I paid for it. First two wheels and tires went on this evening. I'll get the other side tomorrow if I don't go to my side job*. Air filters should be in also.
*Long story made short: Hours at my main job got cut, so I got a side gig as a heavy equipment operator at a golf course run by a friend of mine. The loader I'm supposed to be running experienced brake and partial transmission failure yesterday. While I was hired as an operator at that job, I'm allegedly a diesel and heavy equipment mechanic at one of my other jobs. I found the operator's and parts manuals for the loader, did some reading, and came up with a probable diagnosis for each problem. However, I'm working my main job and another guy is supposed to be fixing the loader. I texted him my thoughts, and both problems should be relatively easy fixes, but will require buying parts. I doubt it will be fixed by tomorrow afternoon.
Sometimes work really does get in the way of playtime - it is not uncommon for me to work 13 days straight (12 hour shifts + travel time) then have a "rest day" and then start the cycle again. Just have to remind yourself that the Jag will be there waiting patiently for you when you are in the right head space.
For the door handle - depending on what is wrong, can either be a easy job, or a intensive job. For me to fix mine - I had to remove the window to get access to the handle, just so I could see what I was doing (sort off). For those who know how to feel around in the cavity, the window can stay in
I'm on a work trip, so the car is about 500 miles away right now. I downloaded Kirby's book and it's interesting reading. The airbox mods made by a previous owner make a bit more sense now. The thing will be going back to the transmission shop after I get home. For starters, it leaks. Second, it doesn't behave the way I want. My tranny guy and I need to have a discussion about shift points and firmness and the meaning of "performance rebuild", since I asked for one and don't feel like I've gotten one. On the up side, the parts I ordered showed up and the bonnet struts went on before Thanksgiving dinner. And Jagbits might have the part I need to get the driver seatbelt usable again. Thanks to all for the suggestions.
11-02-2019, 08:12 PM
New to Me 88 XJS V12 2nd Drive and Thoughts/Questions
