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I'm a crossover from the X-350 section who has the XJS bug pretty bad. Trying to avoid mistakes (or apply lessons learned) from my 05 Super V8 experience.
I also thought that these 3 cars would make a lively discussion in real time about buying an XJS -All are coupe's - these 3 examples are examples of relative condition and price that are talked about frequently on this forum. So if one wishes to spend the time to actually look at the listings and see, or share an opinion from my thumbnail of each car below - that would be cool.
1. I'm in love with this one. Located in Texas, listed on AutoTrader. 93 6cy. 116K, dark forest green, smoked windows, looks REALLY cool, very clean in and out. $9,700. However, no pics of underside,AND the air freshener tree in the cabin and cheaper but new tires makes me think it smells inside and is a dress up of damp smell. But a truly beautiful car.
2. 1984 cherry red XJS-V12 (of course). Located in my hometown of Cle. OH - 92K I think. mi. $8,250 Lots of pics - especially of underside where car looks rock solid. Paint is good but interior is very tired. BUT CAR WON'T START and hasn't been driven therefore in a while. My morning reading was the STICKY by Mr. Francis on that subject and other stickies related to these cars.. There are 2 Jag experts up in Cleveland. but I'm hoping not to go that route.
3. An 1987 XJ V12 with 58K located in salty New Jersey. Outside body looks really nice. Been sitting for a long time in garage. Posting on Hemmings has a video of car running (idling, loudly IMO, and sounds like home is near airport), but running and shows one turn signal light blinking, indicating life in those systems. Champagne color over biscuit interior in good shape. Asking $3,900 negotiable. BUT no pics of underside. Pics of engine bay are clean-ish EXCEPT for - do I see a hole on the right side of the engine bay, and a mushroom growing in a corner of the trunk lip gasket area? This is an exciting possibility except for the potential rust issue.
Finally - I visited another car forum site (I think it was The Truth About Cars) in response to the Google search of "What goes wrong with Jaguar XJS." Posted was 2 guys(friends) clearly with much Jag experience, one of which in particular who was a longtime Jag technician and has owned many XJS. This expert posted in response to "what to look out for when buying an XJS" type query. His response was VERY informative and one of, if not the best quick summary of the XJS specs, problems, strengths, etc. that I have come across.
My question is, is it kosher to copy that summary and share it here in this forum without the posters permission? The post is very old, from 2007. And perhaps, if it was really useful experts here could add on or delete to make it even more useful?
I don't see a problem linking or copying and pasting a summary of the XJS from another forum. If someone posts it on a www forum it's sort of assumed it's for public use and consumption. Links to other Jaguar forums are sometimes given here when someone is after an answer or explanation of an issue.
In searching for your XJS, I'd drive/look at several before choosing one if possible. Some prefer the '91 and earlier body style, others prefer '92 and later or '94 and later with the revised bumper look. I'd also consider traveling to warmer climates if necessary to find a rust free example. I bought an XJS based on photos and an inspection only, without seeing it myself. It worked out well, but I probably wouldn't chance that again. I'd lean towards one that has been used regularly over the last few years rather than sitting, but either will require catch up maintenance.
As an aside, my XJS had the side rub strips to prevent door dings that are part chrome/part body color. I really grew to dislike those and wouldn't buy another car that had them. To each their own though. Most are riveted on so it's no small task to remove them, fill holes and paint.
I don't see a problem linking or copying and pasting a summary of the XJS from another forum. If someone posts it on a www forum it's sort of assumed it's for public use and consumption. Links to other Jaguar forums are sometimes given here when someone is after an answer or explanation of an issue.
In searching for your XJS, I'd drive/look at several before choosing one if possible. Some prefer the '91 and earlier body style, others prefer '92 and later or '94 and later with the revised bumper look. I'd also consider traveling to warmer climates if necessary to find a rust free example. I bought an XJS based on photos and an inspection only, without seeing it myself. It worked out well, but I probably wouldn't chance that again. I'd lean towards one that has been used regularly over the last few years rather than sitting, but either will require catch up maintenance.
As an aside, my XJS had the side rub strips to prevent door dings that are part chrome/part body color. I really grew to dislike those and wouldn't buy another car that had them. To each their own though. Most are riveted on so it's no small task to remove them, fill holes and paint.
For what its worth I would stay away from V12's all together as a matter of course. The 6cyl coupe would be my choice, hands down, for several reasons...In part they are:
1. 6cyl coupes are VERY hard to find. Read that as "value".
2. Texas is a good location to buy, but get a complete Carfax! 119K is great (my 93 6cyl convertible has 209K), but the more documentation the better.
3. Coupes have the better A/C system with the newer type freon. Of course, coupes are better than verts for driving in hot weather with A/C.
4. The 6cy motor is easy to work on, parts readily available online and thru the usual sources. Lots of room in the engine bay vs 12cyl motors.
5. The Alpine system sounds totally great in a coupe!
I just got rid of my X350 today, but I'm familiar with both those and the XJ-S. The choice of V12 or I6 is very personal. Some people are adamant that one is better, some people are adamant that the other is better. Same with coupe or convertible. Luckily the XJ-S or XJS can provide all of these options. If those choices are important to you its important to figure that out sooner rather than later. Nothing worse than wanting a 12, buying a 6, and regretting it. I'm presuming that this will be a second, fun, car, which makes the downsides of any of these choices easier to live with. The V12 needs maintenance, is cramped to work on, and consumes fuel by the barrel. But its also a special engine, just the nature of being a V12 makes it unusual. That can be a good thing or a bad thing depending on your point of view. The newer cars (post facelift) are generally better built and seem to be worth more, with '80s V12s worth the least, all other things equal.
Everything can be fixed or replaced, but its a good idea to buy a car where someone else has already fixed most of it. Rust takes the most work and money to fix, which is why its a good idea to avoid where possible. Will you be doing the work yourself or having a shop do it?
The 5-spd manual 6 cyl is the way to go -- no question -- the manual transforms the XJS from a lazy GT car to a real sports car (or close enough for me). Hard to find but they're out there -- one on Ebay in Cave City, KY right now -- not too far from you given rarity of the beast. https://www.ebay.com/itm/1993-Jaguar-XJS/114663499276
1. I'm in love with this one. Located in Texas, listed on AutoTrader. 93 6cy. 116K, dark forest green, smoked windows, looks REALLY cool, very clean in and out. $9,700. However, no pics of underside,AND the air freshener tree in the cabin and cheaper but new tires makes me think it smells inside and is a dress up of damp smell. But a truly beautiful car.
2. 1984 cherry red XJS-V12 (of course). Located in my hometown of Cle. OH - 92K I think. mi. $8,250 Lots of pics - especially of underside where car looks rock solid. Paint is good but interior is very tired. BUT CAR WON'T START and hasn't been driven therefore in a while. My morning reading was the STICKY by Mr. Francis on that subject and other stickies related to these cars.. There are 2 Jag experts up in Cleveland. but I'm hoping not to go that route.
3. An 1987 XJ V12 with 58K located in salty New Jersey. Outside body looks really nice. Been sitting for a long time in garage. Posting on Hemmings has a video of car running (idling, loudly IMO, and sounds like home is near airport), but running and shows one turn signal light blinking, indicating life in those systems. Champagne color over biscuit interior in good shape. Asking $3,900 negotiable. BUT no pics of underside. Pics of engine bay are clean-ish EXCEPT for - do I see a hole on the right side of the engine bay, and a mushroom growing in a corner of the trunk lip gasket area? This is an exciting possibility except for the potential rust issue.
To begin with ......
Unless you're considering an exceptional example at the very high end of the price range, any 25-30 year Jag is to be considered a project car. It's just that some are bigger projects than others. What's your tolerance/patience level and skill level? It can be a long slog sorting out an old Jag.....but most will say that it is well worth the effort and part of the fun. Especially with an XJS, as they are fabulous cars when everything is brought up to snuff.
Assuming DIY labor, most mechanical repairs on these cars are far less expensive to repair than cosmetics. Rust repair, paint, chrome, and leather can run into many, many thousands of dollars so if cosmetics are important to you then spending more initially will save you thousands down the road.
Thanks for the reply. I see by the cars you own you love the V12. Not that you need to look but advertised on our forum marketplace there is a 91 V12 with the engine refurbished with new hoses, wires, etc as well as suspension too. Member is asking 12K. It's very tempting.!
I just got rid of my X350 today, but I'm familiar with both those and the XJ-S. The choice of V12 or I6 is very personal. Some people are adamant that one is better, some people are adamant that the other is better. Same with coupe or convertible. Luckily the XJ-S or XJS can provide all of these options. If those choices are important to you its important to figure that out sooner rather than later. Nothing worse than wanting a 12, buying a 6, and regretting it. I'm presuming that this will be a second, fun, car, which makes the downsides of any of these choices easier to live with. The V12 needs maintenance, is cramped to work on, and consumes fuel by the barrel. But its also a special engine, just the nature of being a V12 makes it unusual. That can be a good thing or a bad thing depending on your point of view. The newer cars (post facelift) are generally better built and seem to be worth more, with '80s V12s worth the least, all other things equal.
Everything can be fixed or replaced, but its a good idea to buy a car where someone else has already fixed most of it. Rust takes the most work and money to fix, which is why its a good idea to avoid where possible. Will you be doing the work yourself or having a shop do it?
Thanks for the reply - I don't do my own work but have a mechanic that allows me to buy the parts so that is a savings for me and charges $90/hr - and he does know the cars. There is no question that with my skill level (actually it comes down to lack of tools as another biggest obstacle for me in doing own work). So I need one working well - my super V worked and was very drivable but needed new suspension front and back, valley hose etc. Was much more expensive than I thought it would be - your comments are a great reminder than 25-30 year old cars, perhaps especially jags, are projects.
Well People - It seems I have trouble replying to each of your comments individually so here's a reply to all.
Thanks for the responses. All are helpful in the long run and great reminder of buying the one you really want and in the best condition as they are all project cars due to their age.
Just a to follow up - The one I mentioned in Texas has sold, the one in Cleveland will never sell (IMO), and I haven't check the NJ one. I do know that there are several great example XJS on our marketplace, one of which (a 91 convertible) has been refurbished to to nine's.
Here is the post from another site that I mentioned in my original comments -
I'm Spectre's V12-loving friend. To give you an idea, I have owned 6 XJSs myself (two '82s, and '83, two '85s, and presently a '92). First off, I feel it is necessary to point out that there are many people out there who are still driving these cars as reliable daily drivers. I am one of them. It is not my only car (primarily because I need a truck with 4x4 as well), but when I was in college, my '82 was my only car. I drove 35,000 miles my first year of college with it. It never once let me down, and this was on a car starting out with 130,000 miles on it, ending with 165,000. Calling these cars unreliable and having a lot of problems is due to either not having any experience with them, or having experience with an idiot mechanic. I've worked on over 75 of these cars as well when I was a Jaguar mechanic., and probably a total of 150 differen Jaguars of all kinds made from '79 onward. Some earlier ones, but I don't deal with those as often.
To make a few corrections to Spectre's comments: The V12 is notorious for its dropped valve seat problem. This is not nearly as likely to happen as people say it is. I have severely overheated V12s, and have never dropped a valve seat. I am honestly not sure what exactly causes people to drop valve seats with these cars, but as far as I can tell you really have to overheat the thing very, very badly. Also, when it does happen, it requires removal of the cylinder head but usually you can get away with just having the head repaired and putting it back on, if you find a machine shop experienced with such repairs. The biggest problem I have noticed in terms of items getting cooked is the rear o-rings on the GM A6 AC compressor, however on the 6.0L cars that was replaced with a Sanden. The cars made '91 and earlier had fuel hoses connecting each injector to the fuel rail. Those hoses have been known to crack and have fuel leaks, causing a fire. This is mostly due to idiot owners who don't change the fuel hoses. 15 years later, they catch fire. Gee, what a concept. If you don't replace your fuel hoses and they get very dry and brittle after 15 years, they may leak. Starting in '92 this was resolved with a better design in which the injectors clipped right into the fuel rail, much like most other cars. I have not noticed a need to change belts or hoses any more frequently than I would on any other car.
The biggest issue that Spectre (almost) correctly identified is what was known as the "Marelli failure." '89.5 was when the first Marelli cars came out. Then through '95, the V12s were cursed with this ignition system that actually divided the engine up into two banks. The problem with this design is that the ignition cap and rotor are not that great. The rotor specifically will fail in such a way that half of the engine doesn't get spark. This is fine, except that the (now hot) catalytic converter is getting pumped full of combustible air and unburnt fuel. If you don't catch it quickly enough, it can set the car on fire. I had this failure happen to me about 2 months back. It is very obvious when it happens, the car loses power completely. To not have to call a tow truck, simply keep a spare cap and rotor (with appropriate tools) in your trunk, so you can change it yourself when it happens and be on your way. Sometimes one of the ignition coils fails, as well (there are two), but that is rarer.
It should be noted, though, that in the 1 year and 10,000 miles I've driven my '92 XJS since I bought it, this was the ONLY problem I've had with it, period, and if I was more diligent I would have changed them early. I am looking at dumping the whole system for a MegaSquirt & EDIS setup anyway, but that's another story.
The 6.0L cars are better. They seem to have a better cooling system, they have a Sanden AC compressor and more modern accessories in general, and they seem to get up to operating temperature faster. The big thing, though, is that they make a lot more power and torque. However, the 6.0L cars still had the same Marelli system except for the last year of production. The XJ12 had this distributorless system, but as far as I know the XJSs did not. Retrofitting it is not as simple as Spectre suggests, especially given how hard it is to find. Stick with the Marelli. Just change your cap and rotor yearly.
To be sure, the 6-cylinder cars are less maintenance and easier to work on. They also get (slightly) better gas mileage. The biggest expense in a V12 is maintenance if you need to pay someone else to work on it. Finding a good mechanic on these cars is difficult to do. However if you are willing to learn and do the work yourself, then you'll be fine. Most people I know who own these cars take that route, and it works out very well for them. The saying goes "There's nothing like a 12," and the Jaguar V12 is not only the most reliable production V12 ever made, it is actually just a reliable engine and probably the most streetable V12 available. The only reason I would suggest anyone to shy away from a V12 would be if they didn't have a good mechanic or couldn't find one. Any Jaguar has its eccentricities, though, and you'll need a good mechanic no matter which one you get.
The 6.0L cars came with a 4L80-E GM automatic 4-speed transmission behind it. The 5.3L V12s came with a TH400 GM 3-speed transmission. "The Driven Man" offers 5-speed conversions. I am on my second one (had one in the '82 and now one in the '92) and it is a fabulous upgrade that completely transforms the car.
I would go for the car that was taken best care of that you can find. When I bought my '92, it had 48,500 miles on it and was taken excellent care of by an older gentleman who had a lot of moeny he liked to throw at his car. So, the car basically lived at the mechanic's and came home on weekends for visits with the owner. What that means is that today I have an XJS with 58,500 miles on it that I have had only the one problem of a Marelli failure with. You want lower miles because it means that there is less overall wear on the car, but you also want one with a detailed service history that involves a lot of service. This means that you will then be able to drive it without having to service it frequently. If you drive it a lot (which is what I do) it will give you lots of reliable service. Don't drive it like grandpa - put your foot to the floor and let that V12 scream up to redline! It's good for it, I'm not joking. These engines do carbon up, and the "Italian tune-up" is the only way to keep that engine clean and running great.
Try not to drive it less than 20 miles. Highway driving (and backroad driving) is best. Spirited highway/backroad driving is better still. I am fortunate to have a 20 mile commute on highways and backroads, so my car gets this kind of use every time I leave my house.
Now, for the general synopsis of years:
'76-'81: Pre-HE. Fuel consumpion is measured in gallons per mile. OPUS (very old) ignition system
'82-'89: HE. Significantly improved fuel consumption with a redesigned cylinder head. Some interior improvements. Rear differential changed from 3.31 to 2.88 ratio. '85 introduced a trip computer. Lucas ignition system (best and most reliable)
'89.5-'91: Marelli HE. Marelli ignition system. Significant interior improvements, plus a minor change in doorhandles. Heated seats with lumbar introduced
Early '92: "Facelift." This was the first exterior redesign to the XJS since its introduction. All 92s had the 5.3L Marelli HE engine, same as the '89.5-'91s. The exterior and interior had major redesigns, however, which included a much different instrument cluster and trip computer. Power seats for the first time. Early 92s still had the older style suspension (which most view as better, including me) with the '89.5-'91 door handles. I have an early '92, and I view it as the best of all worlds, except I do wish I had a 6.0L (but I'm working on that...)
Late '92: Changed to the "XJ40-style" suspension, and door handles changed to a standard flapping type that people can actually figure out how to use. If you buy an early '92 or earlier, be prepared to explain to people "No, you push the door handle UP... no, don't pull on it... no, UP!!!"
'93: First year of the 6-cylinder XJS. Only 6-cylinders available in '93
'94-'96: 6.0L V12! Accompanied change in differential to a 3.54, with a 4-speed automatic overdrive transmission. Exterior, interior, and suspension the same as the late '92 onward.
As for me? I have an early '92 (by choice) with a 5.3L V12 and a 5-speed manual transmission conversion. It will be getting wheels from a '95-'97 XJR and a 6.0L V12 out of a '94 XJ12 parts car that I acquired hopefully over the winter with a MegaSquirt & EDIS to control it.
Hope this helps, let me (or Spectre, who will relay to me) know if you have any other questions.
Well, after reviewing the responses I think you have great info to begin your journey. Good luck!
One point I would make is verts out number coupes by loads, V12 vs 6cyl are the same. The rarest of all is the Coupe 6cyl with manual trans.
Keep us posted... Dave
I'm so happy you mentioned that. Stories to go with the car.
Also wanted to give a shout out to the XJ-SC ... I've a soft spot for those and think you could (given enough time) find either a V12 autobox OR a 3.6 manual version in the US (the latter numbering in the tens but they do pop up).
Might seem expensive ... but there a tons of classics in that range and few have the engine/suspension/interior/looks.....
Not that I wanted to quote myself, ugh, but for example, look how much more you pay for "reliability" ? Or is it something else that justifies this premium over an XJ-S. I'm sure the fact that it's an easy choice is part of the price. This ordinary Panzer Wagon with the worst engine is offered for the same price as that manual XJS https://www.jpfrazier.com/vehicles/4...es-benz-380-sl
I'm searching through the Hemmings listing for XJS - trying to see what I have not yet seen to date - YES - There it is!!!
A 1985 coupe, 3.6L, 5-speed - been right in front of me the whole time. Very pretty light jade color, interior a little ratty but not bad. Looks like a clean car. Can't believe it.
I do a quick goole search about 6 cyl. cars in 1985 in the US. We all know there were none shipped here or made for US market till the 90's.
What is this car doing here - on a lot in Staunton Illinois in the middle of nowhere USA??? For sale at only $6,450??? It's not real. By now I'm cleaning my pants.
I click the google link from a forum post from 2013 - I forget who started that thread but it started similar to mine - how to buy XJS, how many made, etc. Follow it to the end - it stops after many comments sometime in 2013 - and it wasn't too long before MKii250 starts to chime in!!!! Now I'm really going.
Amazingly, someone new picks up the thread in FEB of 2020, and starts commenting. And the thread gets answered and others keep joining in almost up to present time, Unbelievable. Be proud MKii250.
I read the entire thread which gets to the nitty gritty of production numbers and tells the direct email address of the archivist at Jaguar Daimler Heritage, and the entire thread is really interesting in this vein.
Along this thread a member chimes in, in response to the OP ( as I remember) that the coupe, 6 cyl. cars were not for US market BUT Jaguar did import 25, 3.6 L, 6 cyl., manual cars to the U.S. as a market test for interest in this production line. OMG. This car could very likely be one of those.
Now I'm REALLY excited. I go back to the listing (it was really early this morning), I run a CARFAX report, and take the dealers number and call on the way to work.
Crossing my fingers that the car is still available - NO!!! sold (he thought) a couple of months ago - I don't think, judging from the conversation I had with the sales person, that the dealer really knew what he had there. His last comment was "Yeah, I guess it was kinda rare" I said Yeah. I wonder if the purchaser knew what they were buying.
I am so sad. I had already planned to take my car nut friend from work and do a day trip (400miles from Columbus) in the Super V8, buy the car and drive it back. Didn't care if I would have had to stick it in 3rd and run 40mph to Indy. LOL. It was indeed running.
The really funny thing is there were 56 "watchers" of this car on the Hemmings listing - I mean who would "watch" THIS car at THIS price? I didn't once I realized what it was.
The CARFAX showed the original sale in San Diego in 1985 where the car stayed for its first 10 years and 97,000 miles. Perhaps that's why it looked so clean.
The car then was sold and moved to MO (I think near St. Louis), then to nearby Staunton IL., for the next 9 years where it proceeded to be driven just another 4,000 miles (O.D. showed 101K) on listing. But evidently cars of this era and in these states do not have to list mileage on titles, so the real milage may be unknown.
The car then was shipped in 9-2020(I think) to Rotterdam, Netherlands, and then landed back in Staunton in later in 2020, ready for me to buy it..
It's an odd history, listing says it did run, but clearly had not run for the last 10 years unless the O.D had been turned over. Not likely I think.
I'm not good at posting links - so in my next post I'll post it up for interested parties to see.Or you can just go to Hemmings.com and do a search for a 1985 XJS - the s will bring the car up on page 2. I may call the dealer back and see if the car sold local.
02-10-2021, 08:56 AM
Thinking of XJS Purchase - 3 possibilities
