My wife's 1991 4.0 AJ6 with about 70k miles; smokes at start up, and I just calculated it has used 2.5 litres of oil in 300 miles (200 motorway at 75mph, rest about town). It's not leaking.

My thoughts are this is very bad and needs attention (it is under warranty), I would welcome anybody else's opinion on this please.

 

getaway,

That's confusing. 2.5 litres is a huge amount of oil. I assume you calculated that from how much it took to get the level right on the dispstick? There's really only 3 places that oil can go from the engine:

- Leaking outside the engine somewhere. Difficult to see how you could lose 2.5 litres and not see some trace
- Burning it in the combustion through leakage of valve seals etc. But if it only smokes at start up and you've lost that much, difficult to see how you wouldn't notice it in the exhaust stream
- Leaking into the cooling system via head gasket leak etc. When this happens, you'd usually get an exchange of water into the combustion chambers with visibility of that in the exhaust stream. It is possible that oil could pass into the coolant system alone, but at 2.5 litres, difficult to see that happening.

Assuming the oil level was definitely correct before the 300 miles, and if you haven't got really bad oil contamination in the coolant, and it's not constantly smoking whilst running, I'd look again for a leak, perhaps?

Good luck

Paul

 

Paul makes a really good point here. Years ago I hooked up the PCV on a Mercedes straight-6 wrong which resulted in oil being ingested into the intake. No where near 2.5 liters in 300 miles, but it was enough to make it look like I was putting down a James Bond type smoke screen behind the car. If your consumption figure is correct - either Paul's #1 or #2 scenario would leave an obvious tell.

 

Hi Getaway

That sounds BAD! so I would take her back to the dealer which you still have the chance and get them to fix it

 

Thanks for your replies. I calculated it on the mileage from when it had the oil cooler pipes replaced (oil must have been topped up when these were done), else it is still only 700 miles since we bought the car and it was serviced. I don't think there are any leaks; a guy who did the underseal went over the car thoroughly on the ramp and spotted the cooler pipes issue at first inspection and a subsequent PAS fluid leak when he did the work, and no sign of oil on the drive.

I'll check and see if it's actually smoking all the time, and what the coolant looks like, whatever, as I thought, something needs looking at and it's not something one should expect. I'm sure the dealer will sort it out.

 

Thanks, I will - it's got a year warranty until March 2022 and they have been excellent so far. When we noticed the oil cooler pipes bleeding they picked the car up on a transporter the next day, had the pipes made (you can't get them anymore apparently) and delivered it back.

 

getaway,

Ahh! That might explain it now!

I wonder if you haven't got a problem at all! (Apart from the workshop that replaced the oil cooler pipes!)

I wonder if they didn't fill or check the oil level properly after the pipes were replaced. Because of course a lot of oil will have been lost when the pipes were removed and if they didn't run the engine afterwards and then subsequently check the oil level and fill it up, maybe it's only now that you've noticed that the oil was never replaced!

If that's the case, I would be quite unhappy with them!

Maybe it's worth doing a few more runs and carefully checking the oil level 5 mins after turning off the engine and see what it shows?

Good luck

Paul

 

I wonder, although the work was done at well respected JWORX Automotive Classic, so I don't think they'd make such a mistake. But yes, good idea, it's topped up now, so I'll check in another 300 miles or so - going to TLBS show at Betteshanger Park on 7th so that will be a good 200 mile round trip

 

getaway,

If it genuinely lost 2.5 litres in 300 miles, I'd check every 50 miles. You don't want to run it short of 5 pints of oil!

Good luck

Paul

 

Smoke at startup is usually just the old valve stem seals leaking a little. I doubt if you actually used that much oil in 300 miles without having a constant cloud behind you.

 

Hi Getaway

Get them to sort out the power steering leak, it probably needs a new seal and this could be a very expensive little job to do some time in the future so don't let them gloss over this as being normal for old classic cars

Also ask what engine oil they put in, as I use 10/40 Semi Synthetic in my V12 in the UK

 

Thanks very much everyone for all you input, I really appreciate it. Defo have them sort the power steering leak too as it's a fairly steady trickle on the driveway now. The deal is, after the year they collect the car service/MOT and do any advisories - I think I'll get my own MOT done before just in case their garage is a bit lenient ;-)

 

getaway,

I do sense an inevitability that you'll conclude the oil had never been replaced after the cooler pipes were fixed. 2.5 litres lost in 300 miles and I'm sure you'd have been doing a passable impersonation of the Red Arrows with smoke trails!

As regards the PAS fluid leak, I would do a check yourself before despatching the car off to the dealer. A PAS fluid leak could be:

- hose or pipe connection between reservoir / pump / rack - potentially easy to fix
- damaged pipe or hose - more expensive
- leaking pump - requires rebuild or replacement
- leaking rack from end-seals - requires removal and rebuild / replace - complex, time-consuming & expensive

Trying to pinpoint the leak first will help to ensure that the problem is addressed correctly.

And, just to confuse things, it COULD be an auto transmission fluid leak from the radiator cooler instead!

Good luck

Paul

 

Hi Getaway

Just thought of something else (inspired by a comment from Paul (ptjs)

A Garage could be leading you into a 'Bear Trap' because your Car could even be using a Pint of Oil a Mile (Lol) the Power Steering could still be leaking, while still being capable of Passing an MOT if any of that is not part of the Test

Ask me how I know or rather don't!

So in my view it is essential to put any Faults or Concerns in Writing to them right now (email would do) and get these Problems sorted out NOW

Or what could happen and quite possibly might well happen, is that in a Year from now, the Garage might be willing to Fix any advisories either through their MOT or one of your own

But with anything else, they could pull out the 'Fair Wear And Tear Card' for which you might not be covered and even say why did you leave it so long before you told us about it?

So any problems need to be sorted without any further delay, or else that situation could actually happen!

 

Add oil and go for a drive. Then check again every 50 miles as stated earlier. My car has over 200k, smokes at start up with sweaty cooler lines and doesnt loose more than half a quart every 400 miles. I drive mine everyday in desert heat too. Be sure before you lose your mind

 

The warranty does address any advisories, and leaks usually are these days, and I do think think the dealer is sound - wear parts are included in the warranty, amazingly (see attachment). I've already e-mailed them about the PAS leak, I'll monitor the oil and advise them accordingly. Thank you for your advice.