Frustrated...disappointed...dumbfounded...
#43
07-22-2013, 09:16 PM
mileage rollback
Of course some of those exotic owners or dealers will not shy away from spinning even the electronic odometers back.
Just a few months ago I was sent an auction listing for a rare Lamborghini that I sold something like 20 years ago. It was shown with 15K "original" miles that was about half of what I sold it with decades back.
These days it is super easy to reset odometers through software changes. All you have to do is Google it.
Albert
Just a few months ago I was sent an auction listing for a rare Lamborghini that I sold something like 20 years ago. It was shown with 15K "original" miles that was about half of what I sold it with decades back.
These days it is super easy to reset odometers through software changes. All you have to do is Google it.
Albert
#44
07-23-2013, 10:49 AM
Veteran Member
Passingly, yes, I considered it but, decided not to. I no longer have any of my paperwork as I sold that car probably over 20 years ago. I did let the President of the US Lamborghini Club know about the discrepancy. He was the one who sent me the info on the auction and subsequent sale of the car. He personally knows almost every single classic Lamborghini car and owner in the US so, I left it up to him to deal with this issue.
Albert
#45
07-23-2013, 02:45 PM
Senior Member
This is why many of us buy 3-5 year old prestige cars. Somebody else has taken the really heavy cash depreciation but the car is still new enough not to be a money pit. I bought my XKR this way. Funny how some of you mention the Maserati Quattroporte in this thread. that is another car that has freefall depreciation rates, and yet the 2008 and on model with the ZF box is a damned good car.
#46
07-23-2013, 05:25 PM
It Happens To All Of Us
To avoid a big hit, I bought a one-owner 3 year old 2009 Jag XK Coupe in October of 2012 in perfect condition, with 19,000 miles for $44,000. It stickered for $85,025. I love my Jag, I take super care of it and I plan on keeping it another 5 years or more. Would I prefer a 2014 XKR ... sure. And I'd also like a 3-day weekend with The Golf Channel's Holly Sonders. But since neither one's going to happen, especially not the 2014 XKR, I wash my Jag, I drive my Jag, and I'll always regard it as much a piece of art as the great GT Touring car that it is. I don't know when I'll sell it, let alone for how much, but I do know one thing ... I'm not going to spend any time now worrying about it. After 65 years on this crazy planet I've learned a couple of simple truths ... '**** Happens' and 'There's Nothing You Can Do About It'. So, my recommendation to all of you is ... enjoy your beautiful Jag, take great care of it and always remember how lucky you are that you have a beautiful Jag to enjoy.
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#47
07-23-2013, 07:48 PM
Veteran Member
Snide,
I agree with you, but with 2 exceptions. First, luck had nothing to do with my being fortunate enough to own my Jag - I didn't win the lottery. It was a result of hard work and disciplined investing.
Second, I believe your quote should be updated in light of the many recent cruise liner mishaps to "Ship Happens".
Stuart
P.S. I bought mine used, too.
I agree with you, but with 2 exceptions. First, luck had nothing to do with my being fortunate enough to own my Jag - I didn't win the lottery. It was a result of hard work and disciplined investing.
Second, I believe your quote should be updated in light of the many recent cruise liner mishaps to "Ship Happens".
Stuart
P.S. I bought mine used, too.
Last edited by Stuart S; 07-23-2013 at 07:52 PM.
#48
07-23-2013, 09:06 PM
Veteran Member
Add another here to the used car Jaguar theme of buying used with low miles, and a huge hunk of depreciation out of the car.
2009 Jaguar XKR "Portfolio Edition" convertible with 13,800 miles, purchased 5-24-2013, in showroom condition for $44,600 + $980.00 to have it transported to me from Palm Beach, FL. Paid cash and happy about that, no financing, no payments.
Like Snide, I hand wash it, hand wax it and I will enjoy it. I just love this car, it's the best ever I owned.
Best way to buy these Jags is used no doubt. Take your time, make offers and you can pick up a beautiful car. All it takes is time, patience and some due diligence to find what you want. They are out there.
2009 Jaguar XKR "Portfolio Edition" convertible with 13,800 miles, purchased 5-24-2013, in showroom condition for $44,600 + $980.00 to have it transported to me from Palm Beach, FL. Paid cash and happy about that, no financing, no payments.
Like Snide, I hand wash it, hand wax it and I will enjoy it. I just love this car, it's the best ever I owned.
Best way to buy these Jags is used no doubt. Take your time, make offers and you can pick up a beautiful car. All it takes is time, patience and some due diligence to find what you want. They are out there.
Last edited by richzak; 07-24-2013 at 07:19 PM.
#49
07-24-2013, 01:50 PM
Snide, I can make your wish come true
[QUOTE=Snide72;778150] ... Would I prefer a 2014 XKR ... sure. And I'd also like a 3-day weekend with The Golf Channel's Holly Sonders. But since neither one's going to happen, especially not the 2014 XKR.../QUOTE]
Snide, I can help with one of those wishes. Not 100%, but almost. You are probably thinking maybe a 2013, instead of 2014, xkr. Nope.
The other dream. Almost 100% of it can come true for you. I have a neighbor who said he would help make your dreams come true.
You are probably thinking he is in the golfing business and can introduce you to Holly Sanders. No, he does not know Holly Sanders, but his name is Howie Sanders and he said he would be glad to spend a 3 day weekend with you.
Snide, I can help with one of those wishes. Not 100%, but almost. You are probably thinking maybe a 2013, instead of 2014, xkr. Nope.
The other dream. Almost 100% of it can come true for you. I have a neighbor who said he would help make your dreams come true.
You are probably thinking he is in the golfing business and can introduce you to Holly Sanders. No, he does not know Holly Sanders, but his name is Howie Sanders and he said he would be glad to spend a 3 day weekend with you.
#50
07-25-2013, 06:34 AM
Veteran Member
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#52
07-25-2013, 04:09 PM
Senior Member
Long story short I was looking at a 2013 XKR, possibly to trade my 2010 in for it. I was also looking at a 2011 Aston Martin V12 Vantage.
Dealer I was talking to on the phone says, "...well your 2010 - in excellent condition - would be worth around $45K...". I said, "Yea, right. You want breakfast in bed as well?"
He then went on to say that he was checking a national database (this was a Bentley dealership). He then suggested I go to a Car Max and have them do a trade value of the car. He said they were honest and would give me an honest appraisal. I'm not sure about that, but whatever.
I went to NADA and Kelly BB and found that for trade in, my 2010 XKR is only worth around $46K.
So in the 15 months that I have owned this car, it has fallen from a trade in value around $60K to (now) $45K. Retail is about $5K higher, but we all know you will not get retail from a dealer because they have to resell it. Selling it as a private party is only a couple grand more.
I just could not believe that. It is really beyond me why the value of these cars plummet so quickly. I am still in a state of shock.
I knew the car had depreciated...I had no idea it lost almost 30% of its value (at which I purchased it)...
My word!!!
Edit: My car sold for around $97K new...original sticker was $104K and some change (I have the original window sticker). It was purchased new in October 2009. I am second owner.
So from original purchase to now my car has depreciated $97K to $46K = $51K depreciation. Wow. in 2 years 9 months...
Dealer I was talking to on the phone says, "...well your 2010 - in excellent condition - would be worth around $45K...". I said, "Yea, right. You want breakfast in bed as well?"
He then went on to say that he was checking a national database (this was a Bentley dealership). He then suggested I go to a Car Max and have them do a trade value of the car. He said they were honest and would give me an honest appraisal. I'm not sure about that, but whatever.
I went to NADA and Kelly BB and found that for trade in, my 2010 XKR is only worth around $46K.
So in the 15 months that I have owned this car, it has fallen from a trade in value around $60K to (now) $45K. Retail is about $5K higher, but we all know you will not get retail from a dealer because they have to resell it. Selling it as a private party is only a couple grand more.
I just could not believe that. It is really beyond me why the value of these cars plummet so quickly. I am still in a state of shock.
I knew the car had depreciated...I had no idea it lost almost 30% of its value (at which I purchased it)...
My word!!!
Edit: My car sold for around $97K new...original sticker was $104K and some change (I have the original window sticker). It was purchased new in October 2009. I am second owner.
So from original purchase to now my car has depreciated $97K to $46K = $51K depreciation. Wow. in 2 years 9 months...
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rscultho (07-26-2013)
#54
07-26-2013, 05:16 AM
I am sorry for your frustration. But it's not at all uncommon. Luxury cars depreciate quickly. If it's any consolation every time I see one of your posts and look at your XK I think to myself "Man that is a beautiful car." I don't think you could go out and buy anything nearly that nice for $45k new. I know this probably doesn't help but wanted to add my two cents.
Anyway, onwards and upwards!
(PS - Like your photos. I have always been an aspiring amateur photog!)
Last edited by rscultho; 07-26-2013 at 05:42 AM.
#55
07-26-2013, 07:31 AM
Veteran Member
One people don't think about when they buy a new end-of-model-year vehicle is that it might be a worse deal than getting the just-released new-model-year vehicle, even if they are the exact same car. In your case, 2010 vs 2011. Although the 2010 will have the same length of warranty, etc., it has already experienced a ton of depreciation just by the fact that it is one model year older.
I'm not trying to imply that you didn't think about that when you bought your 2010, but most other people don't as I constantly hear people suggest that you get a new car at the end of the model year at a discount without any mention of what that discount needs to be for it to make sense from a resale/depreciation perspective.
I'm not trying to imply that you didn't think about that when you bought your 2010, but most other people don't as I constantly hear people suggest that you get a new car at the end of the model year at a discount without any mention of what that discount needs to be for it to make sense from a resale/depreciation perspective.
#56
08-03-2013, 08:53 AM
Veteran Member
So here's a weird one:
All XKR 75s were built at exactly the same time and have exactly the same spec (there were no options, as far as I have been able to determine). That means the only difference between them at this stage should be mileage, condition and number of owners.
I paid £40k for mine in April; the price had been £44k, they had just dropped it to £41k and I talked them down a bit more. It had 24k miles and one previous owner.
So how come these dudes are asking £50k for the same car with 7k miles on it?
XK 5.0 V8 Supercharged Coupé 75 LE
OK, it has a personal plate (JG60XKR), but £10k more? That's a lot of cash for 17k miles - in fact, 25% more cash. From where I'm standing, I feel like I got a deal.
All XKR 75s were built at exactly the same time and have exactly the same spec (there were no options, as far as I have been able to determine). That means the only difference between them at this stage should be mileage, condition and number of owners.
I paid £40k for mine in April; the price had been £44k, they had just dropped it to £41k and I talked them down a bit more. It had 24k miles and one previous owner.
So how come these dudes are asking £50k for the same car with 7k miles on it?
XK 5.0 V8 Supercharged Coupé 75 LE
OK, it has a personal plate (JG60XKR), but £10k more? That's a lot of cash for 17k miles - in fact, 25% more cash. From where I'm standing, I feel like I got a deal.
#57
08-03-2013, 09:44 AM
One people don't think about when they buy a new end-of-model-year vehicle is that it might be a worse deal than getting the just-released new-model-year vehicle, even if they are the exact same car. In your case, 2010 vs 2011. Although the 2010 will have the same length of warranty, etc., it has already experienced a ton of depreciation just by the fact that it is one model year older.
I'm not trying to imply that you didn't think about that when you bought your 2010, but most other people don't as I constantly hear people suggest that you get a new car at the end of the model year at a discount without any mention of what that discount needs to be for it to make sense from a resale/depreciation perspective.
I'm not trying to imply that you didn't think about that when you bought your 2010, but most other people don't as I constantly hear people suggest that you get a new car at the end of the model year at a discount without any mention of what that discount needs to be for it to make sense from a resale/depreciation perspective.
#58
08-03-2013, 10:00 AM
Last year, a guy who lives in my neighborhood got a Maserati GranTurismo, and I got car envy. I told a couple of friends how I felt, and they replied, "Dude, you drive a Jaguar."
Our cars may depreciate quickly, and they may carry the stigma of past quality problems, but they are special. They are unique. They are beautiful works of art on wheels. They are admired and envied by others. They are Jaguars.
#59
08-03-2013, 11:29 AM
Veteran Member
And 0% sex appeal.
Last year, a guy who lives in my neighborhood got a Maserati GranTurismo, and I got car envy. I told a couple of friends how I felt, and they replied, "Dude, you drive a Jaguar."
Our cars may depreciate quickly, and they may carry the stigma of past quality problems, but they are special. They are unique. They are beautiful works of art on wheels. They are admired and envied by others. They are Jaguars.
Last year, a guy who lives in my neighborhood got a Maserati GranTurismo, and I got car envy. I told a couple of friends how I felt, and they replied, "Dude, you drive a Jaguar."
Our cars may depreciate quickly, and they may carry the stigma of past quality problems, but they are special. They are unique. They are beautiful works of art on wheels. They are admired and envied by others. They are Jaguars.
The Maserati has a more luxurious interior and a more exotic sound. The Jag has it beat hands down in every other category. The XKR is faster, looks so much better and is a much more economical car to own.
#60
08-03-2013, 01:31 PM
Not a bad memory, necessarily. I really did like the car, but the Mas just seemed like a car for a different era, and a different market.