As I am approaching the termination of my extended Easy Care Gold Warranty, I wanted to give my last effort in finding out where my coolant loss is going as well as the persistent coolant smell after a long drive. I have a 2010 XK 5.0 (normally aspirated) with 11,500 miles, with the original factory water pump.. This dealership knows me, but I haven't had them examine my car since 2017. I spoke with the closest I could come to the owner of the dealership.....and initially, he agreed to replace my water pump, but once I asked if they would stand behind any issues with lingering coolant loss and coolant smell....that offer disappeared. He called for the shop foreman, that also knows me quite well, and we agreed to check out the car once again, pressurizing it overnight with the car coming in warm, and then going from there. The shop foreman said he will be working together with their best master tech that knows my car. I requiested to have them waive any diagnostic fee which they refused ($99), and they will be keeping the car overnight. Just to clarify.....For the last 6 years.....I've taken my car to 2 different Jag dealerships and one Indy. There was a total of 4 inspections for the same issue. Even my Indy could not find any residue or any sign anywhere of coolant leakage including the weep hole of the water pump. The weep hole had no red coolant stains or crust. Yet, I do lose a very small amount of coolant and have the smell from the outside of the front of the car after a drive. My warranty runs out the second or third week in April with a $50 deductable. It might be that my water pump has the very slightest leak or no leak at all and they can't find it anywhere else. If that is the case....I'll just have to learn to live with it (Less $99)....If they can't find it, they can't fix it. They seem to be concerned about warranty fraud as parts are inspected after replacement. The owner and shop foreman insists that they do want to find a leak as they do get paid for warranty work. We shall see. Too be continued. My appt is Tuesday. Sorry for the long story.

 

Hey Boca. I know this has been an issue with your ride for years. I hope they find it and fix it so it's something you no longer have to worry about. Good luck. Following with interest.

 

Hey Sean, Thanks for your interest. It's just that since I never got to use my Easy Care Warranty, that cost me a whopping $3600, I figured I'd give it one more try. If it doesn't work out, I guess I can live with topping up my coolant whenever I take my occassional drive, which is less than 1,000 miles a year. I'm not expecting much, but you can't win it if you're not in it! Too be continued.....

 

Sadly, as I read this literally, it appears that your beloved XK has breathed its last breath. You have my deepest condolences.

But I spoke too soon, because I suspect that you're terminology-challenged and what you wrote is not what you meant. All internal combustion engines need a mixture of fuel and air to run. So, an engine without air - "non aspirated" - can't run. That's not what you meant, right? You meant to say that you didn't have the supercharged engine. The supercharger is an air pump that forces pressurized air and fuel into the combustion chamber to produce more power. Your XK breathes normally, without a supercharger (SC). It's "normally aspirated" (NA).

You have good cause to be concerned about your water pump, as you're well aware of the problems that have been reported. My 2013 5.0LSC XJ's leaky water pump was replaced under warranty at 30K miles. But your water pump doesn't appear to be leaking, so I doubt that your extended service contract will replace it. If it ain't broke, they don't fix it. To have peace of mind, I recommend that you buy the latest version of the OEM Jaguar water pump and keep it in your trunk, just in case you need it. You should be able to buy it online for under $230. Part number AJ813909.

 

Thanks for the correction....Obviously I meant normally aspirated......Thanks also for your suggestion. Will do.

 

You have good price HERE or HERE

 

Which dealer?

 

I've gone to both. Jaguar of West Palm Beach and Jaguar of Ft Lauderdale (Auto Nation). The only one I haven't gone to was Warren Henry and they are too far.

 

Boca,

Understand the risks. Do a simple risk reward analysis and the answer should come back as dont do a thing.

1. The cost of changing a water pump when it fails should be about $1-1.5k. The insurance company will get $500 out of you anyway- despite your best efforts.
2. There is no guarantee changing a water pump will solve your issue, or even give you any peace of mind- in fact, there is greater probability that you will have less peace of mind and you will be changing several more pumps after the first one.

As long as you have changed your coolant frequently, a pump with 11000 miles is still better than a new pump with installation errors. Keep in mind at the factory they do not install pumps in this manner. Where the pump is allowed to pump air.
In your shoes, I would wait till I had to address other hoses and cooling system issues. If I did the water pump now under warranty, I would do the hoses too and that way you are getting something for your money.

 

Queen and Country......You happen to think along the same lines as myself. I AM CONCERNED about collateral damage after any installation. I'm not sure that there will be $500 out of pocket money and I do have a $50 deductable, but regardless and having said all this.....I drive very little and I add only a small amount of coolant ( a few ounces ) every 3 or 4 hundred miles.. if even that much. I'd hate to make matters worse and the fact is that for the last 6 years there have been no major issues,and I certainly don't want any now. Am I opening a can of worms? I'm a firm believer that no tech is going to put things back together as they were assembled at the factory......Especially with all those plastic lines and connectors. That's a certainty. The #1 red flag for me, is hearing about the forum members that had to replace their water pumps more than once.

 

I am curious as to what you mean by "factory installed in this manner, and when would the pump, pump air?

 

At the factory they dont use the water pump to get the air out of the system. (A machine is used to fill the coolant that leaves no air in the system)
So the pump is never run dry, nor does it see any pockets of air- for any period of time. (Experts are now saying this is one of the causes of pump failures in modern cars- it pumps air, cooks seals, takes just seconds).

It makes sense, even in the old much easier to bleed cooling systems, a real good mechanic would turn thee water pump by hand to prime it- nowdays they cant.

Forum member Tberg just had his 5th pump replaced and the system was 1.5 gallons low few days later. You can see how difficult it was for a seasoned mechanic to get air out.

 

Every shop I've worked in the last ten years uses an Air Lift to fill the cooling system, works just like a factory fill.

I've work in shops for almost 50 years and have never seen anyone turn a water pump b hand.

When replacing a water pump on a 4.2 or 5.0 I've rarely had to add more than 1 1/2 gallons to achieve a full system. Perhaps this particular mechanic was not as seasoned as you assume.

 

Ok, i am not a mechanic, just wanted to make that clear first. I have had many cars, some with coolant leaks. My latest was with my MY14 XK in 2019. First see if you see coolant on the floor under the car. The location can be obscured by the splash guard under the engine so you might have to remove it. Two areas of concern for the Jags coolant leaks. If is the water pump it will be in the front center of the car and you should be able to see it with a flash light from the top and bottom. The other area of coolant leaks has been the resin outlet pipe at the rear of the engine which connects to the thermostat. If this leaks you may smell the coolant but you may not see it. The pipe is located under inlet manifold at the rear of the engine. If the engine has an internal coolant leak you should be able to see it in the oil, discoloration and frothy. That usually indicates a cracked block or leaking cylinder head gasket. This leak can be detected by smelling the exhaust which should smell like coolant. the coolant pressure test will measure the severity of the internal and external leak. I hope this gives you something to work toward and helps with the repair of your car. Oh one other thing, put a letter/call into Jaguar Customer service national office or the corporate offices in the UK and tell them about the fiasco of getting your vehicle repaired, the double charging for the diagnostic fee and the lack of ineptness by the service dept. to identify and repair the problem. This will at least expedite a response. Get it fixed under warranty while you still have it. Sounds like they are trying to avoid fixing it under warranty. Just my opinion on your plight, take with a grain of salt.

 

Do you guys flush the block when you use something like airlift?

On turning by hand, that's coming straight from water pump manufacturer.
I quote "2. Dry Rotation of the Pump
When coolant flows through the water pump without air bubbles or breaks, this mechanical seal remains intact. The introduction of pauses or lapses in the coolant (usually air) can temporarily break and overheat that mechanical seal, which can then cause other problems.For this reason, when refilling the cooling circuit after replacement of the pump, many shop manuals recommend the pump be hand-rotated until it’s full. This “charge” of the circuit can reduce the chance of a mechanical seal loss."https://www.aftermarketnews.com/4-mi...ng-water-pump/

This is the article on aftermarket repair shops inadequate practices being the primary cause of premature pump failure.
MOTOR Magazine | eNewsletter | Reboot Your Cooling System Service Practices ? Archaic service procedures can initiate premature failures

 

Flushing? Only if it's due by time or mileage.

If you wanted to turn the pump by hand, you could easily reach down and turn it before installing the belt, but the airlift removes
most of the air in the system and any remaining air would be higher in the system than the water pump and easily bled out
by running the engine to full temp.

I've been through every training course that Jaguar gives and never heard of turning the pump by hand.

 

Queen and Country......Your risk reward analysis got me thinking.......Presently, with a little over 11,000 miles on my 2010 XK and driving approximately 1,000 miles per year, I add approximately a few ounces of coolant (less than 1/2 of a coffee cup per year). After 4 previous attempts to find the cause of my coolant smell and possible leak took me to a dead end. Two Jaguar dealerships (3 visits) and one Indy. All visits showed the system holding pressure with no visible signs at water pump weep hole or anywhere else. Let's just say that during my next visit, the dealership were to find the leak, regardless of it being the water pump or a plastic line.....disassembly is required, and I will be dealing with a tech (most likely fresh out of school). What are the chances that after the repair or replacement my car will have no leaks or more leaks? I know what I have now which is absolutely minimum, but I don't know what I'll be getting once they stick their hands inside my unmolested engine compartment. Conclusion? I'm leaning towards leaving well enough alone. This forum has so many stories about bad water pumps which certainly gets owner's paranoid, and understandably so. My original factory installed water pump, with my yearly driving, might very well out live me (I've been collecting Social Security for years)...There's another saying..."Let sleeping dogs lie" This risk reward analysis leads me to believe, in my case.....the risk is not worth the reward..PS..If the day does come, that my water pump does fail, $1500 is not going to change my life style.

 

I'm definitely with the "if it ain't broke don't fix it" crowd on this, and it doesn't seem like it's failing at present.
My dealer service department loves warranty work. They look for things wrong with my car. To be clear, they get an approval from my warranty co BEFORE doing any work. Sometimes this done over the phone (techs email photos), sometimes an adjuster comes out in person. This adds a day or two to how long they have the car; I don't mind. I actually spoke to my warranty rep once, who was nice. He said they never repair on "intermittent" issues-- they only pay on things that have failed, or are clearly failing (I've had bushings replaced in that state). So from what you describe it wouldn't surprise me if they wouldn't pay.
(One bonus if they do it under warranty: they replace all the coolant fluid when they do a replacement, so you also get a coolant flush in the bargain!)

 

After the 4 inspections of having the water pump weep hole inspected as well as the system pressurized, I got 4 "nothing wrong with your water pump" and no leaks found! It might very well be fine, and it could be a very small leak at a connection somewhere. I don't want to make matters worse. The water pump probably is not leaking or they would have found some residue somewhere. At this time, I may very well pass and not take the car in anymore. I don't want them putting their hands on my car as it runs perfectly other than the occasional few ounces I add each year. A very small price for owning a Jaguar.

 

Yeah, I'd give up on getting the warranty co to pay before it expires. Given the four "nothing wrong" inspections, I doubt that that'll happen.