New to Jaguar With Questions
#21
11-17-2013, 04:51 PM
Hello, Don! And Welcome! Speaking from the "Auto Repair Shop" side... If I had to depend on late model Jaguar repairs to earn my pay, I would be a very poor man indeed! Of the 2007 and newer models, I seem to be doing only routine maintenance, and installing aftermarket exhaust systems, wheels, etc! The Corvettes are very interesting cars, and many people enjoy them! But... why not take a walk on the "wild" side, and get yorself a beautiful car that is not only more exclusive than a Corvette, but is an absolute pleasure to own and drive?? You can get some great deal on gently used models! And, Nitz is right! That Cars and Coffee event is incredible! You need to check it out!
#22
11-17-2013, 05:10 PM
I would like to suggest one thing: Leather interiors don't like it much here in Arizona! I looked at many local cars that had terribly dried and cracked leather, and finally found a car in California that had a remarkably perfect interior. I can only surmise that the natural moisture there saved it from ruin. That being said, I would treat the leather regularly with conditioner if you want to keep it nice in our desert climate!
#23
11-19-2013, 10:47 PM
I've reachedthat point where I do not want to spend hours each week under thehood of a car, so I plan on no engine mods of any kind. So somedress-up mods, minor maintenance I'll do but nothing major. Push thestart button and go that's what I want.
The XKR practically SCREAMS to have the supercharger pulley and ECU redone... A ton of cheap and safe horsepower for the taking. BUT... it kills the factory warranty (at least the pulley swap probably would if something in the drivetrain broke and you had a severe dealer). I'm told the ECU reprogram is not detectable by Jaguar, but with a 100k warranty and a car that is already pretty scary fast, I'm going to stay stock till the warranty runs (if I keep her that long). It really is a jump in and drive car, super reliable in my experience. And compared to the 'vette, you'll be in heaven in terms of build quality. Especially the interior. Switches, knobs, door panels, leather dash, turn indicators, all A+.
As for temperamental Ibelieve it goes back to the days when Jaguar was or at least perceived tohave problems. Plus it came from the Corvette folks who arejust a little one sided. I didn't expect the gas mileage to be highalthough 20 MPH isn't that bad. Insurance is bridgethat I'll cross when the time comes.
And believe me, I was flogging the car in the most adverse mileage setting imaginable short of gridlocked city traffic. I've taken freeway trips with passengers who don't tolerate my nonsense and with the cruise control and gentle input you can hit 24 real world.
Seriously, don't by the (negative) hype. Or bask in the 'yes, they are temperamental beasts but I have the means to keep her in top shape, sir!' approach, LOL...
Honestly, the engine is rock solid, the transmission sourced from ZF who does everyone's it seems, the S/C is state of the art (Eaton I think, same one in the crazy 'vette and a few other monster cars), I haven't heard anything about a weak component in the post 2010's (not to say that earlier is unreliable, just that that's where my experience is).
A killer deal one year used with the SE warranty...
Skeeter
The XKR practically SCREAMS to have the supercharger pulley and ECU redone... A ton of cheap and safe horsepower for the taking. BUT... it kills the factory warranty (at least the pulley swap probably would if something in the drivetrain broke and you had a severe dealer). I'm told the ECU reprogram is not detectable by Jaguar, but with a 100k warranty and a car that is already pretty scary fast, I'm going to stay stock till the warranty runs (if I keep her that long). It really is a jump in and drive car, super reliable in my experience. And compared to the 'vette, you'll be in heaven in terms of build quality. Especially the interior. Switches, knobs, door panels, leather dash, turn indicators, all A+.
As for temperamental Ibelieve it goes back to the days when Jaguar was or at least perceived tohave problems. Plus it came from the Corvette folks who arejust a little one sided. I didn't expect the gas mileage to be highalthough 20 MPH isn't that bad. Insurance is bridgethat I'll cross when the time comes.
And believe me, I was flogging the car in the most adverse mileage setting imaginable short of gridlocked city traffic. I've taken freeway trips with passengers who don't tolerate my nonsense and with the cruise control and gentle input you can hit 24 real world.
Seriously, don't by the (negative) hype. Or bask in the 'yes, they are temperamental beasts but I have the means to keep her in top shape, sir!' approach, LOL...
Honestly, the engine is rock solid, the transmission sourced from ZF who does everyone's it seems, the S/C is state of the art (Eaton I think, same one in the crazy 'vette and a few other monster cars), I haven't heard anything about a weak component in the post 2010's (not to say that earlier is unreliable, just that that's where my experience is).
A killer deal one year used with the SE warranty...
Skeeter
#24
11-20-2013, 06:12 AM
Veteran Member
#25
11-20-2013, 06:21 AM
Veteran Member
[SIZE=3][FONT=Calibri]The XKR practically SCREAMS to have the supercharger pulley and ECU redone... A ton of cheap and safe horsepower for the taking. BUT... it kills the factory warranty (at least the pulley swap probably would if something in the drivetrain broke and you had a severe dealer).
#26
11-20-2013, 11:30 AM
Twin-screw type appears to be much more close to the state of the art in superchargers, but they cost significantly more because they require much more precise engineering.(the twin-screw equivalent to our factory Eatons is about $3k more). However just by little more than swapping superchargers from factory to twin-screw, several people on this forum (such as Avos) have already got their 4.0/4.2 cars up to well over 600hp.
As apparently nobody has done it yet, we can only dream what kind of monster you'd get by switching a newer 5.0 SC car to twin-screw. By my figures you'd be up around 787hp which is definately hypercar territory. If you could get all that power to the road you'd be probably be eating Lambos for breakfast and even giving the million+ dollar cars a serious run for their money.
Last edited by JustNiz; 11-20-2013 at 11:38 AM.
#27
11-21-2013, 10:28 AM
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I’m more familiar with turbos but I though the Eaton was a twin screw type supercharger. Where one side draws air into the supercharger and other side discharges the air into the intake manifold. I know there are centrifugal superchargers such as the “ProCharger” that some say are more efficient and reliable than the roots style but again I’m not familiar with them. I don’t know if this type is even available for a Jag engine. If I get an XKR then I’ll have to learn more about their supercharges.
#28
11-21-2013, 10:46 AM
Just to clarify, the current XKR/XKR-S uses the Eaton TVS series R1900 4-lobe supercharger, which is a Roots-type (positive displacement) twin-screw blower. It's close to state-of-the-art, arriving in 2009 on the 'Vette ZR1 (as a 2300) and the CTS-V (as the 1900). Rock-solid, well-proven.
Not sure what's been used in the past...
Rich
Not sure what's been used in the past...
Rich
#29
11-21-2013, 01:44 PM
Veteran Member
#30
11-22-2013, 01:56 AM
Yeah, I'm pretty sure that the 2010's and after use the Eaton TVS R1320, which is DEFINITELY state of the art... 4 Lobe with 160 degrees of twist, exceptional thermal properties, utterly silent. There's plenty of power to be produced with this unit, which has proven highly reliable and hold up well in the ZR1 as well as a handful of other cars. IMO it is a strong component of a robust and enjoyable drive-train.
Prime Cuts: Eaton TVS R1320 Supercharger - Feature - Car and Driver
Peace,
Skeeter
Prime Cuts: Eaton TVS R1320 Supercharger - Feature - Car and Driver
Peace,
Skeeter
#31
11-22-2013, 07:33 AM
Veteran Member
FAQ for Superchargers - Eaton
I guess the switch to the TVS range explains the lack of supercharger whine in the 5.0L models.
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#32
11-22-2013, 09:41 AM
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I've always liked the whine of a supercharger or turbo. It's just something that says power and look out for me. Takes me back the 671 and 871 days. A friend just installed a TV1900 on his car and there is some whine but not much, he said it has something to do with a different type of cog wheel.
#33
11-22-2013, 10:45 AM
The TVS R1320 may well be Eaton's latest offering, but its still a Rootes-type supercharger with basically the same design which dates back to the late 1800's. Twin-screw is both a much newer design and inherently more efficient than any rootes-based design would allow. IMHO that is why twin screws justify being described are more state-of-the-art than any Rootes-type, even the latest Eaton products.
#34
11-22-2013, 11:54 AM
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Of course, Eaton begs to differ:
But they would say that…
Not being a mechanical engineer, I see two camps shouting "We're the best!", and I'm not qualified to judge. Reading a bit more, it appears the Roots blowers are better at lower boost levels, but less efficient at high boost than screw types. Meh - the XKR has plenty enough grunt for me, mostly limited by rear grip.
Q: What’s a Twin-Screw supercharger and how is it different from an Eaton roots type supercharger?
A: All Eaton superchargers use the roots type supercharging principle. The roots supercharger is a positive displacement pump that moves air in pockets from the inlet to the outlet of the supercharger with no internal compression. The supercharger creates “boost” by moving more air into the intake manifold than the engine is utilizing, thus creating higher than atmospheric pressures in the intake manifold. When boost is not desired on an Eaton roots supercharger, the bypass valve allows the supercharger to spin with negligible parasitic loss as there is no internal compression. The Eaton roots supercharger uses 3 lobe (“M”) or 4 lobe (“TVS-R”) meshing rotors that are similar (but reversed) in geometry. The rotors operate at a 1:1 speed ratio.
The Twin-Screw type supercharger is also a positive displacement pump in that it moves a fixed amount of air per revolution. The Twin-Screw uses 2 non-similar screw type rotors that mesh together to compress and move the air pocket axially along the rotors. This internal compression ratio will lead to greater parasitic losses when boost is not required as you cannot turn this compression “off” by simply using a bypass valve. These rotors will have different rates of rotation due to their non-similar geometry and lobe quantity. The rotors of a Twin-Screw will commonly operate at 3:5 and 4:6 speed ratios. This means as the drive rotor spins at 15,000 rpm, the driven rotor will rotate at 25,000 rpm with a ratio of 3:5. This limits the Twin-Screw to lower rpm limits than the roots due to bearing life concerns.
A: All Eaton superchargers use the roots type supercharging principle. The roots supercharger is a positive displacement pump that moves air in pockets from the inlet to the outlet of the supercharger with no internal compression. The supercharger creates “boost” by moving more air into the intake manifold than the engine is utilizing, thus creating higher than atmospheric pressures in the intake manifold. When boost is not desired on an Eaton roots supercharger, the bypass valve allows the supercharger to spin with negligible parasitic loss as there is no internal compression. The Eaton roots supercharger uses 3 lobe (“M”) or 4 lobe (“TVS-R”) meshing rotors that are similar (but reversed) in geometry. The rotors operate at a 1:1 speed ratio.
The Twin-Screw type supercharger is also a positive displacement pump in that it moves a fixed amount of air per revolution. The Twin-Screw uses 2 non-similar screw type rotors that mesh together to compress and move the air pocket axially along the rotors. This internal compression ratio will lead to greater parasitic losses when boost is not required as you cannot turn this compression “off” by simply using a bypass valve. These rotors will have different rates of rotation due to their non-similar geometry and lobe quantity. The rotors of a Twin-Screw will commonly operate at 3:5 and 4:6 speed ratios. This means as the drive rotor spins at 15,000 rpm, the driven rotor will rotate at 25,000 rpm with a ratio of 3:5. This limits the Twin-Screw to lower rpm limits than the roots due to bearing life concerns.
Not being a mechanical engineer, I see two camps shouting "We're the best!", and I'm not qualified to judge. Reading a bit more, it appears the Roots blowers are better at lower boost levels, but less efficient at high boost than screw types. Meh - the XKR has plenty enough grunt for me, mostly limited by rear grip.
#35
07-09-2024, 09:00 PM
Jlr aj133 v8 tvs2300 supercharger jlr aj133 v8 tvs2300 supercharger jlr aj133 v8 tvs2
Hello. I have a 2010 XF supercharged and have been on the fence for the last couple of months about getting the upgraded 2.3 L supercharger replacement from harrop. My question is, has one on this thread replaced their supercharger and if so what supporting mods would be needed. For example, injectors, fuel pump, transmission etc. thanks in advance for any help.
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