The real difference between a Jaguar buyer- today
#101
03-12-2016, 10:13 AM
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I do not believe Jaguar have a 'dilemma' when it comes to engines. The AJ engine series is what put them into the modern era and I believe they are already well along with supercharging smaller engines to produce sufficient power. Camshafts are probably the next thing to disappear from internal combustion engines as there are more efficient, lighter methods for inlet and exhaust gases to move in and out of the engine.
Even Aston Martin are going to move in a different direction with their new models.
By the way, it was not uncommon for the older F1 V12s to make 18 000 rpm or more. They were somewhat limited by valve speed.
Even Aston Martin are going to move in a different direction with their new models.
By the way, it was not uncommon for the older F1 V12s to make 18 000 rpm or more. They were somewhat limited by valve speed.
#102
03-12-2016, 10:50 AM
I do not believe Jaguar have a 'dilemma' when it comes to engines. The AJ engine series is what put them into the modern era and I believe they are already well along with supercharging smaller engines to produce sufficient power. Camshafts are probably the next thing to disappear from internal combustion engines as there are more efficient, lighter methods for inlet and exhaust gases to move in and out of the engine.
Even Aston Martin are going to move in a different direction with their new models.
By the way, it was not uncommon for the older F1 V12s to make 18 000 rpm or more. They were somewhat limited by valve speed.
Even Aston Martin are going to move in a different direction with their new models.
By the way, it was not uncommon for the older F1 V12s to make 18 000 rpm or more. They were somewhat limited by valve speed.
Aston Martin no longer has any good technical R&D. Ford will do what they did with Jaguar, nothing, use it to make their Taurus have the same front end.
A v12 would allow Jag to be at par with Several of its supercar competitors now. Also allow for Armored Range Rover.
#103
03-12-2016, 02:36 PM
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Moving forward, it appears Aston Martin are using Mercedes-AMG engines and electrical systems in their upcoming models as Daimler AG now own five percent of Aston Martin.
#104
03-12-2016, 03:37 PM
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I wish some would bring the BRM V16 back!! It makes more sense now than ever.
1.5 litre engine
600HP
pistons the size of lawnmower engine- insane fast revs, low center of gravity, near perfect response curve. Naturally balanced. What a sound. With todays design of direct injection, reverse cooling, micro turbos, variable cam, you could even do an insane version with 1000hp easy from the same 1.5l engine. Even back then you would get 12,000 rpm.
1.5 litre engine
600HP
pistons the size of lawnmower engine- insane fast revs, low center of gravity, near perfect response curve. Naturally balanced. What a sound. With todays design of direct injection, reverse cooling, micro turbos, variable cam, you could even do an insane version with 1000hp easy from the same 1.5l engine. Even back then you would get 12,000 rpm.
#105
03-12-2016, 03:56 PM
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Ford have not owned Aston Martin since 2007, so I am not sure what the Taurus has to do with Aston Martin or its styling cues.
Moving forward, it appears Aston Martin are using Mercedes-AMG engines and electrical systems in their upcoming models as Daimler AG now own five percent of Aston Martin.
Moving forward, it appears Aston Martin are using Mercedes-AMG engines and electrical systems in their upcoming models as Daimler AG now own five percent of Aston Martin.
#106
03-12-2016, 04:00 PM
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#107
03-12-2016, 04:05 PM
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Yes demonic power, all of which that came at once. Then again whats so different than the F1 turbo of Senna's day.
You owe me for this. I will ask for the favor back someday.
After a particularly trying time with reliability problems during a 1952 race at Ulster, Fangio was asked if he would ever drive the BRM again. He replied; "I will. I consider it to be, basically, the best Formula One car ever made. All it needs is improvement in certain details. No car has ever given me such a thrill to drive, or a greater sense of absolute mastery. I will stand by it".Unfortunately for both Fangio and BRM, the following day, tired after an overnight drive from Folkingham across Europe to Monza for a race, he crashed while driving for Maserati, breaking his neck, and retired from racing to recover until early 1953.
So note, he said that at the end of the career and not beginning.
You owe me for this. I will ask for the favor back someday.
After a particularly trying time with reliability problems during a 1952 race at Ulster, Fangio was asked if he would ever drive the BRM again. He replied; "I will. I consider it to be, basically, the best Formula One car ever made. All it needs is improvement in certain details. No car has ever given me such a thrill to drive, or a greater sense of absolute mastery. I will stand by it".Unfortunately for both Fangio and BRM, the following day, tired after an overnight drive from Folkingham across Europe to Monza for a race, he crashed while driving for Maserati, breaking his neck, and retired from racing to recover until early 1953.
So note, he said that at the end of the career and not beginning.
They were never able to sort a high RPM fuel delivery problem, the engine never got to really wind itself out either, it had more it could of done if it weren't for the mass of vendors putting it together making changes/fixes difficult to implement.
#108
03-12-2016, 05:02 PM
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I believe the Fusion you describe is from MY2013 forward. Perhaps there is a somewhat vague resemblance to Aston Martin, but the comment made was concerning the Taurus, which to me, looks nothing like anything other than a product of Dearborn.
#109
03-12-2016, 05:09 PM
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Jim Clark may be the only one to ever win a Formula 1 race with this engine, if memory serves...
#110
03-12-2016, 06:48 PM
#111
03-12-2016, 07:18 PM
This conversation came up when the smoothness of a Jag V12 was mentioned. There is nothing more balanced than a V16. I believe not even the boxers.
An over-square small piston engine is the only thing that can deliver motorbike like rise in rpm and have a very extended rpm range. Many wealthy eccentrics have tried to bring back the virtue of a over-square balanced engine car design. One even bolted 2 inline6 from Kawasaki bikes. Sabrro 12.
#112
03-12-2016, 07:33 PM
Gentlemen behold the most memorable sound from an engine ever. Some background, this is a recording made by Nick Mason who owned the car and has released a soundtrack of various cars, its both miked from the pit and inside the engine. You need a good stereo to really appreciate this. If you are in the Chicago area next month drop me a line, you will get a religious experience.
#113
03-12-2016, 08:39 PM
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#114
03-12-2016, 09:02 PM
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Interesting. Have you designed such an engine with an 'over square' piston to connecting rod ratio with increased torque output?
#115
03-12-2016, 11:20 PM
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#116
03-13-2016, 12:32 AM
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Gentlemen behold the most memorable sound from an engine ever. Some background, this is a recording made by Nick Mason who owned the car and has released a soundtrack of various cars, its both miked from the pit and inside the engine. You need a good stereo to really appreciate this. If you are in the Chicago area next month drop me a line, you will get a religious experience.
**NEW** BRM V16 Sound - YouTube
**NEW** BRM V16 Sound - YouTube
Last edited by jagxk2008; 03-13-2016 at 11:59 AM.
#117
03-13-2016, 03:07 PM
Indeed, however, engines such as this have little torque despite the 'motorbike rise in rpm'. As you hopefully know, the higher the rpm, the less potential torque the engine produces.
Interesting. Have you designed such an engine with an 'over square' piston to connecting rod ratio with increased torque output?
Interesting. Have you designed such an engine with an 'over square' piston to connecting rod ratio with increased torque output?
No I have not designed diddly. Just a hobbyist in that world.
About your other question, here is more info on BRM 8W - What? - BRM Type 15
Another huge advantage of having a very small perfectly balanced engine, you dont need a muffler.
#118
03-13-2016, 03:08 PM
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We've had the XJS V12 in our family. Actually that particular car was previously owned by the drummer of Extreme. The V12 Jag's are actually quite popular in my locale and often for sale. Totally different V12 though. The Jaguar engine is smoothing idling engine of it's day and quiet like a ninja. The Aston V12 is like an IMSA race car starting up.
Last edited by jagxk2008; 03-13-2016 at 03:32 PM.
#119
03-13-2016, 03:19 PM
Thats why your v12 sounds good, its more balanced.
This is my understanding. Imagine if you have 8 people farting, but they can only fart in groups of 3, basically you will have one group that will always be a member short. With 12 people you can have 4 perfect groups of 3- its a symphony. But a v16, even the pauses in-between are removed, so its a continuous glorious sound.
This is my understanding. Imagine if you have 8 people farting, but they can only fart in groups of 3, basically you will have one group that will always be a member short. With 12 people you can have 4 perfect groups of 3- its a symphony. But a v16, even the pauses in-between are removed, so its a continuous glorious sound.
#120
03-13-2016, 03:29 PM
Just kidding, a trade show, can divulge more in a PM.