Race Diagnostics,

Please explain why they are a disaster....

By the way, the ebay seller I purchased the poly bushings kit from is michaeldriver12345. He has a 100% positive rating on ebay....

 

They are poorly made, they are too large and need to be machined in order to get them to fit. They make fitting of the caster shims impossible.


Check out Rev Sams video, I unfortunately bought them before seeing this. By comparison the Powerflex units fitted easily and perfectly.

 

Thanks for your explanation. I will contact the seller in an effort to determine if what he is selling is the same product you unfortunately purchased....

I'll also go look for Reverend Sam's video to see what I can learn from it....

 

Race Diagnostics,

Thanks for suggesting that I watch Reverend Sam's two-part video of him battling those new upper control arm bushings to get them to fit properly. I must give him credit for his ingenuity and sticking with the task at hand. I never heard him say that those were indeed the black poly bushings from British Parts that you have referred to. Were they? And do you know if he left them in place for the remainder of the time he owned his XK8 or did he wind up replacing them with something else?

 

Update:

The poly upper control arm bushings that are coming to me from the UK are NOT from British Parts. The seller makes them himself, he has been making them for years, and he has never had a single complaint regarding them. He says they are blue, not black....

My Bilstein shocks from FCP Euro and KYB bellows and bump stops from PartsGeek arrived yesterday. My poly shock mount kits from Welsh Enterprises should be delivered this afternoon. That leaves just the poly upper control arm bushings from the UK to get here. We may get lucky and be able to get this job done before Christmas....

Stay tuned....

 

Does the wife know Santa will be out of money by Christmas?


Just kidding as that would be nice while the weather is nice, 70 degrees here today.


Wayne

 

Yep, I already told Jan that she is getting new front shocks, mounts, and bushings for Christmas instead of the new iPhone 6 that she wants. I had to duck as she threw her cast-iron frying pan at my head....

 

Update:

All ordered new parts for this job are now in hand except for the poly upper control arm bushings coming over from the UK. Ebay is lousy at providing arrival details. Wonder if they're sailing over on the QE3....

 

Update:

All new parts previously ordered are finally in hand. Wayne and I are planning to do this job on Monday at his home shop in Spencer, NC starting around 8:00 am (weather permitting). We would welcome anyone who wants to stop in and assist/observe. Just let me know in advance so I can bring enough lunch to feed everyone....

 

Update:

To take advantage of better weather for Wayne's hands, we will be doing my wife's 2006 XK8's front shocks / shock mounts / upper control arm bushings replacement job tomorrow (Sunday) morning. So anyone who shows up on Monday will be a day late and will miss lunch as well....

 

Although a worthy cause to replace the shocks and/or mounts at this stage, BrgJag is correct in his assertion that this will have no effect on the wheel alignment.


Unlike many of today's other vehicles where the strut takes the place of the upper control arm, these vehicles use a short arm - long arm design (double wishbone or twin A-frame or any of the many other names).


Although the coil spring is very important in ride height, all of the Wheel Alignment angles on this design are created by the upper and lower control arms. Specifically the location of the ball joints in relation to each other (SAI, Camber and Caster) and are created at this point.


As such, neither the shock nor the mount does little more than provide comfort to the passengers of the vehicle. It has no actual bearing on wheel alignment design or functionality as it is not part of the system.


Without knowing what the Alignment numbers look like, It is very difficult to guide in a direction.


If Camber is your goal, have you tried Manufactures who make aftermarket eccentrics (Specialty Products, Moog, etc...) outside of the Jaguar world at a much cheaper price. It is very simply a M12 x 105mm bolt. I don't recall what the eccentric head diameter is, but I'm sure you could research or measure it. The Lincoln LS uses a similar design and may prove useful. You would have to check the specs.


The shim kits are for Caster only, and unless you plan to get real specific or have a major problem - all the parts and pieces you need should already be there (in the car - 2 large and 2 small shims per side).


I hope some of this may prove useful

 

Anything that permits the ball joints to be in a position
that is not as designed affects alignment.

That would include any displacement of the control arms
in any plane.

This can include shocks where the shock is a pressurised
shock. I believe this to be the case for XK's.

 

Update:

Wayne and I battled the new front shocks / poly shock mount kits / poly upper control arm bushings job today and I'm very pleased to report that the results are excellent. The biggest issue was the cheap aluminum rivets supplied with the Welsh Enterprises poly shock mount kits. They kept popping on us after we would relieve pressure on the two metal mounting plates by unscrewing the three top-bolt nuts as required before re-installation into the shock assembly. So Wayne drilled out the lousy busted rivets and we took a trip to the local Lowe's to find the appropriate small screws and nuts to use instead of the supplied rivets. We found some stainless 10/32 x 1/2 countersunk-head fine-threaded sheet metal screws with their appropriate nuts. Wayne drilled out matching countersunk holes on the top metal plate to accept the screw head and a matching area into the poly bushing to accept the entire nut. Bingo - problem solved. And as a result, we did the second shock assembly in less than half the time it took us to do the first one....

Welsh Enterprises should really consider recommending this technique with their kit. Six screws and nuts would be needed instead of the six cheap aluminum rivets, so maybe that would add another two dollars to their cost. But it sure speeds up the new poly shock mount bushings install process and ends the frustration of those cheap rivets continuing to pop on you....

Many thanks to Wayne for his expertise, his knowledge, his ingenuity, and especially his friendship. The 120-mile drive back home tonight was as smooth and tight as my wife's XK8 has ever been during our nearly four years of ownership. I know she is going to love driving her car after getting behind the wheel tomorrow for the first time in more than three weeks....

Thanks again, Wayne! I had a blast as always and learned quite a bit about front suspension geometry on these cars....

Sleep well tonight - you deserve it!

 

Just wanted to add that of all the original front suspension components we replaced yesterday, the lower shock bushings were in the worst shape. You could grab them with your fingers and push them around quite easily. The upper shock mount bushings were indeed crumbling and crushed. I expected them to fall apart in my hands (as a number of members have reported) but they did not....

All things considered it was time and money well-spent. For cars as old as ours are now, if you want to keep them in good running order then sooner or later you have to address the worn-out OEM suspension components. For me, the front tire inner-edge treadwear issue was the catalyst to make me take this action now after installing a new pair of front tires in early December....

 

Rothwell,

I just bought a 2004 XKR convertible Portfolio car and I "feel" something that feels like a slight looseness in something in the front suspension. My car has 57,000 miles on it. The dealer also said I needed shims to property align the front Caster.

 

John, look in the engine compartment at the top of the shock tower and see if there is any flaking of the spongy material. Also check the ball joints as you are talking about a looseness, which is a little different than shocks will give you. If it's wondering around on the highway it could be bushings in front or rear. Not something you should let go without knowing the cause.


Wayne

 

Jon, if you have a minute, now that you have replaced all the worn suspension components, could you possibly share the ride height of your car for future reference? I assume something simple like the distance between the center of the wheel cap to the fender lip would help. Thanks again for sharing your parts choices and repair.

 

fmertz,

The mid-center cap to fender lip distance did not increase much. It was about 15.25 inches before Sunday's front suspension work. Now, it is closer to 15.5 inches....

 

fmertz, Let me add some things I observed and the reason for so little change. Take it or leave it for it's only my experience and others may know more.
The poly upper shock mounts when installed are not anywhere near the thickness of a standard mount, not talking about the inner mounts on the shock shaft, but the outer large circle upon a fresh installation.
Jon caught his mounts just before any major dissolving of the foam. His upper control arm bushings were not worn as such but were as hard as a rock with rust on the sleeves and inside the arms, so just not giving the cushion or going to last much longer with the sanding motion of the rust on the rubber. The rust was going to give the problem of freezing the bolt in the sleeves and if you haven't read about that nightmare, you need too.
So all in all Jon hit it right on the money in replacement time. A lesson for all, if your car is 10 or 15 years old, the rubber is deteriorating as we speak. We don't have to wait until something is worn out completely before replacement. I'm a little annul.


Wayne

 

So, in the end, do you guys think the ride height is where it should be? I was trying to sort of circle back to the original post about alignment (or lack thereof) and the cure that was applied.

Sounds like a fantastic repair, should add many more years of "jaguarness" to your ride.