Good quality tools
#21
07-04-2012, 12:01 PM
Junior Member
Bahco tools are outstanding! (6 point)
Having worked with hand tools all my life, working mainly in mining and marine as a fitter and engineer, the feel of a quality tool in my hand is very easy to recognise and appreciate.
Not too long ago I bought a full set of Bahco 1/4 inch and 1/2 inch drive socket sets to update my aging and disparate collection.
The Bahco was a considered decision, knowing that I wouldn't need another set in my life. It is only my opinion, but for car work 1/4 inch does well for all the small interior, under bonnet (hood) type work and 1/2 inch drive does well for all the under body, suspension, brakes and larger under bonnet work. I find 3/8 inch drive to be neither here nor there. So I leave it there; in the shop.
I couldn't believe my luck finding Bahco sets available locally and at a really good price. They are six point with excellent ratchets and accessories.
I believe this brand should be available to the OP in Europe.
Others of note apart from what others have mentioned;
Gedore (German) Beautiful spanners. Don't know about rest of range
S-K (USA) Only owned ratchet, but it is still terrific after very much use.
Proto (USA) Nice spanners, but a little thin in the handle for my comfort.
Sidchrome (Australia) Over rated. Out dated. Over priced. Sold on mind-fixed nationalistic loyalty method.
Tools that "don't break" or are "replaced without question" are not by that alone, "great tools"
Please note: If people want to use 12 point tools, I suggest that you use them only when there is an access or restricted movement problem. Otherwise use 6 point.
Same for adjustable spanners, they are great for portable emergency tool kit. If buying an adjustable, buy a "great" one.
We term tools that don't fit the head properly nutf***ers.
Enjoy your new tools Roadhogg, this tread has plenty of good info to help the decision.
Cheers Jeff
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Roadhogg (07-07-2012)
#22
07-04-2012, 12:15 PM
Junior Member
Highly polished chrome tools
Forgot to mention one thing that is very important to me when working in an oily environment....read "car" , is that the highly polished chrome tools are a PITA to handle.
The satin textured-like finish of some such as Gedore and the Bahco spanners and socket sets is a selling point for me.
Some one may know of others too?
The satin textured-like finish of some such as Gedore and the Bahco spanners and socket sets is a selling point for me.
Some one may know of others too?
#23
07-04-2012, 01:13 PM
Join Date: Oct 2007
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#24
07-04-2012, 01:30 PM
To Norri:
I've avoided buying ratchet spanners in the past because i heard they were less robust, though i can imagine they speed up removal of nuts and bolts where access is restricted.
It would be handy to have some at some point though, if i can find ones with strong ratchets.
To pdupler:
Point taken on keeping records of what tools i get. Had i done that originally i'd have a better idea of what was stolen, which ones i lent out and didn't get back, and what i've still got.
Between you all i now have a better idea of which types and makes of tool would be good buys, especially in terms of socket and spanner sets.
For my immediate needs i've just ordered that Snap-On set i linked to (but from a different seller with faster delivery), together with a set of AM Tech universal joints to use with them, mainly because i wanted to get the tools quite quickly to coincide with the expected/hopeful arrival of the fuel line disconnect tools.
I'm trying to get the intake manifold and cam covers off by Monday.
The need to aqcuire tools is by no means over, in fact it's probably just started, and as mentioned i still need torque wrenches, torx sets etc, so any further input on any types of tool i may need for these cars will still be most informative and welcome.
I'm still soaking the information up
I've avoided buying ratchet spanners in the past because i heard they were less robust, though i can imagine they speed up removal of nuts and bolts where access is restricted.
It would be handy to have some at some point though, if i can find ones with strong ratchets.
To pdupler:
Point taken on keeping records of what tools i get. Had i done that originally i'd have a better idea of what was stolen, which ones i lent out and didn't get back, and what i've still got.
Between you all i now have a better idea of which types and makes of tool would be good buys, especially in terms of socket and spanner sets.
For my immediate needs i've just ordered that Snap-On set i linked to (but from a different seller with faster delivery), together with a set of AM Tech universal joints to use with them, mainly because i wanted to get the tools quite quickly to coincide with the expected/hopeful arrival of the fuel line disconnect tools.
I'm trying to get the intake manifold and cam covers off by Monday.
The need to aqcuire tools is by no means over, in fact it's probably just started, and as mentioned i still need torque wrenches, torx sets etc, so any further input on any types of tool i may need for these cars will still be most informative and welcome.
I'm still soaking the information up
#25
07-05-2012, 09:42 AM
As others have said, most name brands are of reasonable quality and unless you are using these professionally day in and day put, it is unlikely that you will ever wear out a ratchet or break a socket.
+1 on that and an important point to bear in mind when weighing up costs versus the amount of time you will use them. I have Teng in the UK and have always found them to be very good- they'll take some abuse(verbal as well as physical
) I find Halford's tools to be tough but not as comfortable to use - thinner sections etc..
+1 on that and an important point to bear in mind when weighing up costs versus the amount of time you will use them. I have Teng in the UK and have always found them to be very good- they'll take some abuse(verbal as well as physical
) I find Halford's tools to be tough but not as comfortable to use - thinner sections etc..FWIW, I have a Halfords socket set. It appears to be the same components as the Lowes budget-line Taskforce. Then again, I did have the 3/8 ratchet from that set come apart in my hands (the other parts of it seem to be OK though).
One other rule I have is never to dither about buying a tool, even if it seems like I won't use it often. Almost every item I have has paid for itself and for those that haven't they've been subsidised by those that have many times over. (Though there is some specialized diagnostic equipment that is excluded from this).
Last edited by Richy_T; 07-05-2012 at 09:49 AM.
#26
07-05-2012, 09:49 AM
To Norri:
I've avoided buying ratchet spanners in the past because i heard they were less robust, though i can imagine they speed up removal of nuts and bolts where access is restricted.
It would be handy to have some at some point though, if i can find ones with strong ratchets.
I've avoided buying ratchet spanners in the past because i heard they were less robust, though i can imagine they speed up removal of nuts and bolts where access is restricted.
It would be handy to have some at some point though, if i can find ones with strong ratchets.
Another great item I have is a 3/8 ratchet which works as normal but can also be ratcheted by twisting the handle like a screwdriver. Handy for those areas where even one click of the ratchet is tricky. The only thing better would be battery powered (that wasn't so huge as to be practically unusable. A simple tool you can use everywhere is better than a tool you can only use half the time).
Does Jag use 12-point hex-type bolts? That's one where it's worth having a set so you won't be tempted to use a Torx.
I'm in the bending-bar torque-wrench camp (though I really should get around to trying a click-type sometime)
I always seem to be looking for my mole grips so I would definitely say they are handy to have in several sizes and styles.
I agree with the statement about the adjustable spanners above. Adjustables best avoided whenever possible on cars, sloppy adjustables triply-so.
If you're going to be removing interior panels, there's a proper tool for the job. It's worth having and using it.
Socket extensions with the wobble end help a lot.
My socket set didn't come with long-reach sockets. Definitely worth having. Also hex sockets.
Breaker bar. I could kick myself for not having one for so long.
I could go on...
Last edited by Richy_T; 07-05-2012 at 10:02 AM.
#27
07-05-2012, 10:05 AM
I've been very happy with Wiha bits, myself. I'm just looking for a good ratchet set, however, and looks like I should go for Gedore. It is also tempting to buy a larger Kamasa Tools set. Anyone with experience of these?
#28
07-05-2012, 11:11 AM
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#29
07-05-2012, 03:27 PM
Veteran Member
As written by Phil
I've photographed everything in my box, open all drawers and lay out all tools, I've been doing this for the last thirty years never had a claim but with photo graphic evidence it's pretty hard for the insurance company to deny coverage.
This thread made me think too to pass on a little advice I learned from a friend's misfortune about 10 years ago. Once you start buying lots of individual tools, keep a database inventory. A good friend of mine lost his entire rollaway tool cabinet to thieves in broad daylight. He was mowing his yard in a typical middle-class suburban neighborhood - all homes with front-entry garages. He opened the door of his two-car garage to get the mower out. Once he had finished mowing the front lawn, he went around to mow the back and left his garage door open. In the 30 minutes or so he was mowing in back, thieves backed a truck up to his garage, hoisted his rollaway tool cabinet into the truck and drove off. He heard nothing over the sound of the mower.
He made a claim on his insurance, listing out the tools that were stolen to the best of his recollection. He took his insurance settlement on a buying spree to replace everything. For years afterward, every time he starts a new project, he remembers a tool that he used to have and forgot to file on his insurance. He says its aggravating to have to stop what he's doing to make a trip to Sears to buy a tool he used to have. Based on Paul's experience, I spent time making an inventory of my tools in an MS Access database and have added new tools to it as I buy them.
I've also inventoried household electronics and stuff of value. Insurance will cover pre-set amounts for stuff like clothing, towels, sheets, kitchen utensils, etc. They also will cover tools found in the typical home garage like they did for my friend Paul, but we gearheads tend to have a lot more than any typical tool set.
A quick query shows I have exactly 370 hand tools, 111 wrenches, 178 sockets, you get the picture. Anything that has a serial number, that has been recorded as well. Everyone should make an inventory of their tools for insurance purposes. Heck, it might even help you remember to get a tool back if you loan it to somebody.
He made a claim on his insurance, listing out the tools that were stolen to the best of his recollection. He took his insurance settlement on a buying spree to replace everything. For years afterward, every time he starts a new project, he remembers a tool that he used to have and forgot to file on his insurance. He says its aggravating to have to stop what he's doing to make a trip to Sears to buy a tool he used to have. Based on Paul's experience, I spent time making an inventory of my tools in an MS Access database and have added new tools to it as I buy them.
I've also inventoried household electronics and stuff of value. Insurance will cover pre-set amounts for stuff like clothing, towels, sheets, kitchen utensils, etc. They also will cover tools found in the typical home garage like they did for my friend Paul, but we gearheads tend to have a lot more than any typical tool set.
A quick query shows I have exactly 370 hand tools, 111 wrenches, 178 sockets, you get the picture. Anything that has a serial number, that has been recorded as well. Everyone should make an inventory of their tools for insurance purposes. Heck, it might even help you remember to get a tool back if you loan it to somebody.
#30
07-05-2012, 04:19 PM
Originally posted by Richy_T
Also consider that you can start with a regular spanner and use the ratchet spanners to do the yawnsome work.
Also consider that you can start with a regular spanner and use the ratchet spanners to do the yawnsome work.
Thanks for reminding me of that Richy_T, it was something i'd heard of in the distant past but long since forgotten.
I might try to acquire some after all.
Originally posted by Richy_T
Another great item I have is a 3/8 ratchet which works as normal but can also be ratcheted by twisting the handle like a screwdriver.
Another great item I have is a 3/8 ratchet which works as normal but can also be ratcheted by twisting the handle like a screwdriver.
Do i take it there are 2 types of torque wrench, ie: bending bar and click type?
+1 RCSign - taking photos sounds like a lot less work than writing everything down
#31
07-05-2012, 05:14 PM
Thanks for reminding me of that Richy_T, it was something i'd heard of in the distant past but long since forgotten.
I might try to acquire some after all.
That sounds handy as well.
Do i take it there are 2 types of torque wrench, ie: bending bar and click type?
+1 RCSign - taking photos sounds like a lot less work than writing everything down
I might try to acquire some after all.
That sounds handy as well.
Do i take it there are 2 types of torque wrench, ie: bending bar and click type?
+1 RCSign - taking photos sounds like a lot less work than writing everything down
#32
07-05-2012, 07:11 PM
Veteran Member
Yes, there are, and one problem is that some young mechanics are not well enough trained and they will use an impact wrench to tighten something and then put the click wrench on it and when it clicks they think that that's it. In that case what they have usually done is to over torque the bolt.
#33
07-05-2012, 07:27 PM
Veteran Member
#35
07-05-2012, 07:36 PM
Veteran Member
Some of the best precision instruments on the market come from Asia.
#36
07-05-2012, 07:38 PM
Veteran Member
#37
07-05-2012, 07:40 PM
#38
07-05-2012, 07:59 PM
If you use the wrench to tighten the bolt all of the way and stop at the proper torque setting, all is good, no matter which wrench you use.
What we were talking about is when "mechanics" are in a hurry to do a job, and use an impact wrench to tighten the bolt or nut and go overboard.
I have watched them do this when they were putting the wheels back on my car. I went to the manager and told him about it, and he went back and re torqued the nuts to the proper torque setting.
I was a quality control inspector for eight years in nuclear power plants and the process for properly torquing the bolts on the valves and fittings was very precise and laid out, bolt by bolt in a sequence so as to assure a proper seal. As inspectors, we set the settings on the wrench and monitored the sequence and so forth.
I know of one inspector who set the torque wrenches to the wrong setting and it caused millions of dollars of re work.
#39
07-05-2012, 08:36 PM
Yes, I did the same thing when I did my initial inventory. I need to do that again as my tools have more than doubled in the last ten years. Difficulty tho is that all my drawers are so cluttered with tools on top of tools its now hard to show everything in a picture of an open drawer. Kind of need to take stuff out and spread it all out like I did in the initial inventory. Good reminder.
#40
07-06-2012, 10:27 AM
Junior Member
Tool quality
Steel is still steel. You just have to be willing to pay for the proper manufacturing processes. The public gets what they are willing to pay for. No more, no less. The mass market determines what is on the shelves at retailers. The top notch stuff has to be hunted down at specialty suppliers. Sears Craftsman is an exception. But even they have taken some short cuts in recent years.
Some of the best precision instruments on the market come from Asia.
Some of the best precision instruments on the market come from Asia.
Japan has been making beautiful test and measurement euqipment for decades. Mitutoyo and Seiko spring to mind. Their sword steel is quite good apparently.
Take a google look at the Chinese C919 pasanger aircraft, to see how far their manufacturing has come.
Speaking of torque wrenches, what was said earlier about the overzealous use of air impact drivers on wheel nuts, "do it up really tight and it wont come loose" mentality is very wrong.
When I found slithers of steel (lots) on studs and wheel nuts of both our cars it gave me a fright. What is about to strip, the stud or nut?
Degreased, washed and light lube, they look OK, but repeated abuse would destroy them.
Now the instructions are clear at the tyre shop. No rattle gun, finish with torque wrench please.
The one I like to use at home is a Stahlwille clicking one. (Don't have to bend down to read it)
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PaulJ (04-14-2013)