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Hey bud, how did you make out with your experimentation? Did you find a good product to refinish the wood with?
My original shifter knob looks like someone hit it with a hammer. There are numerous cracks and chips missing
going down to the wood and it looks like the finish has separated from the wood. I tried the crazy glue and it did
fill in some of the cracks but didn't make it under the old finish to the wood.
I plan to remove the old finish with the heat gun and sanding but I would like to know what to use to refinish it.
Hey bud, how did you make out with your experimentation? Did you find a good product to refinish the wood with?
My original shifter knob looks like someone hit it with a hammer. There are numerous cracks and chips missing
going down to the wood and it looks like the finish has separated from the wood. I tried the crazy glue and it did
fill in some of the cracks but didn't make it under the old finish to the wood.
I plan to remove the old finish with the heat gun and sanding but I would like to know what to use to refinish it.
Unfortunately, leaking on two of mine and playing with various more important things took over from playing with the wood. But, a few things
1. After sitting for months in the solvents (alcohol, naptha, acetone, lacquer thinner), the poly chips taken from a shift knob look as fresh as the day I put them in. Methylene chloride is banned in the US, so I couldn't try that, but expect no different results even if I could use it.
2. I'm just not patient enough to 'bake' the finish off with a heat gun. For me, there's an extremely fine line between softening and charring.
3. I'm currently using a uv cured coating to fill the cracks as above https://www.solarez.com/product/fly-...thin-bone-dry/. That appears to work fine as a crack filler, though I have not had time to temperature cycle anything. Something like this or what Rothwell used on his header would probably work fine as a bulk cover too.
4. The real issue is getting a good color to dye or stain the oxidized wood under the crack or where the polyester coating has been cracked a long time. That has been tricky. It needs to be fairly dark to cover, but not localized around the crack in the coating, emphasizing that it was cracked. I've got a wood dye (Transtint HS6003) that I have used in various ways on my 'test piece' I just need to figure out what a good range of solvent is per unit dye. Too little dye (too much solvent) and it drags the original stain out of the area. Too much dye and it doesn't spread well. Too much works far better than too little dye. This is where I was when I stopped a while back. Will likely continue relatively soon since there's no evidence anything is leaking any more, and I might be at home more often than originally expected...
On the other hand, all of my shift knobs are beautiful replacements (2 walnut for the 2002s, 1 elm that matches the 2001 idiosyncratic finish better) from
In my opinion, the old knobs lack style compared with every bit of veneer. The new knobs look great and fit well with the shift surrounds and dash. Replacement walnut burl shift knob and center panel.
Thanks for your help. I'll try some of the bone dry and buy the necissary UV lights. I bought a "new" shifter knob that looks close
enough to my interior from a forum member who was parting out his '97. Thanks for the links though. I have a few weeks off work
thanks to Covid 19 so I have some spare time to play around trying to get the old stuff off. I have lots of extra walnut in the work shop
and some different stains to try out to get a good match. The temperatures here go from -30C, about -22F in winter and up to +30C.
about 86F in the summer so there is quite a temperature swing. I'm hoping the bone dry can handle it.
Reporting the end of this for completeness, this started more than 6 months ago, and I've ended the 'chemistry' portion of the event since I'd like this space back on my bench.
'Bad' news, Acetone, Lacquer Thinner, Alcohol and Naptha do nothing to the polyester coating on the veneer. The chips in the bottom of the solvents are intact after ~6 months submersion (see below). I believe one of these may be mixed at this point, but nothing happened there either.
"Good' news, methylene chloride works great (see below). I was able to acquire some of the 'weaker' old Kleen Strip with methylene chloride, somehow. It took about two days with the gel stripper sitting on the polyester to remove most of the coating.
Bad news. As noted on other threads, no one sells methylene chloride to consumers now in the US after last fall. Professional refinishers can still use methylene chloride. Note: the principal risk is from lack of sufficient ventilation. Please use with care if you have old stock (i.e. put your head down in a bathtub you are stripping in a closed room).
Now, I plan to proceed with the last refinishing of this last 'test piece' before I do the one on the car. I've tried polyurethane (Minwax and Varethane), two part epoxy (Total Boat) and UV cure polyester (Solarez medium). Of the three, the polyester is probably the easiest and best. The polyurethane took forever to make a reasonable finish, the two part epoxy I chose takes quite a while to cure, and I had difficulty in my house keeping bubbles down and surface imperfections falling from the box I put it in with the extended cure I chose (~ 6 hours set), even with the use of a small torch. I did try pulling a vacuum on the part, but that didn't improve things much. With the polyester, you choose exactly how long you want the coating to 'relax' to get rid of the bubbles. I have used ~60-90 minutes, you can inspect the wet surface and coating before deciding to cure for both the 'sanding sealer' coat and the final coat. I have been using a UV light for 20 seconds to a minute to set everything, then taking it outside to finish curing in the sun for about 5 minutes.
The only tricky part about the polyester is that it is incredibly hard. So, the first levelling steps with a moderate grit sandpaper needs to be done with a gentle hand to prevent deep scratches from propagating to higher grits. I now use the micromesh system before final polishing.
The veneer coating laughs at your silly solvents.
Methylene chloride works. Strips the coating without damaging the veneer (left side of the shift surround), right side of shift surround darkened by heat method (tough 'test' shift surround)
Thanks for the progress report. Can't wait to see photos of the restored wood when you finish! I replaced the dash wood in our XKR as part of a retrograde to the triple guages in place of the worthless navigation screen, and now I need to refinish the gearshift surround and door window switch trim pieces to better match the dash. Your research and experimentation will be very helpful.
I recently purchased a replacement burl wood gear shift knob for my 2006 XK8 and had some issues trying to get the shift knob lock nut loose in order to remove the shift knob. The lock nut is tapered with three indentations each spaced at 120 degrees around the top. The knob has such a taper to it that it was impossible to get any type of pliers or vice grips on it without scratching or causing damage to the lock nut. Then I stumbled across a tool used by dentist at a garage sale. The pliers are “Henry Schein Baade Band & Crown Remover 100-8005”. It worked like a charm and I was able to remove the old knob and replace it with the new on in less than 5 minutes without causing any damage or scratching to the lock nut. I simply placed each point of the pliers in the indentations and turned the lock nut a quarter turn clockwise. Then just unscrew the shift knob counter clockwise and remove. Install the new knob, position and lock in place by turning the lock nut counter clockwise until snug. A quick search on Ebay brings up several of these pliers at various prices. Hope this helps other members facing the same challenge. Henry Schein Baade Band & Crown Remover 100-8005 Henry Schein Baade Band & Crown Remover 100-8005 Each indentation is spaced 120 degrees each around the top of the lock nut Indentations in shift knob lock nut New Custom Knob
That's a Baade type band and crown remover, so Baade would be another good search term. I just searched eBay for "dental band pliers" and got 8K+ hits.
Your new burled knob is gorgeous and it looks great with your wood!
At a slow simmer running through the whole 'crazytimes' to date, I finally have an acceptable ultraviolet-cure polyester finish on my shift surround (see below). Some lessons I have learned all the way back to the beginning:
1. Polyurethane finishes did not work for me in general. To me, it doesn't look like the original, and I had poly finishes in a previous van that did not wear well.
2. Methylene chloride works as a stripper for the original coating, but you can't get it anymore except via the 'black market'. So, on to #3.
3. The 'heat method' easily removes the polyester finish, as long as you have the right heat gun. I had problems with this early on (taking a long time and burning the wood) and it was because my gun didn't have enough airflow. You need lots of airflow. This is the heat gun I ended up with (also great for removing sill treadplates). I figured this out about a year ago.
4. If you use the heat gun from 3. and airflow tangential to the piece, it takes the finish off a shift surround in about 15 minutes. I have avoided using sharp tools in the 'scraping portion of the heating and removal event' to avoid scratching the finish. This works great.
5. I have tried several of Solarez's sunlight-cure polyester finishes. Particularly I have used
The gloss polyester worked better for me as far as getting rid of bubbles.
6. In previous experience, I have used a small torch to get rid of bubbles in epoxies. That is a BAD IDEA here. The Solarez formula ignites relatively easily if you'd like a fire on your wood. A heat gun works fine at low airflow high heat. When I used an older pint of gloss I had, I had more problems with the bubbles. I probably needed some MEK to thin it, but I think the shelf life of Solarez is not infinite anyway,
7. I had great difficulty getting rid of the bubbles with the Acrylic Modified Polyester. Pro: this should be tougher than the regular polyester. Con: the d@mn bubbles. Perhaps MEK would have helped here too, but the regular was working fine. If it lasts another 20 years, I'm probably good.
8. I have a vacuum chamber for solvents. I tried this with the Solarez. This is not a helpful way to get rid of bubbles unless you want to make it very thin and use multiple coats. Otherwise, bubbles akimbo.
9. I used one coat of grain sealer, level sanded with 1500 grit micromesh, one coat of polyester, level sanded with 1500 grit micromesh, a final coat of polyester, sanded at 1500, 1800, 2400, 3200, 4000, 6000, 8000, 12000, polish.
10. When you're near the finish line, don't 'try out' the new polish at 1800 rpm on the polisher. Alternatively, always try the new polish on a scrap piece. Alternatively, gorilla-like grip is bad for the final step. Alternatively, you just spent two hours hand sanding the piece, what was 15 minutes more hand polishing?
11. My wrist/elbow are still sore.
12. I love the micromesh 'sandpaper' for this. Expensive, but extensively reusable. I hand sanded everything on the shift surround because of the corners on the piece. For most of the dash, I would probably machine sand.
13. I still have no way to 'repair' the weathering cracks in the wood. My issue is that it needs to match across the grain with variegated colors and the 'crack' is inevitably at some angle to most of the grain. I've tried too many things to mention. Most either look bad or end up changing the color of the veneer. One could reveneer a surround, which I suspect is a good option if reveneering the whole dash.
14. I solved this problem by refinishing a shift surround I had with only one inobtrusive crack. It matches my steering wheel and shift knob (from Myrtle) well and the dash relatively well.
15. Hopefully someone finds this useful. I'm using the forum to archive this for me so I can easily find it when I want to do this next time.
Bottom line, I'm finally satisfied with the results, and the finish is consistent with the reveneered surround on one of my other cars that I bought from Myrtle a while back to replace the 'milky white' jag wood.
The refinished shift surround below is from that 'milky white' set, now a glorious refinished walnut burl.
Shift surround done. Estimated cost = large. Estimated amount of time taken = years.
I recently purchased a replacement burl wood gear shift knob for my 2006 XK8 and had some issues trying to get the shift knob lock nut loose in order to remove the shift knob. The lock nut is tapered with three indentations each spaced at 120 degrees around the top. The knob has such a taper to it that it was impossible to get any type of pliers or vice grips on it without scratching or causing damage to the lock nut. Then I stumbled across a tool used by dentist at a garage sale. The pliers are “Henry Schein Baade Band & Crown Remover 100-8005”. It worked like a charm and I was able to remove the old knob and replace it with the new on in less than 5 minutes without causing any damage or scratching to the lock nut. I simply placed each point of the pliers in the indentations and turned the lock nut a quarter turn clockwise. Then just unscrew the shift knob counter clockwise and remove. Install the new knob, position and lock in place by turning the lock nut counter clockwise until snug. A quick search on Ebay brings up several of these pliers at various prices. Hope this helps other members facing the same challenge. Henry Schein Baade Band & Crown Remover 100-8005 Henry Schein Baade Band & Crown Remover 100-8005 Each indentation is spaced 120 degrees each around the top of the lock nut Indentations in shift knob lock nut New Custom Knob
I actually have one of those crown removers in my crown and bridge tray and I almost never use it because it has a tendency to fracture temporary crowns or result in pulling a buildup. Never thought to use it in the Jag.
Also beautiful job. It looks like art. Thank you for talking the time to make a guide for us of what worked. It will surely help many members!
Last edited by giandanielxk8; 11-23-2021 at 05:45 PM.
Hey 2 things:
1)I wasn't clear, what polyester finish produced the final result?
2) good news I found a great source for the best prices/ great selection on the micro mesh: Scientific American. Prices were a fraction of what I saw elsewhere.
Last piece of furniture I made, I purchased a nice stock of the micro mesh in full size sanding sheets (8x12 or something). Just cut them to fit my palm sander - life was good!
For the folks unfamiliar with this sandpaper, by the time you get to using the 10,000 grit, I've seen birch wood get reflective like a mirror!
Hey 2 things:
1)I wasn't clear, what polyester finish produced the final result?
2) good news I found a great source for the best prices/ great selection on the micro mesh: Scientific American. Prices were a fraction of what I saw elsewhere.
Last piece of furniture I made, I purchased a nice stock of the micro mesh in full size sanding sheets (8x12 or something). Just cut them to fit my palm sander - life was good!
For the folks unfamiliar with this sandpaper, by the time you get to using the 10,000 grit, I've seen birch wood get reflective like a mirror!
Thanks again Dale
John
No worries, John.
1. The gloss polyester (the first one listed) overlaying the grain sealer is the best and final choice.
2. Couldn't find that, do you have a link? I'm surprised anything good comes from them these days. I just gave up my subscription to SA after 41 years (and I have all issues back to 1910 and partial back to the mid 1860s). Got tired of poorly informed journalists writing the articles rather than top scientists themselves, and the editors and staff appear to hate their readers and appear to have no joy for science.
But micromesh is great stuff. Worth every penny. Wash it ,and it lasts quite a while.
Dale, ill get a link. Looks like fingers typed faster than brain, sorry. I didn't mean to type the magazine name, I meant the retail mail entity that sells everything you can imagine from a science laboratory situation. Name is close, tip of my tongue.
No worries, if I can't recall, their HQ is 10 miles north of me here on rt 202 in Bridgewater. I'll update. Apologies.
Thank you for sharing your journey and the superb results!
I replaced the dash wood in our XKR with a nicer set and retrograded from Nav to three gauges, but now need to refinish the shifter and door switch surrounds to match. Your hard-earned knowledge will be incredibly helpful!
03-24-2020, 10:02 PM
