XK8 / XKR ( X100 ) 1996 - 2006

Stability control failure/failsafe engine

Thread Tools
 
Search this Thread
 
  #21  
Old 02-17-2015, 05:52 AM
RJ237's Avatar
Veteran Member
Join Date: Dec 2010
Location: Douglasville Ga.
Posts: 8,704
Received 2,820 Likes on 2,247 Posts
Default

Originally Posted by Billll
When the ASC kicks in the engine is automatically reduced from 8 cyl to 2 or 3 or something like that. If the Stability control is stuck on, then the engine would be permanently in limp mode.

I'll fix the ABS module and see if that does it.
Where did you find the info that the engine is automatically reduced to 2 or 3 cylinders?
 
  #22  
Old 02-18-2015, 02:44 AM
jamdmyers's Avatar
Veteran Member
Join Date: Aug 2013
Location: Poughkeepsie NY
Posts: 1,036
Received 271 Likes on 240 Posts
Default

There are 2 Limp Modes,

1. Involving the Throttle
Mechanical, cable operated 'limp home' mode with restricted throttle opening.The limp home mechanism consists of the accelerator input shaft link lever and the two throttle shaft levers, all three levers being interlocked for limp home operation. If a failure in the throttle mechanism or control system results in the engine management system selecting the limp home mode, motor power is cut by de-energising the motor supply relay and/or by de-activating the PWM motor control signal. In limp home mode, the throttle valve is operated mechanically from the drivers pedal and throttle opening is restricted to a range from idle to a maximum of approximately 30 degrees.

2. The Transmission / TCM
The TCM constantly monitors the transmission for faults. In the event of a problem the TCM will adopt a 'limp home' mode in which only P R N D - (selector in D but only fourth gear is enabled) are available. The operator will be made aware of certain faults by an instrument panel warning.The electrical and diagnostic system has been designed such that system integrity is protected at all times, the safety concept being based on the following three points:The hydraulic system has 'fail-safe' characteristics regarding its electrical operation, such that should the power supply be lost to the electro-hydraulic actuators the transmission will initiate a limp-home mode.Recognition of critical shift operation by monitoring the last element in the signal path, ie the solenoid valve, and checking by means of redundant measured variables, ie engine speed, input speed and output speed.Each time the vehicle is started there is a check on the entire safety hardware and the associated program parts and signal paths. A malfunction in this part of the system, or triggering of the safety circuit, is communicated to the operator through the illumination of the transmission warning lamp.
 
The following 5 users liked this post by jamdmyers:
batroute (02-18-2015), Gibso (06-18-2015), RJ237 (02-18-2015), rocklandjag (02-21-2015), sklimii (02-18-2015)
  #23  
Old 02-18-2015, 07:59 AM
Billll's Avatar
Member
Thread Starter
Join Date: Feb 2014
Location: Littleton, CO
Posts: 47
Likes: 0
Received 4 Likes on 4 Posts
Default

That would be 2 or 3 cylinders of output power equivalent. I was sure the system did it differently but I had no idea how and thanks to jamdmeyers for explaining it. If the mechanism hadn't been sufficiently complicated I'm sure Jaguar would never have used it.
 
  #24  
Old 02-19-2015, 05:56 AM
jamdmyers's Avatar
Veteran Member
Join Date: Aug 2013
Location: Poughkeepsie NY
Posts: 1,036
Received 271 Likes on 240 Posts
Default

Now if you were talking Cadillac STS Northstar that's a different answer, That motor will run on 4 of the 8 cylinders when it's in limp mode, mostly to keep the engine cool and I'm not sure which ones it picks, prob 2 / bank fyi
 
  #25  
Old 02-21-2015, 12:08 AM
Billll's Avatar
Member
Thread Starter
Join Date: Feb 2014
Location: Littleton, CO
Posts: 47
Likes: 0
Received 4 Likes on 4 Posts
Default

So we got the car into the shop and did the thing with the module, soldering the suspect wires securely to the board. Put it back in and all the codes had magically disappeared. Made it about 3/4 mile and they all came back this time with a check engine lamp instead of the ABS lamp. Turned off the key and when I turned it back on, the codes were gone although the check engine light was still there. Drove back to the shop and took the mechanic on a short test drive. Made it about a mile and the problem returned. Left it in the shop with a P0121 code showing on the code reader.

The mechanic says he suspects the throttle body sensor but can't say for sure.

P.S. The module job took an hour and a half and required loosening the 3 outside brake lines so as to move them enough to get the module out.
Note 1: The 4 screws on the front of the module require a torx E-5 socket.
Note 2: Splitting the case requires removal of 4 push nuts located under the 4 Torx screws. Use a dental pick to lift them off the standoffs.
Note 3: Replacing the washer filler spout requires pushing the brake lines back pretty close to where they were.

Add these items to the work description over in the sedan forum.

I remain open to suggestions as to the cause of the Stability control failure/failsafe engine problem.
 
  #26  
Old 02-21-2015, 12:07 PM
Gus's Avatar
Gus
Gus is offline
Veteran Member
Join Date: Jul 2008
Location: Berlin Md.
Posts: 11,341
Received 2,216 Likes on 1,703 Posts
Default

The P0121 is often a compatibility issue with the throttle position sensor and the plug this link should help.

Link JagRepair.com - Jaguar Repair Information Resource
 
The following users liked this post:
Gibso (06-18-2015)
  #27  
Old 02-23-2015, 10:18 PM
Billll's Avatar
Member
Thread Starter
Join Date: Feb 2014
Location: Littleton, CO
Posts: 47
Likes: 0
Received 4 Likes on 4 Posts
Default

A co-worker informs me that some models of Cadillac are prone to the identical problem I'm seeing and the Caddy dealer replaced the TPS unit at no charge which fixed the problem.

Jag will happily replace your entire throttle body, TPS and all at your expense but won't sell you the sensor. As it happens the sensor is also used on Aprillia motorcycles, specifically the '98-'03 RSV1000 models. P/N 198500-3220.
Update: Aprillia P/N AP0274030 Price $182 at Fay Mayers Honda motorcycles in Denver
Does anyone know of other sources for the sensor? Aliexpress, mentioned on another thread no longer has them.
 

Last edited by Billll; 02-24-2015 at 07:36 PM. Reason: New Info
The following users liked this post:
Gibso (06-18-2015)
  #28  
Old 02-24-2015, 08:11 AM
Gus's Avatar
Gus
Gus is offline
Veteran Member
Join Date: Jul 2008
Location: Berlin Md.
Posts: 11,341
Received 2,216 Likes on 1,703 Posts
Default

It is an issue with the plug not the TPS.
 
  #29  
Old 02-24-2015, 07:39 PM
Billll's Avatar
Member
Thread Starter
Join Date: Feb 2014
Location: Littleton, CO
Posts: 47
Likes: 0
Received 4 Likes on 4 Posts
Default

My mechanic reports that he cleaned both plugs thoroughly and has put 5+ miles on the car without seeing the faults return.

Fingers crossed.
 
  #30  
Old 03-29-2015, 07:47 PM
Billll's Avatar
Member
Thread Starter
Join Date: Feb 2014
Location: Littleton, CO
Posts: 47
Likes: 0
Received 4 Likes on 4 Posts
Default

At this point I will report that the problem has not come back. He showed me his tool set which included a pair of tweezers with abrasive on the inside which can reach down inside the plugs and polish the pins. Clever tool. The kind of thing you'll need once in your lifetime but will not fix the problem without.

Summer is icumin in which means the Sno-Cat will be spending most of the next 6 months under a cover. All I have to do is remember to take it out once a month to keep the battery up.

At this point I believe I could be talked into trading it straight across for an '05 or '06 Subaru Baja which would be less stressful.
 
  #31  
Old 08-23-2015, 11:28 PM
ant17's Avatar
Senior Member
Join Date: Mar 2011
Location: Chicago
Posts: 463
Received 16 Likes on 15 Posts
Default

Originally Posted by Billll
When the ASC kicks in the engine is automatically reduced from 8 cyl to 2 or 3 or something like that. If the Stability control is stuck on, then the engine would be permanently in limp mode.

I'll fix the ABS module and see if that does it.
My stability light is stuck on and I still cruise at 90 on the freeway.
 
Related Topics
Thread
Thread Starter
Forum
Replies
Last Post
D.K
XF and XFR ( X250 )
50
12-10-2023 02:05 AM
cissdm
X-Type ( X400 )
10
05-03-2016 06:02 AM
XJsc-guy
PRIVATE For Sale / Trade or Buy Classifieds
6
09-25-2015 11:09 AM
scottatl
XK8 / XKR ( X100 )
2
09-04-2015 08:08 PM
OkieTim
Jaguar Forums Feedback & Suggestion Center
2
09-02-2015 12:48 PM

Currently Active Users Viewing This Thread: 1 (0 members and 1 guests)
 


Quick Reply: Stability control failure/failsafe engine



All times are GMT -5. The time now is 05:22 PM.