Wheel Shimmy Cured w/ Lower Ball Joints
#42
03-17-2010, 09:17 AM
fighting my way through negative camber
Hi,
My 97 XK8 is driving to the left and wearing the inside drivers tire. Went to the garage, asked them to re-align, they said new ball joints.
So I bought a whole kit, all bushes, ball joints etc.
Now after couple hours and much effort, I managed to get the upper arm off, hacksaw and big press got the upper ball joint out and new in.
Now I see that the lower strut bushes are completely broke up, I guess this is the cause of the camber, what an effort to get it out, I used a press whilst the upper strut is still located on the car and it pushed out the inner pin, left in the body, another 30 mins and much effort finally got the rest of the bush body out. Are they supposed to be so tight and I am guess I can expect much effort to push in the new bush. Any idea's anyone?
Thanks
My 97 XK8 is driving to the left and wearing the inside drivers tire. Went to the garage, asked them to re-align, they said new ball joints.
So I bought a whole kit, all bushes, ball joints etc.
Now after couple hours and much effort, I managed to get the upper arm off, hacksaw and big press got the upper ball joint out and new in.
Now I see that the lower strut bushes are completely broke up, I guess this is the cause of the camber, what an effort to get it out, I used a press whilst the upper strut is still located on the car and it pushed out the inner pin, left in the body, another 30 mins and much effort finally got the rest of the bush body out. Are they supposed to be so tight and I am guess I can expect much effort to push in the new bush. Any idea's anyone?
Thanks
#43
03-17-2010, 11:55 AM
Veteran member
The car will benefit from all new suspension bushings when the project is done CharlotteJag. Can't help you on the removal and reinstall, but can assure you, that if you truly get a good alignment done, you can limit the amount of uneven tire wear (inside edge) that occurs. Trust me, I know after 3 sets of tires. Most garages don't know the correct way to align the XKs or XJs, and will toe out too much, thus the inner edge goes away. When in doubt, get a specialist who does jags on a regular basis, or suck it up and pay a little extra for a dealer alignment. It'll be worth it. Of course, if you still have old tires, why bother. But, when you get new tires, definitely consider my advice.
Don't forget the sway bar bushings...they go quickly too.
Don't forget the sway bar bushings...they go quickly too.
#44
03-18-2010, 12:49 PM
Follow up on getting rid of the shakes. (Sounds like an alcoholic subtitle)
The new Michelin Pilot Sport A/S'swere "rebalanced" using a Hunter GSP9700 RoadForce balancer. This machine balances while the tire is forced against a rotating drum w/ 1500lbs of pressure, duplicating real world conditions. Sophisticated technology checks for both wheel and tire runout, and other vibration inducing factors.
All of the four (4) tires wereout of balance. Two were so far off that the tire/wheel combinations were unmounted and clocked to more evenlymatch individual tire and wheel discrepencies. One tire was out-of-round beyond spec and will be exchanged by TireRack.
I will never again use anybalancing method except this type of RoadForce weighted procedure. Even with the out-of-round tire still on the rear, the car is 100% smoother at the steering wheel. As I have seen on other posts, these cars are super sensitive to the slightest of wheel imbalances.
With the front wheel shimmy fixed, it is now ever more apparent thata good deal ofchassis shake isgoing to be ever present. I am not used to driving cars with so much body flex in the platforms.I wouldlike to see what kind of fix can be done to strengthen the bodies on these verts. I have an idea that the door latch could be improved upon. I can were amore solid fit between the door and unibody couldtighten up the center structure of the car. Anyone heard of this idea before? gordo
The new Michelin Pilot Sport A/S'swere "rebalanced" using a Hunter GSP9700 RoadForce balancer. This machine balances while the tire is forced against a rotating drum w/ 1500lbs of pressure, duplicating real world conditions. Sophisticated technology checks for both wheel and tire runout, and other vibration inducing factors.
All of the four (4) tires wereout of balance. Two were so far off that the tire/wheel combinations were unmounted and clocked to more evenlymatch individual tire and wheel discrepencies. One tire was out-of-round beyond spec and will be exchanged by TireRack.
I will never again use anybalancing method except this type of RoadForce weighted procedure. Even with the out-of-round tire still on the rear, the car is 100% smoother at the steering wheel. As I have seen on other posts, these cars are super sensitive to the slightest of wheel imbalances.
With the front wheel shimmy fixed, it is now ever more apparent thata good deal ofchassis shake isgoing to be ever present. I am not used to driving cars with so much body flex in the platforms.I wouldlike to see what kind of fix can be done to strengthen the bodies on these verts. I have an idea that the door latch could be improved upon. I can were amore solid fit between the door and unibody couldtighten up the center structure of the car. Anyone heard of this idea before? gordo
#45
03-18-2010, 06:39 PM
You will need to disassemble the entire Wishbone/upper and lower swing arm in order to press the old ball joints out and the new one's in. An easier solution is to purchase the lower wishbone with ball joint for $185 ea (local carquest price) . Do both at the same time and while you are at it the uppers are easily replaced. Be careful when compressing the springs.. (Find/borrow the tool if you can) [I made a tool using threaded bar stock, drill stock, and a couple of bolts and large washers]. Be extra careful pressing the bushings in.. you do NOT want to compromise the integrity by tearing the rubber..
The parts for the front suspension (Naked ball joints) are only around $250 US. The lower wishbones assembled are $110 ea (http://www.britishparts.co.uk/.sc/ms...g-Suspension/3)... I ordered these and they NEVER arrived. I found a local machine shop to press the ball joints for $150.. When the job was over with no alignment... the car ran wonderful and has required minimal alignment change.. Tire wear is even... I just wish I had changed the wheel bearings while I had it all apart. I did the job over three evenings, (I'm an electrical engineer.. NOT a mechanic).
The parts for the front suspension (Naked ball joints) are only around $250 US. The lower wishbones assembled are $110 ea (http://www.britishparts.co.uk/.sc/ms...g-Suspension/3)... I ordered these and they NEVER arrived. I found a local machine shop to press the ball joints for $150.. When the job was over with no alignment... the car ran wonderful and has required minimal alignment change.. Tire wear is even... I just wish I had changed the wheel bearings while I had it all apart. I did the job over three evenings, (I'm an electrical engineer.. NOT a mechanic).
Last edited by ghanks; 03-18-2010 at 06:42 PM.
#46
07-20-2010, 07:38 AM
Okay, here's my situation...
Before I start tearing apart the front end of my car, I want to figure out (hopefully) what's wrong with it first.
As far as I know, nothing has been done to the front end suspension since 2002...so that's a caveat right there.
I've put about 1000 miles on the car since buying it. It drives straight and true...treat wear on the tires is even...everything is fine. However, when I hit a bump, there's some slight after-shimmy that I can feel in the wheel.
What's the issue that I have? I suspect lower ball joints, but the more I read, the more I'd like to get confirmation before I go down that path.
Any help is appreciated!
Dave
Before I start tearing apart the front end of my car, I want to figure out (hopefully) what's wrong with it first.
As far as I know, nothing has been done to the front end suspension since 2002...so that's a caveat right there.
I've put about 1000 miles on the car since buying it. It drives straight and true...treat wear on the tires is even...everything is fine. However, when I hit a bump, there's some slight after-shimmy that I can feel in the wheel.
What's the issue that I have? I suspect lower ball joints, but the more I read, the more I'd like to get confirmation before I go down that path.
Any help is appreciated!
Dave
#47
07-20-2010, 08:52 AM
Member
Dave,
Just a thought-
Do you have access to a hydraulic press?
If you're going to tear apart your front end, you could replace the items that chronically wear out:
Upper shock mounts
Lower shock bushings
Upper and Lower ball joints
Upper and Lower Suspension arm bushings
... and while you're in there:
stabilizer arm links
stabilizer arm bushings
steering rack bushings
steering tie rod ends
This basically gets you a new front suspension.
Total parts cost ~ $520 from
http://www.britishparts.co.uk/.sc/ms...ing-Suspension
Just a thought-
Do you have access to a hydraulic press?
If you're going to tear apart your front end, you could replace the items that chronically wear out:
Upper shock mounts
Lower shock bushings
Upper and Lower ball joints
Upper and Lower Suspension arm bushings
... and while you're in there:
stabilizer arm links
stabilizer arm bushings
steering rack bushings
steering tie rod ends
This basically gets you a new front suspension.
Total parts cost ~ $520 from
http://www.britishparts.co.uk/.sc/ms...ing-Suspension
#48
07-20-2010, 09:06 AM
Dave,
Just a thought-
Do you have access to a hydraulic press?
If you're going to tear apart your front end, you could replace the items that chronically wear out:
Upper shock mounts
Lower shock bushings
Upper and Lower ball joints
Upper and Lower Suspension arm bushings
... and while you're in there:
stabilizer arm links
stabilizer arm bushings
steering rack bushings
steering tie rod ends
This basically gets you a new front suspension.
Total parts cost ~ $520 from
http://www.britishparts.co.uk/.sc/ms...ing-Suspension
Just a thought-
Do you have access to a hydraulic press?
If you're going to tear apart your front end, you could replace the items that chronically wear out:
Upper shock mounts
Lower shock bushings
Upper and Lower ball joints
Upper and Lower Suspension arm bushings
... and while you're in there:
stabilizer arm links
stabilizer arm bushings
steering rack bushings
steering tie rod ends
This basically gets you a new front suspension.
Total parts cost ~ $520 from
http://www.britishparts.co.uk/.sc/ms...ing-Suspension
Unfortunately, I do not have access to a hydraulic press...most of my tools have been accumulated to work on my 1929 Model A Fords (screwdriver, cresecent wrench, and big hammer...)
so I'm on the short end of a plethora of tools...though I always enjoy an excuse to buy more (who doesn't???) I'd love to find a mechanic in the area that would do the job...or better yet, allow me to assist in doing the job so I can learn how to do it the first time...I don't mind paying for help in either beer or cash...
Dave
#49
07-20-2010, 10:18 AM
Veteran member
I had a similar 'feel', and had to replace the lower control arm bushings to correct it. Parts are cheap, the labor to pull 'em and replace them are what gets ya.
Consider purchasing the whole lower wishbone to save on labor. $500 each side (front and rear arms) from the dealer, and it includes all lower, front and rear bushings. Then all you have to do is bolt each up. The uppers don't take as much abuse I have found.
To put that into perspective, I did all bushings individually (including uppers), paid $300 for parts, then another $600 in labor to an indy shop that took WAY too long, tore a bushing pressing one lower back in (and tried to get it past me), and then had to go back in to fix it. This was the best labor price I found, and now I know why. Next quote I received was $1100.
If I were to do it over, I'd just do it with control arm replacements instead.
Remember, if you buy dealer, check out our three sponsors that deal with parts, we get discounts for being forum members, and you can score free shipping with a couple of them also.
Consider purchasing the whole lower wishbone to save on labor. $500 each side (front and rear arms) from the dealer, and it includes all lower, front and rear bushings. Then all you have to do is bolt each up. The uppers don't take as much abuse I have found.
To put that into perspective, I did all bushings individually (including uppers), paid $300 for parts, then another $600 in labor to an indy shop that took WAY too long, tore a bushing pressing one lower back in (and tried to get it past me), and then had to go back in to fix it. This was the best labor price I found, and now I know why. Next quote I received was $1100.
If I were to do it over, I'd just do it with control arm replacements instead.
Remember, if you buy dealer, check out our three sponsors that deal with parts, we get discounts for being forum members, and you can score free shipping with a couple of them also.
#50
07-20-2010, 10:30 AM
Member
#52
07-20-2010, 12:20 PM
Actually, found a place locally that has one on sale for $129.99...BUT...where the heck would I put it afterwards? Maybe I could get rid of some of my wife's boxes of Christmas decorations and store it in the new empty spot...or I could just pay someone to do it for me and not spend the next month in the doghouse...
#53
07-20-2010, 12:30 PM
Member
... oh now H2O
... you buy the press new or used, save a TON of cash on labor by doing the job yourself, then if you don't want the press (and I can't imagine why not as you've saved enough to cover the cost a few times over) put it right back on ebay or craigslist.
... and ... I will stress this ... AND you get the sheer joy of conquering the suspension gremlin. You are king, the big kahuna, the head cheese ... er maybe not the head cheese, but I digress.
And you get a better workout than you ever got with the treadmill or bowflex, while actually accomplishiong something.
... you buy the press new or used, save a TON of cash on labor by doing the job yourself, then if you don't want the press (and I can't imagine why not as you've saved enough to cover the cost a few times over) put it right back on ebay or craigslist.
... and ... I will stress this ... AND you get the sheer joy of conquering the suspension gremlin. You are king, the big kahuna, the head cheese ... er maybe not the head cheese, but I digress.
And you get a better workout than you ever got with the treadmill or bowflex, while actually accomplishiong something.
#54
07-20-2010, 01:45 PM
Veteran member
My luck I'd damage the damn arms, aren't they aluminum and very easy to bend?...then where will I be? $250 for 1/2 of the lower arm, $300 for the press (if I don't beat it out of frustration) plus I gotta get someone to come pick my butt up because I now can't drive anywhere. I could go on, but you get my meaning. 
#55
07-20-2010, 02:48 PM
Member
#57
07-20-2010, 08:04 PM
Member
#59
06-22-2011, 08:36 AM
Senior Member
Just throwing my 2 cents in here
But MOST tires are not trued and out of round.
I have found that Pirelli's are terrible but I continue to use them because my tire guy has a tire lathe. Once all my tires are trued (he charges $20 a tire), I never have problems. In fact I have had my jag up to 140MPH for a burst and never a shimmy!
But MOST tires are not trued and out of round.
I have found that Pirelli's are terrible but I continue to use them because my tire guy has a tire lathe. Once all my tires are trued (he charges $20 a tire), I never have problems. In fact I have had my jag up to 140MPH for a burst and never a shimmy!
#60
06-14-2012, 10:04 AM
Junior Member
Join Date: Jun 2012
Location: Connecticut
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Steering Wheel Shimmy!
My 1999 XK8 Convertable has an agravating shimmy side to side vibration in the sterring and the car itself at around 60 to 75 MPH. It dissapears at times and runs smooth. I have rotated tires and rebalanced them. I find it hard to think it would be an alignment issue considering it comes and goes. Could this be wheel bearings, struts? Im stuck. Help
Mark
Mark