Whine & P0400 + Reality = useless repair + no solution yet
#1
Whine & P0400 + Reality = useless repair + no solution yet
Dear all,
I have written about the P0400 code I was getting and although a new EGR Valve was installed last December, the CEL came up during my first drive and my local Jaguar Dealer/Workshop said they need to replace the EGR Valve (again!).
I told them - specifically - about other possible causes for this, but they were adamant that the EGR Valve was the culprit.
So they changed it (without cost for me - so I was fine with it)..again.
And today, AGAIN.. the horrible, horrible orange Engine symbol popped up once more (anyone else really dreads this light as much as me?) and when I checked with my OSD2 app: P0400 "EGR "A" Flow"
So I was tracking my Fuel Trims today and although I tried to read up on all the information available on this great forum I still canīt figure out if my records show something extraordinary, faulty, worrisome, or if the readings are fine?
I attach two of those readings (in one excel file; two tabs) and appreciate ANY comments/feedback on them.
What I did notice is something else. Whenever this code is popping up, I can hear a rather irritating and high-pitched whine whenever the RPM drops below 1K.
It does not happen, when I rev the engine above 1K, but you can hear it in idle and sometimes even shortly after I have switched the engine off.
I recorded this sound with my phone and have attached the sound clip as well.
Please remember Iīm more of a "Top Gear Engineer - ambitious, but rubbish", but to me, that suggests an air leak. Something sucks in air and produces this whistle.
But hey! Thatīs why Iīm posting this: any pointers or even "how to fix this" recommendations are hugely appreciated.
Most pressingly: I plan to go on a two day trip with this car starting tomorrow - any dangers involved? :/
Thank you all,
Berglmir
I have written about the P0400 code I was getting and although a new EGR Valve was installed last December, the CEL came up during my first drive and my local Jaguar Dealer/Workshop said they need to replace the EGR Valve (again!).
I told them - specifically - about other possible causes for this, but they were adamant that the EGR Valve was the culprit.
So they changed it (without cost for me - so I was fine with it)..again.
And today, AGAIN.. the horrible, horrible orange Engine symbol popped up once more (anyone else really dreads this light as much as me?) and when I checked with my OSD2 app: P0400 "EGR "A" Flow"
So I was tracking my Fuel Trims today and although I tried to read up on all the information available on this great forum I still canīt figure out if my records show something extraordinary, faulty, worrisome, or if the readings are fine?
I attach two of those readings (in one excel file; two tabs) and appreciate ANY comments/feedback on them.
What I did notice is something else. Whenever this code is popping up, I can hear a rather irritating and high-pitched whine whenever the RPM drops below 1K.
It does not happen, when I rev the engine above 1K, but you can hear it in idle and sometimes even shortly after I have switched the engine off.
I recorded this sound with my phone and have attached the sound clip as well.
Please remember Iīm more of a "Top Gear Engineer - ambitious, but rubbish", but to me, that suggests an air leak. Something sucks in air and produces this whistle.
But hey! Thatīs why Iīm posting this: any pointers or even "how to fix this" recommendations are hugely appreciated.
Most pressingly: I plan to go on a two day trip with this car starting tomorrow - any dangers involved? :/
Thank you all,
Berglmir
#2
I'm not an Excel or Windows guy but unless the trims are as posted so many many times you've a problem. If the noise might be air sucked in you've a HUGE problem as normal leaks can't be heard.
Any shop that can't cope with something so incredibly basic for OBD given it's 20 years old ought to be sued and shut down.
Any shop that can't cope with something so incredibly basic for OBD given it's 20 years old ought to be sued and shut down.
#3
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#4
Average Speed most of the times, going up to about 100 m/h once.
Thanks for your feedback.
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#8
If you have an EGR code, double check the accordion steel pipe between the exhaust manifold and the EGR valve (this is how the valve gets exhaust gas). It is known to develop leaks/cracks. It is in the general area behind/below the throttle body. These cracks also contribute to air leaks and high fuel trims.
Remember, Fuel Trims are a function of rpm and engine load. So, visually, it is more of a "surface" or elevation map, with rpm and Load as coordinates. This is certainly not a single number that gets averaged out over the duration of a trip. The only "averaging" is that, for a given rpm and Load, the Long Term trim gets updated by the average Short Term trim at that same rpm and Load every few minutes (2 minutes, if memory serves).
As already pointed out, start with idle Long Term trims, and bring them down to below 5 by plugging every air leak. As you plug leaks, these trims should come down, starting with negative short term trims.
Remember, Fuel Trims are a function of rpm and engine load. So, visually, it is more of a "surface" or elevation map, with rpm and Load as coordinates. This is certainly not a single number that gets averaged out over the duration of a trip. The only "averaging" is that, for a given rpm and Load, the Long Term trim gets updated by the average Short Term trim at that same rpm and Load every few minutes (2 minutes, if memory serves).
As already pointed out, start with idle Long Term trims, and bring them down to below 5 by plugging every air leak. As you plug leaks, these trims should come down, starting with negative short term trims.
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michaelh (07-03-2018)
#9
If you have an EGR code, double check the accordion steel pipe between the exhaust manifold and the EGR valve (this is how the valve gets exhaust gas). It is known to develop leaks/cracks. It is in the general area behind/below the throttle body. These cracks also contribute to air leaks and high fuel trims.
Remember, Fuel Trims are a function of rpm and engine load. So, visually, it is more of a "surface" or elevation map, with rpm and Load as coordinates. This is certainly not a single number that gets averaged out over the duration of a trip. The only "averaging" is that, for a given rpm and Load, the Long Term trim gets updated by the average Short Term trim at that same rpm and Load every few minutes (2 minutes, if memory serves).
As already pointed out, start with idle Long Term trims, and bring them down to below 5 by plugging every air leak. As you plug leaks, these trims should come down, starting with negative short term trims.
Remember, Fuel Trims are a function of rpm and engine load. So, visually, it is more of a "surface" or elevation map, with rpm and Load as coordinates. This is certainly not a single number that gets averaged out over the duration of a trip. The only "averaging" is that, for a given rpm and Load, the Long Term trim gets updated by the average Short Term trim at that same rpm and Load every few minutes (2 minutes, if memory serves).
As already pointed out, start with idle Long Term trims, and bring them down to below 5 by plugging every air leak. As you plug leaks, these trims should come down, starting with negative short term trims.
The whining sound comes exactly from where you have indicated: behind/below the throttle body.
My - proper - workshop took a look at it today and tested it with a spray - there was a definite drop in rpm, when sprayed in that region.
We also test-drove the car today (quite hard) and the P0400 never showed itīs ugly head.
I also tried to reproduce the MIL by following the described test procedure i.e.
"Engine at normal operating temperature;normal varied driving for 3 minutes; 37 75 mph (60 120 km/h); 1300 2500rpm; then decelerate at fuel cut-off (foot off accelerator pedal)
Surface elevation < 8,000 ft (2,438 m)" - no "success".
Iīll check and update you all, when
a) the whine has stopped and
b) the Fuel Trim levels have normalized and
c) if my P0400 friend has visited me again after a) & b)
Thanks again,
Berglmir
#10
Just got back from a family vacation and can get back to those niggles.
Before I do yet another question:
When you stop the car (red light; idle) what does your "current mpg" screen say?
Mine goes up to 9 mpg (99.9 l/100km)
I drove mostly in town and averaged 10 mpg - I donīt mind bad economy, if itīs MEANT to be that way.
Thanks for your feedback guys (and ladies).
Before I do yet another question:
When you stop the car (red light; idle) what does your "current mpg" screen say?
Mine goes up to 9 mpg (99.9 l/100km)
I drove mostly in town and averaged 10 mpg - I donīt mind bad economy, if itīs MEANT to be that way.
Thanks for your feedback guys (and ladies).
#11
Just got back from a family vacation and can get back to those niggles.
Before I do yet another question:
When you stop the car (red light; idle) what does your "current mpg" screen say?
Mine goes up to 9 mpg (99.9 l/100km)
I drove mostly in town and averaged 10 mpg - I donīt mind bad economy, if itīs MEANT to be that way.
Thanks for your feedback guys (and ladies).
Before I do yet another question:
When you stop the car (red light; idle) what does your "current mpg" screen say?
Mine goes up to 9 mpg (99.9 l/100km)
I drove mostly in town and averaged 10 mpg - I donīt mind bad economy, if itīs MEANT to be that way.
Thanks for your feedback guys (and ladies).
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